British Airways - CC Industrial Relations Mk VI
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Bath Road
Posts: 266
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Papillon - Agree with you. They might not be able to ballot over New Fleet should it come to that stage but many don't see it that way. Many are still convinced BASSA is in charge and running the game. Truth is BASSA is holding on to whatever it has to survive and it's not going well.
Chuchinchow - It was a sarcastic example of how inflexible things can be at BA when they are controlled and run by BASSA! I could have chosen DFW, IAH or MIA instead but LAX was the first thing which came to my mind.
Keel Beam - There's no mention in the CSD's job description which says that they should be on a trolley and this is why many are against in. I could only think of - because I haven't worked on a flight for a year - that the loud CSD's are the ones who tend to sit on their backside in their office and munch food and watching movies. The newer CSD's are generally very good - some of the old CSD's are too - and probably don't mind it that much.
Chuchinchow - It was a sarcastic example of how inflexible things can be at BA when they are controlled and run by BASSA! I could have chosen DFW, IAH or MIA instead but LAX was the first thing which came to my mind.
Keel Beam - There's no mention in the CSD's job description which says that they should be on a trolley and this is why many are against in. I could only think of - because I haven't worked on a flight for a year - that the loud CSD's are the ones who tend to sit on their backside in their office and munch food and watching movies. The newer CSD's are generally very good - some of the old CSD's are too - and probably don't mind it that much.
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Bath Road
Posts: 266
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Crew complements? Let's have a look at BASSA's view of this, shall we?
1. They agreed to LGW SF with reduced crewing levels a couple of years ago.
2. Certain LHR flights thought of as demanding would leave with an extra crew member - funny some of those destinations were CPT, MRU and MIA - all leisure destinations.
3. LHR crew claiming LGW can work with reduced crewing levels because they are a LEISURE base with a different clientele - which contradicts their stance on having an extra crew member on certain routes.
4. BA removes a crew member - BASSA all of the sudden says it has an impact on safety and health of both crew and passengers.
How can they possibly claim that it's dangerous and unhealthy to operate with less crew when they - BASSA - signed the dotted line for LGW SF? There's another contradiction. It's pure incompetence IMHO. Did they not for a second think "Oh, hey. Do you think they will ask why we agreed to Single Fleet down at Gatwick some years ago? Naw! Never. They ain't that clever!"?
1. They agreed to LGW SF with reduced crewing levels a couple of years ago.
2. Certain LHR flights thought of as demanding would leave with an extra crew member - funny some of those destinations were CPT, MRU and MIA - all leisure destinations.
3. LHR crew claiming LGW can work with reduced crewing levels because they are a LEISURE base with a different clientele - which contradicts their stance on having an extra crew member on certain routes.
4. BA removes a crew member - BASSA all of the sudden says it has an impact on safety and health of both crew and passengers.
How can they possibly claim that it's dangerous and unhealthy to operate with less crew when they - BASSA - signed the dotted line for LGW SF? There's another contradiction. It's pure incompetence IMHO. Did they not for a second think "Oh, hey. Do you think they will ask why we agreed to Single Fleet down at Gatwick some years ago? Naw! Never. They ain't that clever!"?
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Netherlands
Age: 58
Posts: 195
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Netherlands
Age: 58
Posts: 195
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Or something like that...
But seriously, when does Unite say to the team in charge "sorry guys, but we need some new perspective here!"?
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Surrey
Posts: 471
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I can be a tit too, ask HiFlyer and Tiramisu and may I again apologise for some of my posts last week.
Apology accepted, thank you. Vey big of you to do it publicly
.Onwards and upwards.
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Gatwick
Posts: 1,980
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
henkybaby
The ballot will be the first indication of what direction the Unite/BASSA relationship will go. It is going to be about numbers. What is the total number of crew, against turnout of members and the result. I do not know the total Unite membership now.
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Netherlands
Age: 58
Posts: 195
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yeah, got that. But my question was if there is some sort of control mechanism within Unite that monitors if a certain team goes 'overboard'. I mean, this hurts Unite more than it hurts BA and Unite has more irons in more fires. Are the action leaders in this kind of scenario 'rogue' or controlled?
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: England
Posts: 114
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi Keel beam
As for CSDs having to work in the cabin, it is probably in their job description to do their work, and if deemed necessary, do the work that those junior to them have to do, (it certainly is in my job description!)
I totally agree with your comments about adjusting/organising things differently onboard since the reduction in crewing levels.
I just do things in a slightly different order. If the load is high my first duty is to ensure the smooth delivery of product to Club World customers, when things quieten down I say 'hello' to First and our regular customers.
I don't find it a problem.
I don't always get things right, but wanting to, quickly helps to adjust and move on. Being organised and motivating your crew are central to making things work, just like any other leadership situation.
My thoughts on a previous post.
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Gatwick
Posts: 1,980
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There are enough alleged stories of unions selling the membership down the river, to say that, yes there is a point where a position could change. But again, that is down to numbers.
As was said earlier in the thread, every BASSA member must be in a position to evaluate the consequence of where the X went on the voting slip. This is in the members hands. The closer the percentage of NO/didn't vote or cant vote (non member) gets to 50% of the workforce, the more pressure will be put on the negotiators to seek a resolution without a stoppage.
It's all about how big your army is.
As was said earlier in the thread, every BASSA member must be in a position to evaluate the consequence of where the X went on the voting slip. This is in the members hands. The closer the percentage of NO/didn't vote or cant vote (non member) gets to 50% of the workforce, the more pressure will be put on the negotiators to seek a resolution without a stoppage.
It's all about how big your army is.
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: leafy suburbs
Posts: 308
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Clarified
Thank you for your input.
As Winstonsmith points out, it is the CSDs that sit on their backsides watching films (and be immediately ready to reset any seats that play up) that are probably shouting the loudest.
The sooner this debacle is sorted the sooner we can all get on with our respective jobs and get
BA to where it should be - The No 1 carrier
Thank you for your input.
As Winstonsmith points out, it is the CSDs that sit on their backsides watching films (and be immediately ready to reset any seats that play up) that are probably shouting the loudest.
The sooner this debacle is sorted the sooner we can all get on with our respective jobs and get
BA to where it should be - The No 1 carrier
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There's been little consideration of what would (would, not will, I imagine) be the scenario/aftermath of a No vote? Just musing...any ideas of how the situation would be resolved quickly then? Or would matters go on festering?
Litebulbs,
The BASSA lot wouldn't dream of resigning - far too many perks and 'practises' to lose. Loss of face or embarrasment doesn't even come in to their lexicon (which is pretty limited anyway ....) so they won't resign. They will have to be 'fired' in some manner.
The BASSA lot wouldn't dream of resigning - far too many perks and 'practises' to lose. Loss of face or embarrasment doesn't even come in to their lexicon (which is pretty limited anyway ....) so they won't resign. They will have to be 'fired' in some manner.
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Outside the EU on a small Island
Age: 79
Posts: 529
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Litebulbs
Hypothetical discussion until tomorrow however.
Still, it's nice to talk on PPRuNe. Shame it didn't happen in other places when it really mattered.
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Barking
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So place your bets for tomorrow.
IMHO, about 70% in favour from a 70% turnout (of overall crew, as opposed to BASSA members), so somewhere near 50% in favour. Not a strong position to be in. That said, I could be totally wrong.
Any bets?
IMHO, about 70% in favour from a 70% turnout (of overall crew, as opposed to BASSA members), so somewhere near 50% in favour. Not a strong position to be in. That said, I could be totally wrong.
Any bets?