Joyce the new CEO of Qantas
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Management Deadwood
Whoever or whatever Joyce may be lets hope he has a very broad broom and gets rid of some of the management deadwood who get paid large amounts of appearance money for doing very bloody little except carrying a clip board around in one hand and a coffee mug in the other.
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Wow, everyones an expert. Good luck to him. He has my full support. If it all turns dickie after a year or so, the slagging can begin.
Let's not shit in our nest yet.
A bigger issue is which airline will QF merge with in the near future.
Air NZ no doubt.
Let's not shit in our nest yet.
A bigger issue is which airline will QF merge with in the near future.
Air NZ no doubt.
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CEO Candidates
Unfortunately for Qantas the number of potential Airline CEO candidates is pretty thin.
In this part of the world there are probably three or four people who would fit the bill and they are very happy where they are.
Joyce is young,an outsider and has considerable experience in the airline industry.
The fact that he is a prick was probably a bonus as far as dixon and the board were concerned.
As has been mentioned the Qantas management culture wont make his life at the top easy.
Like him or loathe him he has a tough job to do in a tough industry.
Having met him once or twice he is not that impressive...just a little bit too full of himself.
Anyway he was probably the only real choice available.
Borghetti and Gregg are too old and really dont have any fresh ideas.
The fact that he is not a family man means he can park a bed at Coward Street and burn the midnight oil without distraction.
In this part of the world there are probably three or four people who would fit the bill and they are very happy where they are.
Joyce is young,an outsider and has considerable experience in the airline industry.
The fact that he is a prick was probably a bonus as far as dixon and the board were concerned.
As has been mentioned the Qantas management culture wont make his life at the top easy.
Like him or loathe him he has a tough job to do in a tough industry.
Having met him once or twice he is not that impressive...just a little bit too full of himself.
Anyway he was probably the only real choice available.
Borghetti and Gregg are too old and really dont have any fresh ideas.
The fact that he is not a family man means he can park a bed at Coward Street and burn the midnight oil without distraction.
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Potential Qantas Partners
Over the years a number of partners have been considered as likely Qantas bedfellows...Sing Air,Air NZ,American Airlines and even at one stage JAL.(though JAL was a fleeting consideration)
Given the right circumstances it may even merge with itself...paint all the Qantas Group Aircraft red and white with 787s and the A380 P/C and J/C only and everything else low cost regional and domestic.
Whatever happens all these aircraft on order have to fly somewhere,so expect some growth and increased frequencies over the next 10 years
Given the right circumstances it may even merge with itself...paint all the Qantas Group Aircraft red and white with 787s and the A380 P/C and J/C only and everything else low cost regional and domestic.
Whatever happens all these aircraft on order have to fly somewhere,so expect some growth and increased frequencies over the next 10 years
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Originally Posted by Dutch Roll
... Qantas will likely be a sh*t place to work under Joyce. He has absolutely zero respect for employees unless they roll over on everything he says and take it right up the clacker in every possible position. He is not interested in safety in the slightest (that info comes direct from an extremely experience flight-safety pilot who once applied for a high-level safety management position there, then withdrew after the conditions and culture permeating down from Joyce became apparent during discussions about the job).
As for me, I don't need the money, so if Joyce destroys Qantas Mainline by shifting it to a LCC model and thinking Australian mums & dads will still take holidays on budget carriers during a slowing economy and difficult economic circumstances, it'll be sad, but won't have a significant effect on me. I have other things I can do.
As for me, I don't need the money, so if Joyce destroys Qantas Mainline by shifting it to a LCC model and thinking Australian mums & dads will still take holidays on budget carriers during a slowing economy and difficult economic circumstances, it'll be sad, but won't have a significant effect on me. I have other things I can do.
Although this:
He has absolutely zero respect for employees unless they roll over on everything he says and take it right up the clacker in every possible position.
I think your argument fails a simple logic test. A company who's goal is profit maximisation is not going to shift profitable premium routes onto the low cost model when you look at the strategic landscape.
From a strategic management point of view (my point of view), Joyce was leading an airline attempting to enter a market. Existing Market - Existing product leads itself to a penetration strategy - the strategy being Cost Leadership / Focus. The QF Model lends itself to a Differentiation (Focus). Joyce isn't a dumb man and knows the different.
He would know the strategic framework that each airline operates within. Jetstar - Price Differentiation , Qantas - Image / Support / Quality Differentiation.
