Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

Joyce the new CEO of Qantas

Old 28th Jul 2008, 15:31
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Emirates: Ahh of course:
Proceeds in 2008 from sale of property, plant and equipment 3,336,640,000 AED (963 Million Australian Dollars)
Nice way to make the balance sheet look black!
The Group earned a net profit (delta) ... to equity holders of -21.4%m than a year ago.
Etihad: Etihad to break even by 2010 Need I say more?
Akbar Al Baker, said yesterday that Qatar Airways could launch a low-cost carrier...."We already have registered a name for the low-cost carrier, and have aircraft ready for the budget carrier. We will look to offer better and lower prices than others.
QANTAS: EOY 2007: Net profit after tax of A$618 million

Big cheer for Dixon...

I suspect (especially given the Qatar Airways suggestion) you get you airline stock tips from CNN advertisements when stuck in hotel room's with nothing to watch You know when they say "Your five star airline" it's just an advertising thing !

Last edited by ElPerro; 28th Jul 2008 at 15:42.
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Old 28th Jul 2008, 16:08
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El Perro, are you suggesting that SQ are making a loss then? Because that would be quite inaccurate.
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Old 28th Jul 2008, 19:58
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Ling...I think he is suggesting profit return will be lower this year? than last year.

Interesting thing is all these airlines treat their staff very ordinary...the mid east are expanding hence have new aircraft...SQ is different, they keep replacement going instead of maintaining theirs...and it gives a more fuel efficient fleet.
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Old 28th Jul 2008, 20:09
  #104 (permalink)  
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Profit?At What Cost El Perro?

The ten criteria listed and that you questioned said nothing regarding profit.
The criteria listed were a result of of over zealous cost cutting(at Qantas) in order to achieve profit.
Lets have this conversation in 12 months time when AJ has continued on his merry cost cutting way and Qantas posts an enormously reduced profit and the operation of the airline is an even bigger catastrophe than it is now.
Its relatively easy to cut just dont spend money on anything and voila your bottom line is improved.
Dont buy any groceries,cut off the phone,the computer,dont do any repairs on your house,no car repairs,sell the lawn mower and at the end of the year you have lots of money in the bank but you have lost weight and you are living in a hovel.Of course your wife and kids are very very upset.
Being clever with your revenue base on the other hand requires skill and creative thinking....both lacking at Qantas.
You are defending the indefensible
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Old 28th Jul 2008, 20:53
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Not thinking about revenue?????

Exactly how much revenue do you reckon the QF Group would have right now if it had taken strategy advice from AIPA and not started JQ, leaving the low fare market to VB and the back couple of rows of some clapped out second hand 767s?

You are indeed dreaming.

Qantas new CEO has a track record of revenue generation. And of making money on routes where the Legacy carrier couldn't.

This is the best piece of new you guys could have heard...if you finally get over the venom and spleen venting. As the moderator said...these posts alone have given the Mr. Joyce a perfect word picture of AIPA and its orchestrated tactics. Which by the way use members money which is tax deductible and hence I'm paying for. Must write to the ATO.

One day someone will start a Sky Gods thread for jokes and pictures. In fact that's a good idea.....must think about it.

"How can you tell a Sky God?......You can't he already knows everything"

Promise...good bottle of '389 for the best Sky God joke.
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Old 28th Jul 2008, 21:15
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Much Ado. Get over yourself. It's ok to throw insults at Dixon but not at Joyce? At QF pilots but not Jetstar? And your comment about "Mainline Captains" is Just out of line. You sir are a bias [email protected]#ker.
Go on Ban me. With a prick like you as the Moderator, I'm finished with PPRuNe.

Anybody find it Ironic that an unemployed pilot named genex is the bloke throwing insults.
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Old 28th Jul 2008, 21:40
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spud phucker
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Old 28th Jul 2008, 21:59
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..............bwahahahahaha........ the pictures are great.

So many people upset and nothing has happened yet.

Surely aviation has taught you one thing: It hasn't happened until it's happened.
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Old 28th Jul 2008, 22:16
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Hey Henry,

Take a look over your shoulder.........This thread was about Mr Joyce, I dare say the reason Much Ado addressed his comment about defaming comments about Mr Joyce et al was in encompassed the rest like dixon and Godfrey and anyone else for that matter.

