Qf LAME EBA Negotiations Begin
I ask again, how much are you willing to "pay" for annulised salary?
5%
10%
15%
The bean counters will only consider it if it is revenue neutral for the company.
So you currently earn $100,000.00 PA
Will you consider annualised salary at $95K, $90K or $85K reasonable?
5%
10%
15%
The bean counters will only consider it if it is revenue neutral for the company.
So you currently earn $100,000.00 PA
Will you consider annualised salary at $95K, $90K or $85K reasonable?
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I experienced the Service Quality meeting today and I am worried, worried that the leaders of this iconic company have taken their eye off the ball. The presentation was less than convincing and it seemed the managers were making a presentation they didn’t believe in.
Qantas International is in a fractured state and it will only take one or two industrial disputes to take in it down (to a shadow of it's former self) in my opinion. So while the ALAEA may have a militant executive I am sure they (as well as the AIPA) too known what a synchronised industrial dispute would have on this iconic brand.
I think QF management got it all wrong in aircraft selection, believing an LCC was the Golden Goose in a land down under and partaking in the M$150 dispute.
Without going into too much detail I find it difficult to line up the B777-300 against the A330-200. Singapore, Thai, Brunei, Malayasian,JAL even Air New Zealand all chose the B777 (as well as some A330) but we were a Boeing customer. But what did Qantas do, buy Airbus, deck them out for domestic service and then waste M$20 refurbishing them for International. The Hyundai’s of the sky. They now keep us gainfully employed with a terrible maitnence record while Dugong isn’t far behind.
Let’s face it we are hours from anywhere downunder. LCC works well in Europe with different country destinations just hours (sometimes minutes apart). There is a place for LCC’s in Australia but it is limited to domestic and short haul International destinations. Air New Zealand dropped Freedom years ago and I think AJ would have JQ landing at Tom Bradley. Move JQ into Europe? Wake up!
With capacity problems we need to find some and find it fast. Do we cut LCC or do we let the FS dwindle?
Who didn’t have the guts to tell Mr M Harris...”it won’t work Muzza” First of all he was going to get rid of anyone “who didn’t want to be here”...fair enough, so 20 odd put their hands up in Brisbane. Next came the dispute....Holy Sh$t! ...stuff that, let’s can the redundancies (keep the expenses) and get rid of the customers (goodbye revenue). What a great idea lets piss our external revenue suppliers off!
So here we are with plenty of labour, no line customers and no third party work in our hangars either and the same EXPENSES!!!.
What did Air New Zealand do last year “Our engineering businesses have been busy over the past 12 months gearing up for aircraft arrivals and taking on an increased amount of third party work.” http://www.airnewzealand.com.au/asse...ual-review.pdf
I know we don’t want forced redundancies (Sorry Fed Sec) but if ever QF needed to reduce the wages expense account it’s now. I doubt they would run out of volunteers to go. We all know we are excess labour in line and there is a portion of us who would be happy to go. Management says we need to move on, so do they.
Redundancies is not a stupid business decision, all major corporate’s use them to bring forward expenses and remove them from future years while consolidating and creating a more efficient workforce. Not to mention getting rid of some deferred benefit super accounts. Nah...Forget it; let me see out my six more years in Division One.
Wake up AJ! Get out of the Jetstar nebula and come back to earth. QF needs to focus on our core business, meet our customer needs, use redundancies intelligently, and deliver a quality Full Service product both domestically and internationally. We made 90years but our health issues won’t see us make 100 and you will be remembered as the CEO who took us down (Back luck Geoff).
Qantas aircraft punt comes unstuck
Plenty of flight risk in Qantas catch-up
Qantas International is in a fractured state and it will only take one or two industrial disputes to take in it down (to a shadow of it's former self) in my opinion. So while the ALAEA may have a militant executive I am sure they (as well as the AIPA) too known what a synchronised industrial dispute would have on this iconic brand.
I think QF management got it all wrong in aircraft selection, believing an LCC was the Golden Goose in a land down under and partaking in the M$150 dispute.
Without going into too much detail I find it difficult to line up the B777-300 against the A330-200. Singapore, Thai, Brunei, Malayasian,JAL even Air New Zealand all chose the B777 (as well as some A330) but we were a Boeing customer. But what did Qantas do, buy Airbus, deck them out for domestic service and then waste M$20 refurbishing them for International. The Hyundai’s of the sky. They now keep us gainfully employed with a terrible maitnence record while Dugong isn’t far behind.
