ba euro fleet lgw

[WeLieInTheShadows]

Moo...I say it as I see it. Just look at the people on this board. How many saying "I can't wait to do SH for BA."

When it comes to new starters or many that are at SHLGW I assure that the majority want LHLHR. As for your transfer list figures I can neither confirm or deny that that is the case (however I know a man who can!), perhaps the reality is setting in that you earn more on SHLHR than LH without jetlag as long as you are prepared to sell back your days off for overtime.

Also, if more people want WWLHR why do the union insist on only direct entry into EFLHR and WWLGW? Surely if the already working majority want SH then let them go and just put new entrants into WW? Everyone's happy then.

Perhaps you can tell me.?

BANEWBOI

Nothing has been sorted yet. It's all out of all our hands anyway, so no point worrrying about it. Why not ring up and ask if you can do the WWLHR temp 6 month thing, you won't get any black marks on your file for doing so ro anything like that. After the 6 months you'll either go to SHLHR or midfleet LGW, so you've not lost anything either way.

It's really up to you. Half of the stuff written here is guesswork or rumour. Until you see it happening or in black and white at BA it can ALL change.

Now THAT you can count on!

[love2flyxxx]

I have finally decided to quit my job and make the jump to Ba. (i handed my resignation in today!!!!). So I have made the choice to join even on the EF LGW. Its the family atmosphere I want so I think I will enjoy it more than WWLHR.

However I do have a question if anyone holds the magical answeres. If we choose to go straight to EF LGW as aposed to the 6 month temp LHRWW, is it likely that we would then be unable to opperate onefleet long haul routes due to lack of training on the larger aircraft? Or will we simply be trained on all from the start?

Have to say though, I can't wait to be working for BA!!!!!!!!

[The Moo]

WLITS I can honestly say that without doing o/t I earn more than many of my friends on LH without the jetlag and a hugh crew card

Also scheduling will tell you that 50% of crew turn LH down thats why they have to take temps into LH. And I know many people that have had to pleed to depression route to come back to shorthaul. Also the union will confirm that for the first time in20yrs more people want SH than LH

[apaddyinuk]

Moo, there is a transfer list of serveral hundred trying to get into WWLHR...So why are they bringing temps in again??? No its not because they cant get people to transfer, its because its cheaper for them to train the new entrants quickly into WW instead of running NE courses AND WW Conversion courses at the same time!!! Why are there so many people complaining from within the company about the NE courses to WW. Just look in the BASSA website!

[banewboi]

if i thought i could go for wwlhr then i would but i simply cant take the risk of not being made permanent and if the temps get put on insertnameherefleet lgw then in 6 months time i'd be in exactly the same position as i would be if i started ef lgw, aswel as this i honestly want to do this for the rest of my working life and if i go straight to lhr i'll never see anything different, i have thought that even if it takes 5 years to get to lhr from ef lgw then that's 5 years of experiencing something different, then if i get to lhr ef it's different again and then lhr ww in 5-8 years time it's a whole different ball game.

i think ef lgw is the best starting point for career development because your experience will be so much more varied

[WeLieInTheShadows]

Benewboi that's a very sensible way to look at things , I wish some of my collegues were as adult .

Well, if people are desperate to get off WW for the first time ever perhaps things may change. Who knows.

love2flyxxx

There is no word that new entrants starting in April on EFLGW (for those reading this who are on the course) will be 737/777 from the start. However time will tell I guess, and as I have said before things can change at the drop of a hat.

What is certain is that if you are joining EFLGW you will EVENTUALLY be dual rated on 737/777. Oct this year is still the proposed handover date for some of the long haul routes of EFLGW, again...I guess we'll see.

There were some conclusions agreed on friday apparently and more info will come to light in the coming days and weeks I guess. I could post some of the rumours and gossip I've heard about it all on here, but without any concrete info I'll keep it all under my hat for now .

If anything more concrete does come to light, be sure me or someone else will update all you prospective joiners on the situation.

In the meantime keep applying or get ready for your training, and look forward to flying with you all soon.

