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Old 1st May 2022, 09:21
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Now they have won their battle against the pilots at NJS the A220 can be safely ordered 🙄
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Old 1st May 2022, 10:09
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So NJS caved as well hey?
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Old 1st May 2022, 10:23
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Originally Posted by davidclarke View Post
So NJS caved as well hey?
Not entirely. The lack of an in principle agreement means QF are threatening to withdraw the right to vote. The A220 will be gifted to some other entity where the NJS pilots will be allowed to beg for a job.

Of course a simple yes vote to further (severely) reduced conditions and it could all go away and they would all keep their positions.

Last edited by gordonfvckingramsay; 1st May 2022 at 10:46.
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Old 2nd May 2022, 00:14
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Have they placed an order?
Yes (10 characters)….
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Old 2nd May 2022, 00:34
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Well in that case, I am probably wrong. Happens every day. Not to say that the order for twenty A220s gets converted into a different type, like more A321s.
Qantas has announced a few things that never happened…Red Q, Jetstar HongKong, Jetstar Vietnam…
Best of luck to all at Qantas with the new types, it is great to see some positive developments in aviation after the last two years.
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Old 2nd May 2022, 01:04
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with the flexibility to draw down on that order by choosing any variant from the A320 and A220 families.”
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Old 2nd May 2022, 01:59
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Originally Posted by Icarus2001 View Post
Well in that case, I am probably wrong. Happens every day. Not to say that the order for twenty A220s gets converted into a different type, like more A321s.
Qantas has announced a few things that never happened…Red Q, Jetstar HongKong, Jetstar Vietnam…
Best of luck to all at Qantas with the new types, it is great to see some positive developments in aviation after the last two years.
Jetstar Vietnam (Jetstar Pacific) did happen though mate. No longer now, but it operated for over 10 years.
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Old 2nd May 2022, 02:07
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It never operated as intended and ended up with QF managers under house arrest in Vietnam. So technically yes, it did happen. Many probably wish it never did.
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Old 2nd May 2022, 02:30
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Originally Posted by Icarus2001 View Post
It never operated as intended and ended up with QF managers under house arrest in Vietnam. So technically yes, it did happen. Many probably wish it never did.
Under house arrest because they broke the law.

Still, they did make it happen.
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Old 2nd May 2022, 22:38
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So now the orders are announced, do we think Joyce will follow through on his threats to farm out the flying to ‘cheaper’ entities?
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Old 2nd May 2022, 23:30
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Originally Posted by Ollie Onion View Post
So now the orders are announced, do we think Joyce will follow through on his threats to farm out the flying to ‘cheaper’ entities?
I believe so. We have all seen the lengths which will be taken to destroy unions, despite the cost. It’s all about busting the workers rights paradigm.
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Old 3rd May 2022, 05:18
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Originally Posted by gordonfvckingramsay View Post
I believe so. We have all seen the lengths which will be taken to destroy unions, despite the cost. It’s all about busting the workers rights paradigm.
According to the Townsville Refueller the 220s will still go to NJS, with Network being kept around only long enough to be a legitimate threat to ensure a deal largely in the company’s favour.

Bain has approached Network to combine their 320s with VARA and sold off as a package to Spirit to train their soon to be introduced cadets to get around the FAA 1500hr rule. VARAs Fokkers replaced with -700s in an attempt a B scale. Networks Fokkers slowly dissipate to be replaced initially by 737s and eventually NJS 220s.
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Old 3rd May 2022, 05:56
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So, what of the future of Jetconnect as the 737 is retired? Do they transition to the A321 too?
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Old 3rd May 2022, 07:35
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Originally Posted by gordonfvckingramsay View Post
I believe so. We have all seen the lengths which will be taken to destroy unions, despite the cost. It’s all about busting the workers rights paradigm.
U are 100% spot on there & as i have said before there have been many ideas shared between Joyce & his ol mate Willie Walsh.
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Old 3rd May 2022, 07:59
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Originally Posted by Fatguyinalittlecoat View Post
So, what of the future of Jetconnect as the 737 is retired? Do they transition to the A321 too?
I think the Jetconnect boys transition to the A350
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Old 3rd May 2022, 08:07
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I know a guy who has already been employed by Jetconnect (this week just gone) who is going to head up the transition to A321’s.
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Old 6th May 2022, 00:33
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It appears AIPA, in their haste, have fvcked up by agreeing to an in-principle shit sandwich without asking for details beforehand. Having effectively thrown NJS pilots to the wolves by “beating” them to this in-principle agreement, they are now reconsidering new information.