Let’s face it we are hours from anywhere downunder. LCC works well in Europe with different country destinations just hours (sometimes minutes apart). There is a place for LCC’s in Australia but it is limited to domestic and short haul International destinations. Air New Zealand dropped Freedom years ago and I think AJ would have JQ landing at Tom Bradley. Move JQ into Europe? Wake up!
With capacity problems we need to find some and find it fast. Do we cut LCC or do we let the FS dwindle?
Who didn’t have the guts to tell Mr M Harris...”it won’t work Muzza” First of all he was going to get rid of anyone “who didn’t want to be here”...fair enough, so 20 odd put their hands up in Brisbane. Next came the dispute....Holy Sh$t! ...stuff that, let’s can the redundancies (keep the expenses) and get rid of the customers (goodbye revenue). What a great idea lets piss our external revenue suppliers off!
So here we are with plenty of labour, no line customers and no third party work in our hangars either and the same EXPENSES!!!.
What did Air New Zealand do last year “Our engineering businesses have been busy over the past 12 months gearing up for aircraft arrivals and taking on an increased amount of third party work.” http://www.airnewzealand.com.au/asse...ual-review.pdf
I know we don’t want forced redundancies (Sorry Fed Sec) but if ever QF needed to reduce the wages expense account it’s now. I doubt they would run out of volunteers to go. We all know we are excess labour in line and there is a portion of us who would be happy to go. Management says we need to move on, so do they.
Redundancies is not a stupid business decision, all major corporate’s use them to bring forward expenses and remove them from future years while consolidating and creating a more efficient workforce. Not to mention getting rid of some deferred benefit super accounts. Nah...Forget it; let me see out my six more years in Division One.
Wake up AJ! Get out of the Jetstar nebula and come back to earth. QF needs to focus on our core business, meet our customer needs, use redundancies intelligently, and deliver a quality Full Service product both domestically and internationally. We made 90years but our health issues won’t see us make 100 and you will be remembered as the CEO who took us down (Back luck Geoff).
Qantas aircraft punt comes unstuck
Plenty of flight risk in Qantas catch-up
A simple check of Black Panthers posting history reveals that he is a troll spreading Fear Uncertainty and Doubt.
He made Four posts between 2008 and 2011. Now he suddenly "wakes up" and starts posting about the "dire" state of QF International (note the sudden change of emphasis from QF being an international airline with domestic feeders, to being a domestic airline with an international "division"?). The flurry of posts in 2008 about the LAME EBA also give the game away.
When will the other trolls appear?
He made Four posts between 2008 and 2011. Now he suddenly "wakes up" and starts posting about the "dire" state of QF International (note the sudden change of emphasis from QF being an international airline with domestic feeders, to being a domestic airline with an international "division"?). The flurry of posts in 2008 about the LAME EBA also give the game away.
When will the other trolls appear?
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in the old system mech lames were the only ones to sign the MR in the old system or now RTS [QF]
Correct in saying this option is removed under 100.66.
Simply voicing my opinion rim, no need to play the man!
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A simple check of Black Panthers posting history reveals that he is a troll spreading Fear Uncertainty and Doubt.
Most of us just want one thing.
Certainty.
Unfortunately, what we are provided with is constant uncertainty and negativity in an attempt to blackmail us at EBA time.
Either tell us honestly that there is a future or tell us that they are going to pi$$ us all off and outsource/contract out engineering operations. Some goodwill and honesty mite just go a long way.
Then again, Sydney was told "We are setting up Avalon for overflow work only"
In the end, Sydney was shut down and Avalon remained.
The reason for shutting Sydney down?
"We need to make space for the expansion of the domestic terminal".
Late last year they announced a $20.2 million renovation of H245, the ex Heavy Maintenance hangar that was "shut down" 5 years ago on the premise of needing room for the domestic terminal.
Honesty does not seem to be their forte.
Fear and uncertainty is generated by people further up the tree than Mr Panther!
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Either tell us honestly that there is a future or tell us that they are going to pi$$ us all off and outsource/contract out engineering operations.