[love2flyxxx]

Just landed off my early morning ****ty Chambrey and definatley glad to be coming to BA. Thanks for the info, of course would love to know more when you do.
Hopefully fly with you soon x

[WeLieInTheShadows]

Well I just came in off an early morning Rome. I'm afraid the earlies are still as early at BA!

I've got to be in for a 05.25 Marsellies and back tomorrow, but finish at 11.15 so not too bad.

[banewboi]

ATTENTION ALL USERS!!!!!!!

I'VE BEEN GIVEN A START DATE!!!!!!
15/5/06 EF LGW
TRAINING AT LGW NOT LHR
I'M SSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOO EXCITED, ANYONE ELSE ON THIS COURSE???
I'M ON MY WAY GUYS!

[banewboi]

can anyone give me a definative destination list from lgw ef and where we night stop?

[WeLieInTheShadows]

Congrats!

Now all you need to do is study the First Steps To Excellence when it comes through, as you will be tested on day 2 or 3 of your course. Get the discloseure form sent off with all the details needed by BA...AS SOON AS POSSIBLE, this will save you stress on your course (as well as us!) so you can concentrate on passing.

Next decide where your going to live if your not local. Travelling can be stressful (and tiring), and lateness incurs penalties (both during training and when on-line). So think carefully.

A word of warning as well.

The first few months are going to be a struggle as you'll only get your basic plus a small amount of training pay (which incidentally you wouldn't get at LHR). So start to save your pennies! (after a good celebration of course).

Can't think of anything else. I met one of your trainers doing your course today and he's very proffesional and an absolutely brilliant trainer (he trained me to be a purser), so you'll be off to a great start.

Again congratulations and see you around soon.

Feel free to post any more questions on here and I'll try to answer them instead of PMing me as some of the answers may be useful for others.

Right....back to sleep

[WeLieInTheShadows]

EUROFLEET LGW DESTINATIONS


Band 1:
AMS Amsterdam (nightstop)
DUB Dublin (has been nightstop over xmas period)
JER Jersey (nightstop)
LUX Luxembourg

Band 2:
BOD Bordeaux
GVA Geneva (nightstop)
HAJ Hanover (nightstop finishing end APR 06)
MUC Munich (nightstop finishing end APR 06)
TLS Toulouse (nightstop)
ZRH Zurich


Band 3:
BCN Barcelona
BLQ Bologna (nightstop)
BRI Brindesi (summer schedule only)
BUD Budapest
CAG Cagliari (summer schedule only)
DBV Dubrovnik
FCO Rome
KRK Krakow
MAD Madrid
MRS Marseilles (nightstop)
NAP Naples
NCE Nice
PRG Prague
PSA Pisa
RIX Riga (starting end FEB 06)
SPU Split (summer schedule only)
TRN Turin
VCE Venice
VNO Vilnius
VRN Verona



Band 4:
ADB Izmir (starting end FEB 06)
REK Reykjavik (starting end FEB 06)
CTA Catania (summer schedule only)
ATH Athens (Nightflight - summer schedule only)
OTP Bucharest (Nightflight – summer schedule only)
SOF Sofia ((Nightflight – summer schedule only)
ALG Algiers
THL Thessaloniki
PRN Pristina
HME Hassi Messaoud


Domestic Routes.
EDI Edinburgh (nightstop)
MAN Manchester (nightstop)
GLA Glasgow (nightstop)
NCL Newcastle (nightstop)
ABZ Aberdeen (nightstop)

Longhaul Routes ex LGW (to be operated by EFLGW crews gradually after OCT 06)

ANU Antigua
ATL Atlanta
BGI Barbados
BWI Bermuda
DFW Dallas
GND Grenada (shuttle)
IAH Houston
KIN Kingston
MCO Orlando
UVF St Lucia (shuttle)


There.

I think that's it. If I've got anything wrong please let me know.

[banewboi]

by shuttles you mean bullets? or stop offs?

different bands are distance relative?

and finally have you got a roster example for a month to see trip variance etc.

is there anything i can do before i get steps to excellence?

thanx

[love2flyxxx]

Banewboi,

Im training for the same fleet but starting 03/04/06, so Ill let you know how it all goes. Just as nervous/ excited as you but still haven't got my pack so starting to worry now!!!!

