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The Great PO/5Y Debate

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Old 5th Nov 2007, 14:50
  #41 (permalink)  
 
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Well, my goodness. Nothing decided huh? I just listened to the MEC announcement and guess what. No decision with more hearings on the way. I can't wait to here the Atlas VARS to get his take on it. I bet it is different than Bobbs.
My point here is to show that both sides are a little bit self-serving. I am guilty (being a Poloroid, furloughed and working someplace else but still a Poloroid). Personally, what happened or not happened is now in front of an ALPA committee. Whatever is decided is decided. Big Deal! As for the other grievances; nothing will happen and when it does, then try to defend the decision pro/or com.

Captvac, I got a private message coming to you in a minute. Got some interesting information.
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Old 5th Nov 2007, 18:29
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cptvac
"He" wasn't wrong at all...

What Cptvac posted is that the resolutions were not adopted. They weren't.
Your implication then and now was that it was voted down and not put on hold.
Neither resolution was on the agenda. They were put forth as "Emergency" resolutions late in the day after the Polar Representative was told there was no more Polar business worth staying for, and left. Typical. Even Prater was blindsided (and offended). As was the majority of the EC.
I'm a little surprised about that considering a number of the Executive Committee requested the last minute resolution from D. Bourne. As to Prater being blind sided, I doubt that considering he new of these requests quite some time ago. Maybe he just wanted to look surprised for some of the collective at hand.
The "Emergency" resolution aimed at derailing Polar Crewmembers legal efforts in defense of their contract was put "on hold" until January... when Polars' legal battles will be finished. Some "Emergency"...guess the EC did not share Mr. Bournes' urgency.
No, the Executive Council just letting the mediator of the arbitrations solve the problem for them. Then join along with it backing up the result. Pretty typical.
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Old 5th Nov 2007, 19:09
  #43 (permalink)  
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Folks, I hope you don't mind but I've closed the long running Atlas STN thread & re-named this one.

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Old 5th Nov 2007, 20:35
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Again Merc,

These were put forward as "Emergency" resolutions and aimed solely at damaging the Polar legal process. They will not have any effect, and the backdoor nature of their introduction was just another confirmation of the Atlas MECs' collusion against the Polar Crewmembers.

The legal process will be seen through, whatever the outcome. Polar Crewmembers, under advice of counsel, are defending their CBA against a coercive Company and their Union lapdogs (uh, that'd be you).

"K", I will agree, the EC has a phenomenal knack for passing the buck and a marked inability to say "Go to he!!" when appropriate. As in this case. But they surely did blow off, for now, the "Bourne Emergency".
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Old 6th Nov 2007, 15:09
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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Why captvac, you don't really think that do you. Bourne in bed with AAWH and their minion Cato, say it ain't so........ Look at the great CBA they negotiated, look at the great deal they're getting in STN. And let's not talk about the gateway travel. Man your off base on that one. You owe an apology. heh-heh

Last edited by layinlow; 6th Nov 2007 at 15:28. Reason: correction
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Old 6th Nov 2007, 20:17
  #46 (permalink)  
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Folks, I hope you don't mind but I've closed the long running Atlas STN thread & re-named this one.
I suspect that a lot of Atlas and Polar crews wish that you would close this one too. So many being made to look so stupid by so few.
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Old 6th Nov 2007, 20:43
  #47 (permalink)  
 
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Smile

It is very entertaining; leave it up
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Old 7th Nov 2007, 00:09
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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Bourne in bed with AAWH and their minion Cato, say it ain't so........ Look at the great CBA they negotiated, look at the great deal they're getting in STN. And let's not talk about the gateway travel. Man your off base on that one. You owe an apology. heh-heh
hmmmm... lets see. Polar has won a single grievance. They have never actually filed any grievance other than scope grievances. The one grievance they won caused the actual firing of all but a handful of FEs. Their crew force is less than half what it was when this MEC and Hair took over. They are down to 5 aircraft (the -200 and 416MC belong to Atlas). Atlas pilots will never be wearing a Polar uniform - but I am certain, if they want to keep flying for AAWW, that the Polaroids WILL be wearing an Atlas uniform.

So tell me again which leadership is the right one?

....and what happened today - was that noise we all heard the sound of the Judge actually spanking Bobb?

So many being made to look so stupid by so few
742 - it is much worse than you think. Of all the Polaroid screen names that post here, there are actually only two people doing so. At least Merc and I are different people and only post under one screen name apiece.
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Old 7th Nov 2007, 04:10
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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I'm a third Atlas poster, but sitting on the sidelines for now. Merc gets the info long before I do.

I have to agree with Merc on the average Polaroids feelings lately. I've had some deadheaders and jumpseaters and to a person, they say they know nothing. Most knew little of the multiple processes currently going on? They had quit a bit to say about the union, but posting here would just stir the pot and prove nothing.