It may sound like management speak but he wouldn't get the job if he didn't know it.
Ultimately customer demand on each route will decide who gets it, if most want price leadership then Jetstar will get it, if most want quality/support/image they'll go with QANTAS.
Relax, he's not going to turn QF into Jetstar (Note: I'm not suggestion he'll be saying 'pay rises all around!' as he still needs to keep costs under control).
Good luck to the man.
A thread that hasn't been hijacked by the engineers! Won't be long though.
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like it or not he's the new boss and I reckon a big broom will be wielded soon enough.
Either that or he'll be white-anted sooner or later by the entrenched interests or disgruntled ambitious types.
He may surprise us all yet.Important to keep an open mind.
Information charles, I'm an engineer, hope thats ok with you.
Either that or he'll be white-anted sooner or later by the entrenched interests or disgruntled ambitious types.
He may surprise us all yet.Important to keep an open mind.
Information charles, I'm an engineer, hope thats ok with you.
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Mr Wooby
Maybe I should clarify my statement.
Joyce was initiatiatially responsible for Jet* only, now he is charged with the responsibility of running BOTH mainline & jet*.
Since his new responsponsibilities now include the wellbeing of Qantas mainline maybe his focus on J* may change? Didn't Dixon state recently that:
a. J* will no longer operate at the expense of mainline
b. Lesiure travel is softening
c. Mainline was the performer
Correct me if I'm wrong but the only logo's I saw during the press conference today had kangaroos all over them.
Fear Campaign, I agree give Joyce a chance. But whilst mainline tech crew out number J* crew at a rate of about 5 to 1 & an oustanding EBA on offer, I know which way the odds are stacked. Joyce couldnt afford to have mainline crew working to rule.
If J* were going to be the real growth vehicle, wouldn't Joyce stay put? As previous posts stated wasnt QF going to be J*'s subsidiary?
Kiwiconehead, Joyce does speak to staff. Remember he told the J* crew he was going to employ foreign crew under 457 visas.
The Hill, Yes, already considered. If J* repaint aircraft into Qantas livery, mainline will be short of a few Fo's.
Jet A_OK. That will surely see the end of them then.
Maybe I should clarify my statement.
Joyce was initiatiatially responsible for Jet* only, now he is charged with the responsibility of running BOTH mainline & jet*.
Since his new responsponsibilities now include the wellbeing of Qantas mainline maybe his focus on J* may change? Didn't Dixon state recently that:
a. J* will no longer operate at the expense of mainline
b. Lesiure travel is softening
c. Mainline was the performer
Correct me if I'm wrong but the only logo's I saw during the press conference today had kangaroos all over them.
Fear Campaign, I agree give Joyce a chance. But whilst mainline tech crew out number J* crew at a rate of about 5 to 1 & an oustanding EBA on offer, I know which way the odds are stacked. Joyce couldnt afford to have mainline crew working to rule.
If J* were going to be the real growth vehicle, wouldn't Joyce stay put? As previous posts stated wasnt QF going to be J*'s subsidiary?
Kiwiconehead, Joyce does speak to staff. Remember he told the J* crew he was going to employ foreign crew under 457 visas.
The Hill, Yes, already considered. If J* repaint aircraft into Qantas livery, mainline will be short of a few Fo's.
Jet A_OK. That will surely see the end of them then.
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Actually, no ElPerro, I don't have an old job I could walk back into, or at least there is no way on this planet I would even try.
There are other reasons I don't need the money from this job. Not a cent.
That being beside the point I suppose, Joyce has quite flagrantly lied to, deceived, and brazenly insulted QF mainline pilots before, and there is certainly no reason to believe that any of this will change. He is also obsessed with costs to the point that, as I alluded to previously when talking of safety, he appears blissfully happy to sacrifice anything for a short-term gain.
I remember seeing a program some years ago where a fairly well known and highly respected (and honoured) CEO of a huge, successful multinational company was talking about how he ran things. One point: cost-cutting, while necessary occasionally, is a short-term and unsustainable way of maximising profit. Another point: in industries dependant on heavy equipment, you have to continuously invest in new equipment to stay competitive.