WLITS,

Thanks for all the great help. Im not scared of the early starts at all, its just some of the routes that ill be glad to get rid of! Can't wait to night stop in Geneva as ive been flying there loads but never get the chance to get off the plane!!!

Some1 told me that you operate everyday of your rota which confused me slightly so I have to agree that a sample would be great if you got one.

Thanks for all the help again.
xx

[WeLieInTheShadows]

Shuttles are flights you do in between stopover e.g. You fly LGW/ANU (Antigua which I forgot off the list), get off, then next day you do ANU/UVF/ANU and then get off, then next day ANU/LGW. Hope that's clear. That is just an example as well and not nessecarily how it is exactly (before those who know better jump all over me).

Here's an example of a roster, to say it's a typical example of what you would get is wrong (but it's the best I have to hand), as this person is a senior purser, who is part-time, and has leave.

[TH 16 FEB OFF DUTY

FR 17 FEB ANNUAL LEAVE THRU 21 FEB 06

WE 22 FEB REPORT AT 1455 LOCAL TIME LON
1555 BA2908 LGW MAN 1655 73D
1730 BA2909 MAN LGW 1825 73D FIX
1920 BA2564 LGW BLQ 2125 73D 700
TH 23 FEB 1635 BA2563 BLQ LGW 1850 735 FIX
1940 BA8049 LGW JER 2040 735 535
FR 24 FEB 1315 BA8038 JER LGW 1410 735
1545 BA2754 LGW ZRH 1725 73G
1800 BA2755 ZRH LGW 1940 73G 755
CLEAR TIME 2010 LOCAL TIME LON
------------------- TOTAL DUTY HOURS 2030

SA 25 FEB OFF DUTY

SU 26 FEB REPORT AT 0925 LOCAL TIME LON
1025 BA2882 LGW DBV 1310 73D
1400 BA2883 DBV LGW 1650 73D
1820 BA2366 LGW MRS 2010 73D 1115
TU 28 FEB 0550 BA2361 MRS LGW 0750 735
0925 BA2486 LGW BCN 1135 73G
1215 BA2487 BCN LGW 1430 73G 1010
CLEAR TIME 1500 LOCAL TIME LON
------------------- TOTAL DUTY HOURS 2125

WE 01 MAR REPORT AT 1235 LOCAL TIME LON
1335 BA2584 LGW VCE 1545 73D
1630 BA2585 VCE LGW 1840 73D
1940 BA8049 LGW JER 2040 735 835
TH 02 MAR 1315 BA8038 JER LGW 1410 735
1545 BA2754 LGW ZRH 1725 73D
1800 BA2755 ZRH LGW 1940 73D 755
CLEAR TIME 2010 LOCAL TIME LON
------------------- TOTAL DUTY HOURS 1630

FR 03 MAR OFF DUTY

SA 04 MAR ANNUAL LEAVE THRU 06 MAR 06

TU 07 MAR PT-TIME NON WORKING
WE 08 MAR PT-TIME NON WORKING
TH 09 MAR PT-TIME NON WORKING
FR 10 MAR PT-TIME NON WORKING
SA 11 MAR PT-TIME NON WORKING
SU 12 MAR PT-TIME NON WORKING
MO 13 MAR PT-TIME NON WORKING

TU 14 MAR OFF DUTY
WE 15 MAR OFF DUTY

TH 16 MAR REPORT AT 0635 LOCAL TIME LON
0735 BA8142 LGW LUX 0855 735
0935 BA8143 LUX LGW 1045 735 FIX
1135 BA2914 LGW MAN 1235 735
1305 BA2915 MAN LGW 1405 735 800
CLEAR TIME 1435 LOCAL TIME LON
------------------- TOTAL DUTY HOURS 800

FR 17 MAR OFF DUTY

SA 18 MAR OFF DUTY

SU 19 MAR REPORT AT 1305 LOCAL TIME LON
1405 BA2466 LGW MAD 1625 319
1710 BA2467 MAD LGW 1930 319 FIX
2020 BA2912 LGW MAN 2120 319 845
TU 21 MAR 0640 BA2901 MAN LGW 0740 319 FIX
0830 BA2922 LGW ABZ 1010 319
1050 BA2923 ABZ LGW 1220 319 710
CLEAR TIME 1250 LOCAL TIME LON
------------------- TOTAL DUTY HOURS 1555

