BA and Project Columbus III
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: LGW
Posts: 595
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Lemmings, yes, that's the word I was looking for...
Nuigini, how very interesting... I do think though that getting banned from that place won't be such a bad thing. I don't really care for the animosity (sp?) and hatred on there anyways. I've never posted there before, so it might be my first and last when I do finally get round to it. If you have suggestions, pm me and I'll put it on there if you want.
Gg
Nuigini, how very interesting... I do think though that getting banned from that place won't be such a bad thing. I don't really care for the animosity (sp?) and hatred on there anyways. I've never posted there before, so it might be my first and last when I do finally get round to it. If you have suggestions, pm me and I'll put it on there if you want.
Gg
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: LGW
Posts: 595
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SP,
I know you've said "over and out" but I don't believe for a second that you won't look here for a month. I'm just wondering where you get the £3000 from? A few months ago you (as in Bassa members) claimed you stood to lose £6000 so how come it's halved now? And who's giving you these figures?
The company hasn't asked anyone to take home less pay, by the way.
For the record, if the company took away £3000 from my salary I would be below minimum wage, so that won't happen. Remember, I'm "only" LGW, so couldn't possibly earn anything (or know anything for that matter as you've put it a few times).
Bye bye SP, have fun with your chums on CF where you won't have to discuss anything sensibly.
Gg
PS. For anyone else, I seriously don't expect my questions to get answered
I know you've said "over and out" but I don't believe for a second that you won't look here for a month. I'm just wondering where you get the £3000 from? A few months ago you (as in Bassa members) claimed you stood to lose £6000 so how come it's halved now? And who's giving you these figures?
The company hasn't asked anyone to take home less pay, by the way.
For the record, if the company took away £3000 from my salary I would be below minimum wage, so that won't happen. Remember, I'm "only" LGW, so couldn't possibly earn anything (or know anything for that matter as you've put it a few times).
Bye bye SP, have fun with your chums on CF where you won't have to discuss anything sensibly.
Gg
PS. For anyone else, I seriously don't expect my questions to get answered
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Simple fact is LHR is overpaid and overstaffed. LGW works a much tighter ship, they may also have to reduce numbers but no where near the % that LHR does.
How can LGW provide a competent in-flight service with less staff? Because they work harder and value there jobs?
The majority of staff at LHR is on historic contracts and purely paid too much. You are the ones stopping the company moving forward! I symphonize that you’ve come a custom to this salary and the life style you lead with it but that’s not going to help BA.
Striking is not going to help the individuals either. If the company has to reduce numbers you’re not going to change that!
How can LGW provide a competent in-flight service with less staff? Because they work harder and value there jobs?
The majority of staff at LHR is on historic contracts and purely paid too much. You are the ones stopping the company moving forward! I symphonize that you’ve come a custom to this salary and the life style you lead with it but that’s not going to help BA.
Striking is not going to help the individuals either. If the company has to reduce numbers you’re not going to change that!
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: UK
Posts: 1,608
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Since some people keep bringing up the fact that "WW is discredited in the City" and other such misinformation, I thought I would just post a few quotes that are highly enlightening:
Collins Stewart:
BoA-ML:
Collins Stewart:
Current trading dire cash flow stability is the target
Current trading is dire; premium volumes are down 15-20% with yields under
pressure. At the current run-rate, revenues are on course to fall by £1bn this
year. The £400m fuel cost reduction is a helpful offset, but significant nonfuel
cost saves are needed. The short-term target is cash flow stability; this
is unlikely this year. Consensus estimates of a £200m operating loss look
optimistic; this could at least double if current trading persists.
Significant staff cost savings needed
Negotiations with staff over changes to pay and conditions are key. There
are a range of legacy issues which need to be eliminated for BA to rebuild
returns. Willie Walsh has set end June as a deadline. So far the ground staff
and cabin crew are unreceptive. There is the possibility of significant
industrial unrest over the next month.