Suffice it to say, they weren't happy. I'm not saying everyone at Atlas is happy with union activities either.

As other have pointed out, it is out of our hands and up to the courts and arbitrators.

BTW, when was the last time the Polar MEC came to terms with anyone without an arbitrator or judge making the decision for them?
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Old 7th Nov 2007, 12:48
  #50 (permalink)  
 
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Got some new info.

The alternative hearing instead of just suing the Polar MEC and Strike Breakers Committee has closed. Decisions to follow. Only one Polar guy showed up and he ended up testifying for the Atlas crew members along with Duane Woerth ex ALPA president. Guess they will make the Polar "snake list." I'll try and get the transcripts. I have the Atlas presentation, but I have to work at getting it up on here first. Kind of a funky format that I'm having trouble converting for web display. I'll try and get that out later. Don't have any physical evidence offered by Polar. Just testimony from the one that attended that would be on the transcripts. That was in favor of Atlas anyway.

Lets see, the Polar MEC forms a strike breakers committee and files about 180 Article VIII's on Atlas crewmembers which fails. At a later hearing brought by those accused by Polar, the Polar MEC doesn't have the time or the will to shake someone loose to attend and testify for the Polar MEC or the Strike Breakers Committee. Not even the time to have someone testify by phone which was acceptable. Pretty much says it all. Complete BS used by Bobb Henderson to defray attention from his mistakes and put it on Atlas crew members.

I believe the arbitration to find if the the Company merger grievance can be put into priority above the others due to the merger has concluded. Arbiter findings are not out yet. That will probably be a while.

Polar filed another grievance over the Holden arbitration trying to get A/C and jobs back to Polar from Atlas again.

Here is the recent Atlas VARS Click here

Here it is in RealAudio
IN REALAUDIO

Didn't have time to record the Polar VARS, but you can dial it here 1 800 253 5671

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Old 7th Nov 2007, 13:31
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Wouldn't a merger with one CBA ensure all crew members have jobs and possibly create opportunity for more jobs instead of tying up the legal process?
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Old 7th Nov 2007, 15:43
  #52 (permalink)  
 
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VARS

Oh Please,
Bobb has used the Atlas VARS message against Atlas pilots whenever he pleases. They are not secure and often times the company calls them and listens to them. ALL union members know this and understand that the VARS messages are used to get a message across, not just to the union members but often times to other people in the negotiation process. So you might as well give that one a rest LIL!
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 12:53
  #53 (permalink)  
 
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There is a difference of listening to a VARS and putting the number on a public forum. Just how many do you think reads this thread that is not a Polar or Atlas crewmember? How many do you thinks called? For the first time, I had a busy signal for about 30 minutes.
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 14:09
  #54 (permalink)  
 
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Personally, I hope everyone in the industry calls. Then they can compare all the downloads of facts here to what Bobb says and what the Atlas MEC says.

A public airing out might keep everyone here more honest.

Since this forum was used to publish confidential information of crew members on an illegal scab list with no denunciation by the Polar MEC (Bobb H. in particular) about the act, let alone him not taking any responsibility for the confidential information being leaked by him or his committee personnel in itself tells me he condoned it. I'm sorry, a statement of "I can't control all of my crew members" by Bobb is just a poor excuse and poor leadership in his responsibilities indicating he condoned it also. Not showing up, calling in, or being represented at the recent Alternative Hearing on that list is another. So much easier to scream "SCAB" and list names than prove it the right way. Kind of like being asked "when did you stop beating your wife and kids" of those accused of being scabs.

This kind of behavior continues on many other subjects already discussed on this thread and others.

Last edited by mercpc9; 8th Nov 2007 at 14:27.
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 17:11
  #55 (permalink)  
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Alright, the scab list may prove to be an embarrassment as well. . . if so, what would it take for Council 24 to rectify this?


Personal 5Y blast's of Council 24's elected members ("This kind of behavior continues on many other subjects") are nothing more than boring moans of ineffectual whining. . . We elected Bobb H. You did not. . therefore what can you do about it other than cry?.

Understand that few Polaroid's (if any) are unhappy with him. Bobb H may be a Stalin to 5Y, but to Polar he is Abe Lincoln.
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 22:12
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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L-38, boy are you gonna be disappointed when the truth is known and/or believed by the average Polaroid.
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Old 13th Nov 2007, 18:09
  #57 (permalink)  
 
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So how'd the Horowitz arb go for you guys vac? Any news?

Last edited by WhaleFR8; 13th Nov 2007 at 18:22.
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Old 13th Nov 2007, 18:27
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The answer is no answer, yet
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Old 13th Nov 2007, 19:21
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Really? I had heard differently.
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Old 13th Nov 2007, 22:36
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Yes, theres been some news.
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