Funny thats what they tell Avalon staff as well This is something that the ALAEA should call them out on using the same threat at two sites if they are going to go well go and let everyone get on with there life.
Funny thats what they tell Avalon staff as well This is something that the ALAEA should call them out on using the same threat at two sites if they are going to go well go and let everyone get on with there life.
Last edited by Jethro Gibbs; 11th Feb 2011 at 00:31.
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bumpfoh
my point was that a conehead could NOT sign RTS untill he was issued a TA by Qantas read my post....same with the new system he/she wont be able to sign RTS unless they are issued with extra quals ....rim
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Now he suddenly "wakes up" and starts posting about the "dire" state of QF International
QF being an international airline with domestic feeders, to being a domestic airline with an international "division"?
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Then again, Sydney was told "We are setting up Avalon for overflow work only"
In the end, Sydney was shut down and Avalon remained.
The reason for shutting Sydney down?
"We need to make space for the expansion of the domestic terminal".
In the end, Sydney was shut down and Avalon remained.
The reason for shutting Sydney down?
"We need to make space for the expansion of the domestic terminal".
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You, like 99.9% of the others at the Rat, never existed in their eyes Brissy. Just entries in a ledger.
The squillions they took out of the place are 110% justified in their eyes, just as no one else was capable of doing the job as well as them, in their eyes.
They will never, ever in a month of Sundays think of you or anyone else outside their rarefied circles, but you can be certain that like old RJH, there will be a lineup to moisten their graves.
The squillions they took out of the place are 110% justified in their eyes, just as no one else was capable of doing the job as well as them, in their eyes.
They will never, ever in a month of Sundays think of you or anyone else outside their rarefied circles, but you can be certain that like old RJH, there will be a lineup to moisten their graves.
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Here we go again!!!!!!!!!!!!
Management say we can't afford to give a pay rise to the workers, yet somehow seem to be able to get their bonouses.
They use reasons like 'stiff competition from Asian Carriers, GFC etc.
But have you tried to get a flight on any of the main routes we fly?
We hear of sizeable backlogs of staff at LHR, SIN and other ports.
With what I see at the terminals these days, if we are not making money then either management is doing a very bad job or they are using some very creative accounting! (See other threads for evidence.....)
Looking at the average age of the LAME workforce in Qantas, you will see that it is climbing by one year every year... this is also the case for all LAMEs in Australia. Also, there has been a lack of training across the globe, which means there is not a pool of suitably trained people for any of the airlines to draw from in the event they should lose their own workers. My point being that Qantas needs us as much, if not more, than we need them. With this in mind, why do they insist on playing the sort of silly games they do?
The ALAEA is not asking for an exorbitant pay rise for it's members, in fact it will barely keep up with inflation. So to accept any less is to take a pay cut. For many the thought of Qantas giving any sort of threat of moving the maintenance elswhere (overseas or not), and closing down Qantas Engineering does not hold any concern, other than the shameless waste of talant and capability for this country. Some would say Qantas has already done this when they closed down Sydney Heavy Maintenance, Engine Line and some Support Shops.
As I understant it there is a meeting later this week between ALAEA and QF, lets hope there is a serious offer on the table, otherwise the likleyhood of PIA is one step closer.
Let The Games Begin..
Management say we can't afford to give a pay rise to the workers, yet somehow seem to be able to get their bonouses.
They use reasons like 'stiff competition from Asian Carriers, GFC etc.
But have you tried to get a flight on any of the main routes we fly?
We hear of sizeable backlogs of staff at LHR, SIN and other ports.
With what I see at the terminals these days, if we are not making money then either management is doing a very bad job or they are using some very creative accounting! (See other threads for evidence.....)
Looking at the average age of the LAME workforce in Qantas, you will see that it is climbing by one year every year... this is also the case for all LAMEs in Australia. Also, there has been a lack of training across the globe, which means there is not a pool of suitably trained people for any of the airlines to draw from in the event they should lose their own workers. My point being that Qantas needs us as much, if not more, than we need them. With this in mind, why do they insist on playing the sort of silly games they do?
The ALAEA is not asking for an exorbitant pay rise for it's members, in fact it will barely keep up with inflation. So to accept any less is to take a pay cut. For many the thought of Qantas giving any sort of threat of moving the maintenance elswhere (overseas or not), and closing down Qantas Engineering does not hold any concern, other than the shameless waste of talant and capability for this country. Some would say Qantas has already done this when they closed down Sydney Heavy Maintenance, Engine Line and some Support Shops.
