Network Aviation PIA
Given the nature and urgency* of the strike breaking measures the company (attempted to) put in place. I’d say the threat of intractable bargaining will be just that, a threat. They desperately need Network as it services a highly lucrative slice of the aviation market with some very influential players running those mining companies. If management manage to convince the commission that they have done all they can in the face of a rapidly accelerating pilot job market, intractable bargaining will only serve finish off the already dying beast.
*by urgency, I mean a costly, ineffective, cobbled together clusterfvck akin to panicked animals charging into fences.
*by urgency, I mean a costly, ineffective, cobbled together clusterfvck akin to panicked animals charging into fences.
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So far, two major companies who've threatened their employees with Intractable Bargaining have since retracted and caved at the last minute - watching from a distance to see if this one gets there and if so, how it will be played 
If it does go the distance, the unions better have their Log of Claims properly prepped and polished - Hearsay will not cut the mustard.
Virgin gives engineers 13.5% pay rise and backs out of Intractable Bargaining test case
If it does go the distance, the unions better have their Log of Claims properly prepped and polished - Hearsay will not cut the mustard.
Virgin gives engineers 13.5% pay rise and backs out of Intractable Bargaining test case
However, VARA and ALAEA were still locked in negotiations after the airline made its arbitration application at the end of last month.
On Wednesday, VARA’s lawyers sought to adjourn the arbitration case for at least a month to allow time for the ballot to proceed “in interests of a final attempt to determine whether employees are prepared to approve an enterprise agreement”.
But ALAEA opposed any adjournment “on the basis that the fact of a revised position indicates that the entire application is misconceived and should be discontinued or dismissed”.
But ALAEA opposed any adjournment “on the basis that the fact of a revised position indicates that the entire application is misconceived and should be discontinued or dismissed”.
How profitable is Network exactly?
Well played ALAEA. “Intractable Bargaining” sounds like uncharted waters and it appears VARA jumped the gun. On the basis of that it would be unwise to simply cave to what the company offers because of the threat of intractable bargaining. Union legal teams will be earning their money.
How profitable is Network exactly?
How profitable is Network exactly?
Can someone correct me where I go wrong here;
Network has approximately 13% of all the Qantas group aircraft. For simplicity sake let’s say they have 13% of Qantas Group pilots. ( I got these numbers from wiki so correct away).
This not insignificant portion of the workforce is bringing in revenue at a time when recruiting and holding on to suitably qualified pilots is a known issue. The group is approaching a fleet replacement period where pilots will have to be taken off line to retrain on different types causing pressure on a system which is already stretched for pilots on some fleets. At the same time they are advertising that they will “boost its international network with extra flights, more aircraft and new routes “.
So at the highest level, I suspect the QF negotiating team will have been given some boundaries to work within. Tactics may well be up to the negotiating team but the overall strategic direction of the group will have necessitated some lines be drawn to ensure goals can be met at a group level. ie, “ go hard but don’t go losing 13% of our pilot group just before we desperately need them”.
Can anyone poke holes in that assessment?
Network has approximately 13% of all the Qantas group aircraft. For simplicity sake let’s say they have 13% of Qantas Group pilots. ( I got these numbers from wiki so correct away).
This not insignificant portion of the workforce is bringing in revenue at a time when recruiting and holding on to suitably qualified pilots is a known issue. The group is approaching a fleet replacement period where pilots will have to be taken off line to retrain on different types causing pressure on a system which is already stretched for pilots on some fleets. At the same time they are advertising that they will “boost its international network with extra flights, more aircraft and new routes “.
So at the highest level, I suspect the QF negotiating team will have been given some boundaries to work within. Tactics may well be up to the negotiating team but the overall strategic direction of the group will have necessitated some lines be drawn to ensure goals can be met at a group level. ie, “ go hard but don’t go losing 13% of our pilot group just before we desperately need them”.
Can anyone poke holes in that assessment?