WE 22 MAR REPORT AT 1350 LOCAL TIME LON
1450 BA2740 LGW GVA 1620 319
1700 BA2741 GVA LGW 1840 319
2020 BA2912 LGW MAN 2120 319 800
FR 24 MAR 0640 BA2901 MAN LGW 0740 319 FIX
0830 BA2922 LGW ABZ 1010 319
1050 BA2923 ABZ LGW 1220 319 710
CLEAR TIME 1250 LOCAL TIME LON
------------------- TOTAL DUTY HOURS 1510

SA 25 MAR OFF DUTY

SU 26 MAR OFF DUTY

MO 27 MAR REPORT AT 0915 LOCAL TIME LON
0915 BA2872 LGW RIX 1155 73D
1240 BA2873 RIX LGW 1535 73D FIX
1620 BA8119 LGW AMS 1730 73D
1815 BA8120 AMS LGW 1920 73D 1135
CLEAR TIME 2050 LOCAL TIME LON
------------------- TOTAL DUTY HOURS 1135


TU 28 MAR STANDBY 1800 2200 LOCAL TIME LGW

WE 29 MAR STANDBY AT HOME 1100 1800 LOCAL TIME LGW

TH 30 MAR STANDBY AT HOME 1000 1700 LOCAL TIME LGW

FR 31 MAR STANDBY AT HOME 1000 1600 LOCAL TIME LGW

We have a bidding system where you can ask for types or work/ days off/ etc etc. However this is a PREFFERENCE system not an "I want to this and nothing else" system! It works on seniority based on date of joining and where you get placed in your course (based on peformance and exam grades).

This person asked for 2-4 day trips and nothing else, as you can see they did ok.

As new joiners you should expect around 30 - 40% satisfaction on your roster. As you would imagine senior people get more of the desirable trips and weekends off (don't expect any unless it's the only thing you ask for! Even then you'll only get 2 max!)

BEFORE you ask about part-time...FORGET IT! Unless you've been at LGW pre 97 you've got no chance! If you go to LHR change that to about 86!

As full timers you are entitled to 8 or 9 days off depending on how many days in the month.

STANDBY - is standby at the airport
STANDBY AT HOME - is exactly what is says, you have 1 1/2 minimum from when you are called to reporting. Although these can be changed in advance.

As for anything you can do in the meantime...nothing really. Like I said SAVE YOUR MONEY is the best advice I can give you until you get allowances.

Hope this all helps, post more questions if you have them.

[banewboi]

that's fantastic, really helps, if you could get another example that would be ace, particularly of some ft.

asb and sb what are the chances of getting called?
i thought carmen aimed at 50-55% satisfaction?
do you do roster stability sections at all? (7 sb's or contactables?)

i notice that it's 30 min turn arounds? do you operate on cap371 or is there are union agreement or good rostering practice agreement set up?
how harsh is crewing (crew control)? or are they pretty good?

i'm sure i'll think of more questions but thanks so far, hope you aren't sick of me!!!!

thanks again

xx

[WeLieInTheShadows]

Chances of getting called off of standbys at the moment for maincrew 90% - 95%.

New entrants should expect 30 - 40%. Obviously depends on what you bid for and how you bid for it. 50% is optimistic, it's best to give you realistic expectations from the off, if they're exceeded...hey...result!

No idea what cap371 is, short or FIX LINK turnarounds are part of our agreements now. They mean we stay with the aircraft and pilots instead of having to trudge to another plane etc etc, wasting time etc etc. We don't mind them too much and it means we get to where we're going quicker without hanging around. Also meant our hourly rate went up if we accepted them as well.

Rostering is STRICTLY regulated by the unions and agreements.

How harsh is crewing?