As our members are aware, the Committee of Management (CoM) met today to discuss the proposed in-principle agreement that our Project Winton negotiating team reached with their Qantas counterparts early last week. It included a presentation from our negotiating team on the deal and answered questions pertaining to the in-principle agreement.

CoM debated the issue throughout the afternoon. At 4.15pm, new information came to light which potentially had material impact on the motions that were being considered. Given the meeting had entered its seventh hour, it was determined to adjourn the debate and proposed motions until the scheduled May CoM meeting next Tuesday, May 10.

We will provide an update on the Project Winton discussions following the meeting next week.”


NJS pilots approached AIPA when NJS were purchased by QF asking to be able to join. AIPA dragged their feet somewhat citing the complexities of allowing another business unit to join (not the case with Network), and now it appears we know why. Never would I suggest that it is the case, but a cynic could be forgiven for thinking there was some link between QF industrial relations and current or former AIPA reps.
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Old 6th May 2022, 00:36
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Originally Posted by gordonfvckingramsay View Post
It appears AIPA, in their haste, have fvcked up by agreeing to an in-principle shit sandwich without asking for details beforehand. Having effectively thrown NJS pilots to the wolves by “beating” them to this in-principle agreement, they are now reconsidering new information.

As our members are aware, the Committee of Management (CoM) met today to discuss the proposed in-principle agreement that our Project Winton negotiating team reached with their Qantas counterparts early last week. It included a presentation from our negotiating team on the deal and answered questions pertaining to the in-principle agreement.

CoM debated the issue throughout the afternoon. At 4.15pm, new information came to light which potentially had material impact on the motions that were being considered. Given the meeting had entered its seventh hour, it was determined to adjourn the debate and proposed motions until the scheduled May CoM meeting next Tuesday, May 10.

We will provide an update on the Project Winton discussions following the meeting next week.”


NJS pilots approached AIPA when NJS were purchased by QF asking to be able to join. AIPA dragged their feet somewhat citing the complexities of allowing another business unit to join (not the case with Network), and now it appears we know why. Never would I suggest that it is the case, but a cynic could be forgiven for thinking there was some link between QF industrial relations and current or former AIPA reps.
Any idea what new info came to light?
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Old 6th May 2022, 00:44
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Originally Posted by gordonfvckingramsay View Post
It appears AIPA, in their haste, have fvcked up by agreeing to an in-principle shit sandwich without asking for details beforehand. Having effectively thrown NJS pilots to the wolves by “beating” them to this in-principle agreement, they are now reconsidering new information.
What garbage. NJS pilots are negotiating to fly the A220 (717 replacement) whilst AIPA are negotiating to fly the A321 (737 replacement). The company is not offering the other aircraft to the other pilots so there is no interaction between one set of negotiators reaching an agreement and the others not being able to.
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Old 6th May 2022, 00:56
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Originally Posted by Beer Baron View Post
What garbage. NJS pilots are negotiating to fly the A220 (717 replacement) whilst AIPA are negotiating to fly the A321 (737 replacement). The company is not offering the other aircraft to the other pilots so there is no interaction between one set of negotiators reaching an agreement and the others not being able to.
Not so. The interrelationship between what AIPA agreed to and the flow on pressure to other BU’s is very strong. The various BU’s are being played against one another and the various unions are protecting their own interests.
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