Sounds rational enough, although I'm sure they know that plenty will stay regardless, and of those that do leave a number will probably stay within the Qantas group.
More probably the left hand doesn't talk to the right hand to the degree we assume.
More probably the left hand doesn't talk to the right hand to the degree we assume.
Blind Arrogance in the Workplace - Brad G. Philbrick (Medium)
Is their a “cure” for blind arrogance? Yes, but it is up to an individual to see it in him or herself to make a change. I have never seen where one is able to effectively change arrogant behavior of a colleague in the workplace.
Blind arrogance is toxic. The outcome is never positive. Continued blind arrogance yields nothing but untoward results.
Are you in an organization that is led by blind arrogance?
If you are so unfortunate, hone your resume and seek to move on to a new environment where servant leadership, humility, and integrity are the cornerstones of their successful enterprise.
Is their a “cure” for blind arrogance? Yes, but it is up to an individual to see it in him or herself to make a change. I have never seen where one is able to effectively change arrogant behavior of a colleague in the workplace.
Blind arrogance is toxic. The outcome is never positive. Continued blind arrogance yields nothing but untoward results.
Are you in an organization that is led by blind arrogance?
If you are so unfortunate, hone your resume and seek to move on to a new environment where servant leadership, humility, and integrity are the cornerstones of their successful enterprise.
It means nothing in the long term.
Stay strong, network pilots are worth more than this deal.
Can someone correct me where I go wrong here;
For simplicity sake let’s say they have 13% of Qantas Group pilots.
Tactics may well be up to the negotiating team but the overall strategic direction of the group will have necessitated some lines be drawn to ensure goals can be met at a group level. ie, “ go hard but don’t go losing 13% of our pilot group just before we desperately need them”.
Can anyone poke holes in that assessment?
For simplicity sake let’s say they have 13% of Qantas Group pilots.
Tactics may well be up to the negotiating team but the overall strategic direction of the group will have necessitated some lines be drawn to ensure goals can be met at a group level. ie, “ go hard but don’t go losing 13% of our pilot group just before we desperately need them”.
Can anyone poke holes in that assessment?
I imagine the prime directive of the negotiating team is to keep Network pay significantly below Mainline/JQ pay. Otherwise, why have another separate group of pilots flying the same aircraft necessitating duplication of support services. And more importantly, to keep all the other pilot bodies on their toes, they must have a far cheaper subsidiary that they can threaten to off load pilots flying to if they don’t sign-up to sub-standard EA’s.
As said above, if the the pilots haven’t quit by now, there is hardly likely to be an exodus after a ~20% pay rise.
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This is a group that does not have a significant cost burden on the operation, the FIFO market commands yields that would be significantly higher than a LOCO such as JQ.
What the pilot group inside Network have done is create a situation where a larger pay increase can not be justified due to the message its sends across the group. This group of pilots accepted sub par conditions,(well below market rates ) years ago to gain access to larger narrowbodies. QF is issuing rises that are consistent across the group of airlines. Starting from a low base will always create problems.
Saying that colleagues are paid way more should have been the argument made prior to the introduction, not after the introduction and being well established. The datum of rises is not about what others are paid, its about now maintaining a real wage against inflation.
What the pilot group inside Network have done is create a situation where a larger pay increase can not be justified due to the message its sends across the group. This group of pilots accepted sub par conditions,(well below market rates ) years ago to gain access to larger narrowbodies. QF is issuing rises that are consistent across the group of airlines. Starting from a low base will always create problems.
Saying that colleagues are paid way more should have been the argument made prior to the introduction, not after the introduction and being well established. The datum of rises is not about what others are paid, its about now maintaining a real wage against inflation.
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Maybe, but these things take time. Anecdotally (no one will share official stats obviously) personal leave has increased quite a bit so people might be working on their plan B. There are a lot of people who aren’t tied to Perth and just as many who want to work for a real airline. Far fewer people talk about mainline being their preferred option than did before the pandemic. None of that rules out people taking the path of least resistance and staying in spite of the bitterness but chatter of leaving is at an all time high and, coincidentally, so are opportunities to do so.