While so far pleasing to shareholders who can see no further than this year's dividend, Dixon now finds himself in a bind. A relatively old, inefficient, and increasingly problematic fleet with a downturn on the horizon, patched up by a few purchases here and there (of vastly different aircraft types of course), substantial delays in the new hardware, an unhappy and unmotivated workforce, and with competitors chomping at his heels with shiny new efficient jets, good service and reasonable prices only kept at bay by Australian Government restrictions! If you were a stockbroker, you'd be a nut to have a "buy" advice on QAN, and Joyce is a carbon-copy of Dixon.
Dixon's legacy is going to be of a company backed into a corner - a situation Joyce is unlikely to change. Things just couldn't get any better, eh?
There are other reasons I don't need the money from this job. Not a cent.
That being beside the point I suppose, Joyce has quite flagrantly lied to, deceived, and brazenly insulted QF mainline pilots before, and there is certainly no reason to believe that any of this will change. He is also obsessed with costs to the point that, as I alluded to previously when talking of safety, he appears blissfully happy to sacrifice anything for a short-term gain.
I remember seeing a program some years ago where a fairly well known and highly respected (and honoured) CEO of a huge, successful multinational company was talking about how he ran things. One point: cost-cutting, while necessary occasionally, is a short-term and unsustainable way of maximising profit. Another point: in industries dependant on heavy equipment, you have to continuously invest in new equipment to stay competitive.
While so far pleasing to shareholders who can see no further than this year's dividend, Dixon now finds himself in a bind. A relatively old, inefficient, and increasingly problematic fleet with a downturn on the horizon, patched up by a few purchases here and there (of vastly different aircraft types of course), substantial delays in the new hardware, an unhappy and unmotivated workforce, and with competitors chomping at his heels with shiny new efficient jets, good service and reasonable prices only kept at bay by Australian Government restrictions! If you were a stockbroker, you'd be a nut to have a "buy" advice on QAN, and Joyce is a carbon-copy of Dixon.
Dixon's legacy is going to be of a company backed into a corner - a situation Joyce is unlikely to change. Things just couldn't get any better, eh?
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Originally Posted by DutchRoll
Actually, no ElPerro, I don't have an old job I could walk back into, or at least there is no way on this planet I would even try.
Originally Posted by DutchRoll
There are other reasons I don't need the money from this job. Not a cent.
Originally Posted by DutchRoll
That being beside the point I suppose, Joyce has quite flagrantly lied to, deceived, and brazenly insulted QF mainline pilots before, and there is certainly no reason to believe that any of this will change. He is also obsessed with costs to the point that, as I alluded to previously when talking of safety, he appears blissfully happy to sacrifice anything for a short-term gain.
Originally Posted by DutchRoll
I remember seeing a program some years ago where a fairly well known and highly respected (and honoured) CEO of a huge, successful multinational company was talking about how he ran things. One point: cost-cutting, while necessary occasionally, is a short-term and unsustainable way of maximising profit.
Originally Posted by Rod Eddington (former CEO of British Airways)
"But you should never arrive assuming that, say, just because you have seen a problem at Ansett or Cathay Pacific and you knew the solution there, that the same problem had the same answer,
Originally Posted by DutchRoll
Another point: in industries dependant on heavy equipment, you have to continuously invest in new equipment to stay competitive.
Originally Posted by DutchRoll
While so far pleasing to shareholders who can see no further than this year's dividend, Dixon now finds himself in a bind. A relatively old, inefficient, and increasingly problematic fleet with a downturn on the horizon, patched up by a few purchases here and there (of vastly different aircraft types of course), substantial delays in the new hardware, an unhappy and unmotivated workforce, and with competitors chomping at his heels with shiny new efficient jets, good service and reasonable prices only kept at bay by Australian Government restrictions!
If you were a stockbroker, you'd be a nut to have a "buy" advice on QAN, and Joyce is a carbon-copy of Dixon.[/quote] Yes but you are assuming that people only have the option of buying airline stock. Even the old CEO of American Airlines said that airlines are a great place to work but a crap place to invest...
Originally Posted by DutchRoll
Dixon's legacy is going to be of a company backed into a corner - a situation Joyce is unlikely to change. Things just couldn't get any better, eh?
Last edited by ElPerro; 28th Jul 2008 at 13:09.
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Bauble, you retard!
Read a few of my posts. I hate to keep up appearances. 
It seems obvious that there aren't many posters here in line for a HR job.
Talk of mergers? There goes the seniority scale. Everyone back to zero if that happens.
The writing has been on the wall for ages now. If you haven't been cultivating employment opportunities with other operators and encouraging a flexible home and family lifestyle, then you've got a lot of work to do. Hope it doesn't happen, but plan as if it will.
