British Airways - CC Industrial Relations & Negotiations
Join Date: Dec 2009
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For someone who voted yes and fully believed it would either go to a strike or negotiations this was an outcome I never expected. I have been a member with BASSA since -95 and they have messed up before but this was both shocking and unexpecting. But I have to admit that I am very humiliated over this outcome as it's a slap in the face on many of us. It's hard to believe that they didn't check it up properly but it was probably a move from BA to defer the VR leaving because they knew it would cause a problem with the ballot. All is fair in love and war I guess.
To say that all of us have been mislead by BASSA down the road can be discussed. I think the reason for the high outcome was actually as a protest towards the management and not necessary the imposition itself (as some on here seem to claim). Not everybody voted in favor of a strike simply because of BA taking off a crew member. There's more to it.
If you don't work for BA it can be difficult to understand how the management and atmosphere are and where this company is headed. If you work for BA surely you couldn't say that our management has ever been completely honest. Look at what is happening to this company and don't just blame it on IFCE.
The imposition has caused a lot of trouble at LHR. Service takes forever to complete and it's not only about losing 1 crew member. On some routes like LAS, MIA and MRU we have even lost 2 crew. I just did a LAS myself and being 10 crew on 3 class 777 is not easy! On my previous trip to GRU it took over 3 hours to complete a full service in Club which is hardly fair to our customers, is it?
I'm glad it works down at LGW. Maybe you could give some tips and hints in CCNews on how to do it your way.
To say that all of us have been mislead by BASSA down the road can be discussed. I think the reason for the high outcome was actually as a protest towards the management and not necessary the imposition itself (as some on here seem to claim). Not everybody voted in favor of a strike simply because of BA taking off a crew member. There's more to it.
If you don't work for BA it can be difficult to understand how the management and atmosphere are and where this company is headed. If you work for BA surely you couldn't say that our management has ever been completely honest. Look at what is happening to this company and don't just blame it on IFCE.
The imposition has caused a lot of trouble at LHR. Service takes forever to complete and it's not only about losing 1 crew member. On some routes like LAS, MIA and MRU we have even lost 2 crew. I just did a LAS myself and being 10 crew on 3 class 777 is not easy! On my previous trip to GRU it took over 3 hours to complete a full service in Club which is hardly fair to our customers, is it?
I'm glad it works down at LGW. Maybe you could give some tips and hints in CCNews on how to do it your way.
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The madness on CF and BASSA forums has to be seen to be believed, with justifications ranging from 'The judge was bent' to 'This is a victory for BASSA'. What I think is more telling is that the beast has begun to turn on itself. Those members who are able to see the writing on the wall and dare to say so are villified by the awkward squad, who seem to think it's their right not only to abuse and threaten them but to take further unlawful industrial action on the 22nd. Fortunately, as we saw in court, BA have access to all of these forums and are not afraid to use this evidence. I know for a fact that one individual threatened has taken screen shots of all the threats and is willing to use them against the loonies. Whilst they are rabidly campaigning for pilots to be reported under EG102 for bullying they seem to be oblivious to the fact that they themselves are transgressing in a very serious way. BA have done the BASSA reps for bullying, now they'll start on their stormtroopers, and won't having lots of sacked crew make it oh so difficult for BASSA to keep track of who's entitled to vote in the next ballot.
Join Date: Nov 2009
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Yes but what has happend to the BASSA reps that were bullying .BA are still letting them get away with it .BA should sack them .That wasn't mentioned in The Daily Mail was it .
Join Date: Feb 2009
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I was listening to LBC radio yesterday. A long haul stewardess called Barbara had phoned in to say she had voted for the strike on the grounds of safety as she considered working one crew member down was less safe and she would not be able to give such a good service to her passengers.
Barbara, it is not for you to decide what is a safe level of crewing. Also it is not up to you to decide the standard for the level of service to your passengers.
You also said that BASSA had been negotiating hard on your behalf for 9 months and had offered a solution which would provide even more savings than BA had asked for. Do you really believe that?
Your protests were merely self serving although you used them to attempt to portray concern for your passengers. You sounded very sincere, as though you really believed that what you were saying was true. Let BA decide what is acceptable to passengers and let BA run the airline.
This is not intended to be an ante BA cabin crew rant. I work for BA and have a high regard for the professionalism of many of our cabin crew.
Barbara, it is not for you to decide what is a safe level of crewing. Also it is not up to you to decide the standard for the level of service to your passengers.
You also said that BASSA had been negotiating hard on your behalf for 9 months and had offered a solution which would provide even more savings than BA had asked for. Do you really believe that?
Your protests were merely self serving although you used them to attempt to portray concern for your passengers. You sounded very sincere, as though you really believed that what you were saying was true. Let BA decide what is acceptable to passengers and let BA run the airline.