As I understant it there is a meeting later this week between ALAEA and QF, lets hope there is a serious offer on the table, otherwise the likleyhood of PIA is one step closer.
Let The Games Begin..
Last edited by YOSHI; 14th Feb 2011 at 03:14.
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PP, word has it that QF have been carrying out 'contingency training' for a while already. The balaclava boys are at it again. Maybe you need to be giving your pen a bit of a workout, would hate to find that the ink isn't flowing come the 16th!
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MF
I have also heard the same info. Did not work last time, having trouble seeing it work this time.
Maybe I will have to notch it up a few gears this time as opposed to being in first gear.
I have also heard the same info. Did not work last time, having trouble seeing it work this time.
Maybe I will have to notch it up a few gears this time as opposed to being in first gear.
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Am hearing of refresher training in LAX last week and some more in the near future. Includes managers from newly created positions and some DMM's mainly from Sydney and the West.
Would be interesting to know who these guys are?????????
Always good to have a brother from the same mother
Would be interesting to know who these guys are?????????
Always good to have a brother from the same mother
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So Qantas Engineering has put out a helping hand to Jetstar when it cries for help on the A330 it now maintains. Nothing comes for free I have learnt and I am sure the guys we know at Jetstar will have to succumb to the cries of Qantas when the LAMEs walk off the job.
I have heard that the guys at Jetstar have approvals to work and sign the Qantas 330 fleet.
Why let this drag out Mr Joyce, give the guys a fair deal and maybe a little more and end this dispute before people make this personal.
I have heard that the guys at Jetstar have approvals to work and sign the Qantas 330 fleet.
Why let this drag out Mr Joyce, give the guys a fair deal and maybe a little more and end this dispute before people make this personal.
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I ask again, how much are you willing to "pay" for annulised salary?
5%
10%
15%
The bean counters will only consider it if it is revenue neutral for the company.
So you currently earn $100,000.00 PA
Will you consider annualised salary at $95K, $90K or $85K reasonable?
lame2, I don't understand your point?
i'm not going to pay anything for my annualised salary,
and it will cost the company 'BUGGER' all as well.
current: 100,000 plus 40,000 shift penalty = total $140,000.00 pa
new annualised salary $140,000.00 pa, plus the agreed 3% of course.
ongoing cost to company 0+3%.
is this somehow too simple?
buttmonkey.
busboy, i wonder what that's all about, so is that operations managers and dmm's in LAX for
refresher training, i thought they just learnt how to operate the ground handling equipment there.
they sure didn't learn how to change wheels, as demonstrated last time.
it certainly sounds like troubles brewing and after bleeting about any 'proposed' alaea PIA at the last EA meetings,
is the ballot for PIA comming out tomorrow? we need to be ready.
buttmonkey.
5%
10%
15%
The bean counters will only consider it if it is revenue neutral for the company.
So you currently earn $100,000.00 PA
Will you consider annualised salary at $95K, $90K or $85K reasonable?
lame2, I don't understand your point?
i'm not going to pay anything for my annualised salary,
and it will cost the company 'BUGGER' all as well.
current: 100,000 plus 40,000 shift penalty = total $140,000.00 pa
new annualised salary $140,000.00 pa, plus the agreed 3% of course.
ongoing cost to company 0+3%.
is this somehow too simple?
buttmonkey.
busboy, i wonder what that's all about, so is that operations managers and dmm's in LAX for
refresher training, i thought they just learnt how to operate the ground handling equipment there.
they sure didn't learn how to change wheels, as demonstrated last time.
it certainly sounds like troubles brewing and after bleeting about any 'proposed' alaea PIA at the last EA meetings,
is the ballot for PIA comming out tomorrow? we need to be ready.
buttmonkey.
Last edited by buttmonkey1; 16th Feb 2011 at 09:25.
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buttmonkey/monkeybutt
look i want annulised salary....but really it does cost,not wanting to boost the companys point but if we have 'AS" it will cost because our supper goes up along with other things so it becomes a cost to the EBA and therefore must be payed for in other terms...not saying I dont want it but we must consider what else is their for us.....Rim