Almost everyone who posts here would appear to be complete morons.
It seems obvious that there aren't many posters here in line for a HR job.
Talk of mergers? There goes the seniority scale. Everyone back to zero if that happens.
The writing has been on the wall for ages now. If you haven't been cultivating employment opportunities with other operators and encouraging a flexible home and family lifestyle, then you've got a lot of work to do. Hope it doesn't happen, but plan as if it will.
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El Perro...A Bridge is For Sale
A little slice of management speak served with some well chosen quotes and you presented a dish that is oblivious to the real problems Qantas faces.....
1.An aging fleet that requires considerable maintenance from diminished resources ie tangible equipment assets and personnel
2. A Disengaged workforce that been largely managed on the basis of fear and intimidation.
3.A poor equipment mix
4.A severely depleted aircraft spares inventory.
5.An IT system that borders on the neolithic
6.A shrinking international market.
7.A yield that has been thinly maintained by constrained capacity.
8.A marketing department that couldnt sell ice cream to the Arabs.
9.Aircraft interiors that displaying distinct signs of age.
10.Operational disarray.
The spin doctors have you conned.
The Qantas work environment is toxic.A staff member was put on a disciplinary charge because he told a detrimental Dixon joke.Another fellow derided the whizz bang Blackberry because it is not 3G.He too is on a disciplinary charge.
If after reading the above you still believe that everything at the Rat is hunky
dory then perhaps we could talk about a bridge shaped like a coat hanger that is for sale at a very competitive price.
After watching Joyce on the ABC this evening it is surely evident that he is nothing more than a dixon clone albeit without the contemptuous snarl.With a little practice in front of a mirror no doubt he will soon master that as well.
1.An aging fleet that requires considerable maintenance from diminished resources ie tangible equipment assets and personnel
2. A Disengaged workforce that been largely managed on the basis of fear and intimidation.
3.A poor equipment mix
4.A severely depleted aircraft spares inventory.
5.An IT system that borders on the neolithic
6.A shrinking international market.
7.A yield that has been thinly maintained by constrained capacity.
8.A marketing department that couldnt sell ice cream to the Arabs.
9.Aircraft interiors that displaying distinct signs of age.
10.Operational disarray.
The spin doctors have you conned.
The Qantas work environment is toxic.A staff member was put on a disciplinary charge because he told a detrimental Dixon joke.Another fellow derided the whizz bang Blackberry because it is not 3G.He too is on a disciplinary charge.
If after reading the above you still believe that everything at the Rat is hunky
dory then perhaps we could talk about a bridge shaped like a coat hanger that is for sale at a very competitive price.
After watching Joyce on the ABC this evening it is surely evident that he is nothing more than a dixon clone albeit without the contemptuous snarl.With a little practice in front of a mirror no doubt he will soon master that as well.
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Originally Posted by captainrats
1.An aging fleet that requires considerable maintenance from diminished resources ie tangible equipment assets and personnel
2. A Disengaged workforce that been largely managed on the basis of fear and intimidation.
3.A poor equipment mix
4.A severely depleted aircraft spares inventory.
5.An IT system that borders on the neolithic
6.A shrinking international market.
7.A yield that has been thinly maintained by constrained capacity.
8.A marketing department that couldnt sell ice cream to the Arabs.
9.Aircraft interiors that displaying distinct signs of age.
10.Operational disarray.
2. A Disengaged workforce that been largely managed on the basis of fear and intimidation.
3.A poor equipment mix
4.A severely depleted aircraft spares inventory.
5.An IT system that borders on the neolithic
6.A shrinking international market.
7.A yield that has been thinly maintained by constrained capacity.
8.A marketing department that couldnt sell ice cream to the Arabs.
9.Aircraft interiors that displaying distinct signs of age.
10.Operational disarray.
It begs the question. Which Airline do you think gets a tick for all of the above 10 points?
In fact what is QF's return on assets vs other global airlines?
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It should go without saying that the next child that posts anything even vaguely defamatory about Mr Joyce et al will be banned.
If anyone ever wondered why management holds our profession in such low regard the answer is in this thread
It just beggars belief that some here may actually hold a mainline command..or aspire to such.
If anyone ever wondered why management holds our profession in such low regard the answer is in this thread
It just beggars belief that some here may actually hold a mainline command..or aspire to such.