This is not intended to be an ante BA cabin crew rant. I work for BA and have a high regard for the professionalism of many of our cabin crew.
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BB
I really cannot fathom how Lizanne is still in situ, can you imagine if this error was on the BA side, the noises from the BASSA camp ?? Still probably suits BA if she continues in situ, as the shambles will rumble on and the C*ck ups will keep coming.......
up big time.They are just not credible .
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romans44
Cabin crew are not adverse to changes but changes should come via means of negotiation and not imposition.
After nine months of no negotiations (and remember BASSA did not even attend the final three days of meetings because they would not sit in the same room as the CC89 reps) BA imposed.
How many times do we have to go over this, BA IMPOSED because BASSA would not NEGOTIATE.
Round and round in circles we go.
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Fork Handles
Oh and Otter thingy ad any others...sue away dahling its on the net and in BA lawyers grasp you Twunts
Last edited by ottergirl; 18th Dec 2009 at 17:01. Reason: Adding name
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Perhaps Mr Walsh will be able to ban Miss Malone from flying to and from LA on BA on the grounds that she is a threat to on board security.
Meanwhile, HMRC, who are possibly reading these pages, totally bog eyed at the amounts of allowances and money being tossed around, might like to make sure that her tax residence status is in order. And if she is, in fact a non UK resident for tax purposes, then what is she doing as the chair of a British union. If Ashcroft cannot be a peer because he is a tax resident of Belize...?
Meanwhile, HMRC, who are possibly reading these pages, totally bog eyed at the amounts of allowances and money being tossed around, might like to make sure that her tax residence status is in order. And if she is, in fact a non UK resident for tax purposes, then what is she doing as the chair of a British union. If Ashcroft cannot be a peer because he is a tax resident of Belize...?
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Just been chatting with a long-time mate who is LHR WW CC. She is so adamant that BASSA is the future it scared me. She flatly refuses to believe that they have done anything wrong and has swallowed the rhetoric from all the BASSA communiques - FFS, this is worrying. She wants to see WW and the company broken. FWIW, she is not dependent on her BA income, as she has other sources of cash flow. My good friend is a degree educated (1st class honours), ex customer service agent for a well known blue chipper.
This is really scary stuff going on here. trust me.
This is really scary stuff going on here. trust me.
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Originally Posted by TOM100
I really cannot fathom how Lizanne is still in situ,
Unfortunately it appears that there are very few crew who have a mind of their own.
In the Cloud Cuckooland that is CF, the facts have been so incredibly distorted that Malone appears to have played no part in the events of yesterdays court action. Even the crew that turned up in court played down Bassa's part in all of this and blamed the Unite lawyers.
One of the main sources for information available to crew is the crew forum, if anybody dares to post anything which can constrewed as slightly anti-bassa are shouted down by a pack of rabid dogs. Amusingly now some posters have started posting pro bassa support statements before any point they wish to make, just to keep the bullies at bay.
Firstly, just for anyone who doesn't know me, I would like to stress that I am totally pro Bassa and pro our fabulous reps.
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Alas the court ruling seems to have done little more than muddy the waters of the principle issue, which must be to the company's advantage.
CC are in a weaker position to negotiate effectively now than they were in just a few days ago.
Is there really much alternative to them capitulating and letting the company get its way?
CC are in a weaker position to negotiate effectively now than they were in just a few days ago.
Is there really much alternative to them capitulating and letting the company get its way?
Join Date: Nov 2009
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She has brought the companies name in to disrepute suspend her and withdraw her staff travel with immediate effect.
Then deal with the rest of the reps don't forget they have played their part in all of this .Then hopefully we can get this great airline back on it's feet.
Then deal with the rest of the reps don't forget they have played their part in all of this .Then hopefully we can get this great airline back on it's feet.
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Big Brutha - totally agree Lalalady is an absolute disgrace and should do like the rest of us and resign!
We made it known 5 days after the ballot that the VR people had papers and shouldn't - see my post on here on 22 Nov. Someone contacted the Union and asked why they had been sent ballot papers and the retort was "can't you see what we're trying to do for you?" Unbelievable. unprofessional and totally unacceptable.
And what I learnt recently was that 2 people had received ballots that shouldn't - one had left BA 2 years ago and the other 8 years ago! Ok Fume if it makes you feel better call me a liar, but if needed for a court case I could and would provide names!
This Union (?) has got to go. It is corrupt to the core, and now it has put us the cabin crew in a very precarious position. The travelling public hate us. In all my flying years I have always been proud to wear my uniform; now I feel nothing but shame.
However the tide is definitely turning. On my last pre-injunction trip the entire crew were prepared to cross the picket line and come to work. They feel extremely let down by the Union for letting our customers down over Xmas without our consent. Let me assure everyone on here that even though embarrassingly you see some CC with their head in the sand, Fume, WW etc, the majority genuinely care about the customers and I strongly believe that IF a strike had gone ahead, there would have been plenty of volunteers to work.