Current trading is dire; premium volumes are down 15-20% with yields under
pressure. At the current run-rate, revenues are on course to fall by £1bn this
year. The £400m fuel cost reduction is a helpful offset, but significant nonfuel
cost saves are needed. The short-term target is cash flow stability; this
is unlikely this year. Consensus estimates of a £200m operating loss look
optimistic; this could at least double if current trading persists.
Significant staff cost savings needed
Negotiations with staff over changes to pay and conditions are key. There
are a range of legacy issues which need to be eliminated for BA to rebuild
returns. Willie Walsh has set end June as a deadline. So far the ground staff
and cabin crew are unreceptive. There is the possibility of significant
industrial unrest over the next month.
BoA-ML:
Traffic statistics for May – premium still weak, no further
significant deterioration in rate of decline
In May, BA’s load factor declined 1.0pp to 75.1% (this compares to a 2.6pp
increase in April). Premium traffic fell 17.2% reflecting the weak trading backdrop
and continued trading down to the economy cabin. Non-premium fell 4.2%.
Market conditions remain challenging.
Scheduled RPK’s (Demand) -6.5% (April +0.9%)
Scheduled ASK’s (Capacity) -5.3% (April -2.4%)
Passenger Load Factor -1.0pp to 75.1% (April +2.6ppts)
Cargo Traffic (CTKs) -9.5% (April -14.8%)
significant deterioration in rate of decline
In May, BA’s load factor declined 1.0pp to 75.1% (this compares to a 2.6pp
increase in April). Premium traffic fell 17.2% reflecting the weak trading backdrop
and continued trading down to the economy cabin. Non-premium fell 4.2%.
Market conditions remain challenging.
Scheduled RPK’s (Demand) -6.5% (April +0.9%)
Scheduled ASK’s (Capacity) -5.3% (April -2.4%)
Passenger Load Factor -1.0pp to 75.1% (April +2.6ppts)
Cargo Traffic (CTKs) -9.5% (April -14.8%)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: LGW
Posts: 595
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This is getting completely towards kindergarden levels. I've just been challenged to a "discussion" on CF, as surely I don't want to discuss things here with "pilots".
I might take up that challenge, but we'll see. Considering I'm not sure if my CF persona will be completely confidential, I'm not too keen on the whole thing. Not that I'm scared or anything, I just don't trust them that easily...
Gg
I might take up that challenge, but we'll see. Considering I'm not sure if my CF persona will be completely confidential, I'm not too keen on the whole thing. Not that I'm scared or anything, I just don't trust them that easily...
Gg
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: East sussex
Posts: 141
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ScootCargoOps,
You do talk a load of twaddle.
"They work harder and value their jobs" - how do YOU know that...what experience have you had at both bases?
"The majority of staff at LHR is on historic contracts and purely paid too much. You are the ones stopping the company moving forward!"-are you BA management, have you totally swallowed the pill....this is what BA want YOU to believe. People like you come onto these forums making out their either experts or have experience - unfortunately most are neither.
....and striking will certainly help many - just you wait and see.
You do talk a load of twaddle.
"They work harder and value their jobs" - how do YOU know that...what experience have you had at both bases?
"The majority of staff at LHR is on historic contracts and purely paid too much. You are the ones stopping the company moving forward!"-are you BA management, have you totally swallowed the pill....this is what BA want YOU to believe. People like you come onto these forums making out their either experts or have experience - unfortunately most are neither.
....and striking will certainly help many - just you wait and see.
Join Date: Dec 1998
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 368
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
GG, Matt et al,
You're not alone guys and girls. My partner is a LH CSD and is firmly convinced of the problems facing us and the need for change. If anyone from BASSA flies with either of us and would like to know the complete details of the pilots' provisional (only provisional as it needs to be ratified by ballot) agreement, we'd be happy to let you read it without any side or interference.
Best of luck to all in this one, more hangs on it than the perceived need for the omnipotence of BASSA.
MrB
You're not alone guys and girls. My partner is a LH CSD and is firmly convinced of the problems facing us and the need for change. If anyone from BASSA flies with either of us and would like to know the complete details of the pilots' provisional (only provisional as it needs to be ratified by ballot) agreement, we'd be happy to let you read it without any side or interference.