Limit on number of standbys added. Additional annual payment which is over 20k for life of ea, no sims after annual leave. A couple of other minor things.
Sure, it cost some notice for leaving… who cares?
Anyone who says nothing was added hasn’t read the document yet.
If you read it and don’t value the additions well that’s a different thing but I can tell you no sims after annual leave is a really desirable addition. The lack of that alone has caused many pilots holidays last week to be ruined by a less than understanding training department. The limit on standbys also is a good thing.
It probably isn’t enough to attract many votes but it’s not nothing. Pilots are angry is this ****show of an outfit to the point they aren’t thinking. Just want to stick it to em.
Sure, it cost some notice for leaving… who cares?
Anyone who says nothing was added hasn’t read the document yet.
If you read it and don’t value the additions well that’s a different thing but I can tell you no sims after annual leave is a really desirable addition. The lack of that alone has caused many pilots holidays last week to be ruined by a less than understanding training department. The limit on standbys also is a good thing.
It probably isn’t enough to attract many votes but it’s not nothing. Pilots are angry is this ****show of an outfit to the point they aren’t thinking. Just want to stick it to em.
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Limit on number of standbys added. Additional annual payment which is over 20k for life of ea, no sims after annual leave. A couple of other minor things.
Sure, it cost some notice for leaving… who cares?
Anyone who says nothing was added hasn’t read the document yet.
If you read it and don’t value the additions well that’s a different thing but I can tell you no sims after annual leave is a really desirable addition. The lack of that alone has caused many pilots holidays last week to be ruined by a less than understanding training department. The limit on standbys also is a good thing.
It probably isn’t enough to attract many votes but it’s not nothing. Pilots are angry is this ****show of an outfit to the point they aren’t thinking. Just want to stick it to em.
Sure, it cost some notice for leaving… who cares?
Anyone who says nothing was added hasn’t read the document yet.
If you read it and don’t value the additions well that’s a different thing but I can tell you no sims after annual leave is a really desirable addition. The lack of that alone has caused many pilots holidays last week to be ruined by a less than understanding training department. The limit on standbys also is a good thing.
It probably isn’t enough to attract many votes but it’s not nothing. Pilots are angry is this ****show of an outfit to the point they aren’t thinking. Just want to stick it to em.
It’s worth noting that the proposal extends to 2027, which would make it a 7 year agreement- hardly in the interest of crew during an apparent pilot shortage.
Last edited by walesregent; 29th Nov 2023 at 21:26.
~13% (depends on rank and fleet, but those figures are in the ballpark- unless I’ve made an error). In answer to the second question- it doesn’t mention super in relation to it anywhere that I can find so presumably it is counted in ordinary time earnings and gets super.
It’s worth noting that the proposal extends to 2027, which would make it a 7 year agreement- hardly in the interest of crew during an apparent pilot shortage.
It’s worth noting that the proposal extends to 2027, which would make it a 7 year agreement- hardly in the interest of crew during an apparent pilot shortage.
I've heard things like:
- Overtime rate at ½ the normal hourly rate
- Reserves commencing before 04:00 after an RDO
- Zero DTA or any such allowance
- FO scales boosted to get above award, but Captain's not boosted accordingly thus significantly reducing the CAP to FO pay ratio (insult)
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Ok...in a nutshell,
A319/320 FOs under 3 years will get 146,735 pa
A319/320 Captains over 10 years get 253,845 pa
There is no DTA, and OT is from 59 hours at 94/154 respectively.
There are yearly increment increases.
Thoughts?
A319/320 FOs under 3 years will get 146,735 pa
A319/320 Captains over 10 years get 253,845 pa
There is no DTA, and OT is from 59 hours at 94/154 respectively.
There are yearly increment increases.
Thoughts?