Additionally on my current trip they are all now talking about the stupidity of the Union, how they have cost us everything and gained us nothing. Many say they won't vote yes in another ballot. If Unite ballot again, I think it would be the final nail in the coffin.
Most crew just want to come to work and do what they signed up to do, serve the customers. We are not a money-grabbing, selfish lot (although I admit some like Lalalady are and have let us down). Please don't tar us all with the same brush. Mr Salmon, if you could give us another chance I am sure you would find a crew that have mellowed, have changed and are willing to do whatever it takes to bring the customers back. My crew on the last couple of trips certainly are.
Please customers, give us another chance, and help us to get rid of the one thing that prevents us from being the customer's favourite airline - Our Union.
I am BA crew and the above represents my own view and not that of BA.
We made it known 5 days after the ballot that the VR people had papers and shouldn't - see my post on here on 22 Nov. Someone contacted the Union and asked why they had been sent ballot papers and the retort was "can't you see what we're trying to do for you?" Unbelievable. unprofessional and totally unacceptable.
And what I learnt recently was that 2 people had received ballots that shouldn't - one had left BA 2 years ago and the other 8 years ago! Ok Fume if it makes you feel better call me a liar, but if needed for a court case I could and would provide names!
This Union (?) has got to go. It is corrupt to the core, and now it has put us the cabin crew in a very precarious position. The travelling public hate us. In all my flying years I have always been proud to wear my uniform; now I feel nothing but shame.
However the tide is definitely turning. On my last pre-injunction trip the entire crew were prepared to cross the picket line and come to work. They feel extremely let down by the Union for letting our customers down over Xmas without our consent. Let me assure everyone on here that even though embarrassingly you see some CC with their head in the sand, Fume, WW etc, the majority genuinely care about the customers and I strongly believe that IF a strike had gone ahead, there would have been plenty of volunteers to work.
Additionally on my current trip they are all now talking about the stupidity of the Union, how they have cost us everything and gained us nothing. Many say they won't vote yes in another ballot. If Unite ballot again, I think it would be the final nail in the coffin.
Most crew just want to come to work and do what they signed up to do, serve the customers. We are not a money-grabbing, selfish lot (although I admit some like Lalalady are and have let us down). Please don't tar us all with the same brush. Mr Salmon, if you could give us another chance I am sure you would find a crew that have mellowed, have changed and are willing to do whatever it takes to bring the customers back. My crew on the last couple of trips certainly are.
Please customers, give us another chance, and help us to get rid of the one thing that prevents us from being the customer's favourite airline - Our Union.
I am BA crew and the above represents my own view and not that of BA.
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WM
I agree she has brought the company into serious disrepute, thing is if they sacked her she would enter martyrdom and wind the BASSA die-hards up even more, bit like if the US got Osama !
Last edited by TOM100; 18th Dec 2009 at 17:35. Reason: typo
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HI Flyer 14 .
I have to say crew have short memories .I heard all that in 2007 and here we are again it's waffle and as usual not credible.
I don't doubt for a moment you ARE geunine but crew have brought this to their doorsteps by trusting BASSA after the last fiasco .They reap what they sew .WW get that New Fleet up and running and weed out the rot.
I have to say crew have short memories .I heard all that in 2007 and here we are again it's waffle and as usual not credible.
I don't doubt for a moment you ARE geunine but crew have brought this to their doorsteps by trusting BASSA after the last fiasco .They reap what they sew .WW get that New Fleet up and running and weed out the rot.
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Weather Map - I do understand where you're coming from, and normally I would agree. However this time the damage is palpable - we can feel it every time we walk through an airport, board an aircraft, stand in a shop in our uniform. I don't think most crew want to ever experience that again.
And if any are still confused - just remember this:
One crew member off an airplane = a LOSS of 60,000 pounds per month in Union subs to UNITE.
To us crew it means work a bit harder, which most of us are prepared to do.
A paycut to OUR salaries = less money per month for us and NO impact whatsoever to UNITE.
So, which option did the Union chose? Think about it, is that really good representation of the members?
They opted for US to take the pain and them to take the gain.
I am BA cabin crew and the above is my own view and not that of BA.
And if any are still confused - just remember this:
One crew member off an airplane = a LOSS of 60,000 pounds per month in Union subs to UNITE.
To us crew it means work a bit harder, which most of us are prepared to do.
A paycut to OUR salaries = less money per month for us and NO impact whatsoever to UNITE.
So, which option did the Union chose? Think about it, is that really good representation of the members?
They opted for US to take the pain and them to take the gain.
I am BA cabin crew and the above is my own view and not that of BA.