Best of luck to all in this one, more hangs on it than the perceived need for the omnipotence of BASSA.
MrB
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ask OPS!
Posts: 1,078
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
....and striking will certainly help many - just you wait and see.
As to LGW, my personal opinion, is that LGW crew work harder, are more cheerful and better to operate than many of those at LHR. How they can fly in the face of BASSA by having the audacity to operate a full 319 with only 3 crew is beyond me!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Ask OPS!
Posts: 1,078
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
CFC,
Brilliant, that'll scare 'em. Bet old Willie is quaking at trying to find all the uniforms for the short term 'contractees' at such short notice.
How to play straight into the managements hands.
Do you honestly, honestly think they haven't seen this coming?
Brilliant, that'll scare 'em. Bet old Willie is quaking at trying to find all the uniforms for the short term 'contractees' at such short notice.
How to play straight into the managements hands.
Do you honestly, honestly think they haven't seen this coming?
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: London
Posts: 276
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm not with BASSA but will certainly be striking when asked to.
WALSH OUT NOW
WALSH OUT NOW
Are you one of those crew who believe if WW gets removed from his position, the recession, financial crisis and booking numbers will go back to what they once were and our terms and conditions will be left alone?
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Somewhere in between
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
CFC,
It's quite simple really, let me spell it out:
They do the same job with less people per airplane.
LHR crew start moaning if they have to dish out a hot towel... That's not valuing your job
You do talk a load of twaddle.
"They work harder and value their jobs" - how do YOU know that...
"They work harder and value their jobs" - how do YOU know that...
They do the same job with less people per airplane.
LHR crew start moaning if they have to dish out a hot towel... That's not valuing your job
Correction, why we're ALL in this mess now
PPRuNe Person
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: see roster
Posts: 1,268
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Olympus: problem with digging your heels in - you'll get pulled flat on your face if your opponent is stronger than you...
I think reality will sink in for some only when the P45 lands on the doormat. From what I've heard, there could be 2000 or so bombshells about to land...
I think reality will sink in for some only when the P45 lands on the doormat. From what I've heard, there could be 2000 or so bombshells about to land...
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Airline Utopia
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So. 2000+ are going to be sacked for not giving out a hot towel? 
Look. For the love of God. CC want to do their bit for the CO as well. However. It has to be equal to the other departments.
We don't WANT anything on top of what we have, we just want to keep what we have.
OK, there are things that could change agreement wise, but WW doesnt want it.
He wants everything and then some.
What about a bit of back up???
Look. For the love of God. CC want to do their bit for the CO as well. However. It has to be equal to the other departments.
We don't WANT anything on top of what we have, we just want to keep what we have.
OK, there are things that could change agreement wise, but WW doesnt want it.
He wants everything and then some.
What about a bit of back up???
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Airline Utopia
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I conceed, Dutch, on behalf of 14,000 Cabin Crew.
We are entirely to blame for WWs mis-management, the fines, the global recession and for the demise of Concorde.
Hands up. Guilty as charged.
We are entirely to blame for WWs mis-management, the fines, the global recession and for the demise of Concorde.
Hands up. Guilty as charged.
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Somewhere in between
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Crossed posts there.
No you haven't caused the recession etc, but shouting that Willie has to go and recall all sorts of past problems doesn't change anything.
I agree with you Olympus, most of the CC are great people doing a great job, but it seems BASSA has started negotiating to late if at all, thereby making the situation worse. That is the point that has to be put across.
Please get some facts rather than just propaganda and don't let BASSA make things worse for you and everyone else
No you haven't caused the recession etc, but shouting that Willie has to go and recall all sorts of past problems doesn't change anything.
I agree with you Olympus, most of the CC are great people doing a great job, but it seems BASSA has started negotiating to late if at all, thereby making the situation worse. That is the point that has to be put across.
Please get some facts rather than just propaganda and don't let BASSA make things worse for you and everyone else