This is a big company, and you are just a number. You will be treated the same as everyone else. Some days you will get a 3 day trip from standby, some days 2 doubles and a there and back. It will all be within agreed agreements and guidelines. There is no favouritism or similarly vindictiveness. You can ring and ask if there is work for your standbys in the system in advance if you want, there is no problem with that. Also if you wish a change of duty and they have one that suits you and both them available to swap...no problem.

My attitude towards it all has always been I do what I given, and always be nice a friendly on the phone. At the end of the day these people control your lives...be nice to them...they'll be nice to you.

If you'd like an example of a FT Main Crew roster, maybe if you talk nicely to Flybywire she would post one for you.

I think that's covered everything?

[banewboi]

cap371 is the CAA'a version of the european time directive as we are exempt, it details working times dependant on sectors worked and duty start time, it basicly says you can do 10.5 hours if you start before 9 and do 4 sectors and about 12.5 if you start after 0900 (all local time) once off duty you must have 11 hours or your duty minus an hour (whichever is greater) rest before your next flight and this can be reduced by a further hour if the company hotac you at the airport after a duty. days off must be the 8th day of any pattern and you must have 2 paired days off in 14. it's extremely complex dependant on what time you report, the number of sectors you work, whether you are positioned etc etc.

fix link i presume means that there is no aircraft change?
how do you find carmen works for ba and are their preferences fairly broad?
do you do roster stability sections at all?
and do you have contactables or duty periods that can be altered with 24 hours notice?
do they ever contact you during rest or days off?

i have always maintained a good relationship with crewing and it does pay off when you need something back, if you're nice then they're nice!

can you give an idea of rostering rules?
i heard mainlin lhr operate on a 6 on 2 off basis?

[WeLieInTheShadows]

Cap 371 sounds like or similar to what we do.


Fix link means no aircraft change, yes.

Prefferences are as broad or as narrow as you set them to be.

The whole roster is stable. You'll find on the whole you'll do exactly what your have on the page in front of you. Things do go wrong sometimes, but hey that's flying. There are plenty of agreements covering you, rest, days o, etc etc. So as I said you generally do what you see. The only times of uncertainty are standbys. These can be changed in advance or on the day. You won't get rung up to say your not going to Munich any more, your going to Athens.

BA cannot ring you on your days off.

We do opperate max 6 on 2 off. Sometimes it's less. You can allow Carmen to roster you 7 days on, this will then give you 3 off. Again it's just a prefference.

There are so many rules and agreements I can't post them here. Lets just say on the whole we're pretty well looked after and protected compared to other UK opperators. This isn't charter, it isn't low cost. Most who come from either of these backgrounds to BA say they would never go back and we don't know how good we've got it.

[flybywire]

Just to clarify the point:

Love2Fly.......when I wrote to you that I work every day of my roster I meant every day excluding days off and leave days.

In 2 years in BA I have not been called out while on a home stand-by only twice, one being Christmas day 2004 (we have no flights anyway on xmas day) and one recently in January. All the other home stand-by's were either changed to airport sby or into a flight beforehand or I got called out for a flight.

Crewing isn't harsh at all. Welieintheshadows is correct, you're only a number to them, so they don't log what you say, how you say it etc like some other crewing department I used to know!! Whether you're "too nice" or not won't make any difference to the trips you get unlike some other airlines...if you know what I mean!! For that, we have Carmen (the bidding system).
Also, leave days..........if for example you have a day next month when they gave you a flight but you need it off to go to a friend's wedding....provided there's still availability for that day and that you still have days available you can book a leave day over the phone - even after the rosters have come out.

I have never had any problems with regards to leave/days off. Crewing, instead of calling you at home to ask you to work on a day off because they're so short, they send a message through the crewlink computer system saying that there's rest day work available, and if you want to volunteer you can put your name down on the list.
Easy, and soooooooo much better, I can assure you!!! BA, at the end of the day, treats us as adults and you'll enjoy the responsibilities

Guys, enjoy your training, and remember that EF LGW is like a big family, it won't be long till you find yourself chatting and laughing away with your colleagues (cabin crew, flight crew and even ground staff!) on the plane, in the lift, coffee shop, during airport SBY's....
If you have a good attitude you'll definitely be rewarded.
Well done so far, good luck with your exams and welcome onboard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FBW