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Old 28th Jul 2008, 22:25
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Much Ado..I'm with you.

This thread is a bloody embarrassement.
It just goes to show just how sheltered some of these "professionals" are as to how the world operates.
I hope someone's lawyers are watching it closely. I'm sure they wouldn't mind a wee chat with Transition Layer and co. But then again, these are busy intelligent people who would probably look at it like some petulant child just called them names, and disregard it in an instant.
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Old 29th Jul 2008, 01:09
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Genex..Startup Airline Revenue

When you startup any business...airlines included....the first dollar you earn is revenue growth .Revenue growth continues until your product has satisfied the market demand for your product.The revenue will then fluctuate.
Joyce is not responsible for revenue growth.It was a a natural function of tapping into a niche market that had previously been ignored.
Revenue is not to be confused with profit as you seem to be doing.
Profit begins when you cover your costs.Costs in Jet* case that were already being covered by the parent Qantas Group.
Lets wait for this years annual report and see if we can determine not only revenue for Jet* but also its profit as a percentage of the total group.
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Old 29th Jul 2008, 02:27
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One major point you clowns fail to understand. Qantas is an ASX listed comapny. Its books are open, particularly to the big stock broking companies. You clowns also fail to realise why Adelaide crew were the last to know about the base closure. It affects the share price. No one is meant to know until the ASX is notified.

It would be hilllarious if AIPA and the other draconian unions were to run Q or at least act on the their advice.
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Old 29th Jul 2008, 02:40
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Froth and Bubble

I am afraid I agree with Genex here.Perhaps I am really losing it.

Everything has been blown way out of proportion IMHO.

Jetstar has a market for its brand and so does Qantas.
Joyce clearly stated that he would continue with the two brand strategy.

He is not going to place Jetstar on a premium route against Singair or Emirates.Neither would he place Qantas on a leisure route.

There may be however a market through Vietnam or Thailand to other Euro destinations for JQ. Each Airline within the group has its strengths.

Joyce needs both Jetstar AND Qantas.In the same way he also needs Jetstar and Qantas pilots.The shareholders also need both groups of pilots just as it has needed its engineers.

Time to get back to our jobs and stop bitching at our fellow pilots.Let us not lower ourselves to a Jetstar versus Qantas pilots slagging match.I've met a few dickheads in both camps but overall the vast majority on both sides are great people and true professionals that any CEO should want to look after.

I am sure the ex Ansett pilots in BOTH Qantas and Jetstar would be the first to remind us to be thankful we still work for a solvent company.

Safe flying everyone
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Old 29th Jul 2008, 03:49
  #114 (permalink)  

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Thumbs down Let me count the lies...

1. much revenue...if it (Qantas Group) had taken strategy advice from AIPA and not started JQ, leaving the low fare market to VB and the back couple of rows of some clapped out second hand 767s?
AIPA's position was never about not starting up J*. AIPA's position was all about QF honouring it's agreement with AIPA about giving us a seat at the table to discuss operations of the LCC as was written into various EBAs at the time.

As the moderator said...these posts alone have given the Mr. Joyce a perfect word picture of AIPA and its orchestrated tactics.
I don't recognise any QF long haul crew on this thread who have displayed venom toward Mr Joyce. That would also make your assertion of it being 'orchestrated tactics' by AIPA to be a lie.

Which by the way use members money which is tax deductible and hence I'm paying for. Must write to the ATO.
Knock your socks off. It's the law.

The rest of your post is just the usual trash. As usual you play the man and not the ball. I note that on a couple of different threads you've mysteriously disappeared once the obvious distortions in your posts have been highlighted.

"How can you tell a Sky God?......You can't he already knows everything"
Nice to know see the chip on the shoulder hasn't diminished any though!
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Old 29th Jul 2008, 04:16
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lets agree that

there is a future for both airlines in their respective markets. If history is anything to go by then AJ will be a little clone of , no not GD, but the chairman LC. remember if there has ever been an anti union guy out there it LC (his history in RIO will support this view). I suspect this is a major reason the board decided on AJ because he comes with less baggage then the is however interesting how quickly one forgets some of the realities in the current environment. airfares and the way they are sold to the public is what i call an artform. since J* was launched i have looked on many occassions online getting the best fares to HNL or BKK. majority of times i found Qf to be cheaper then J*, if you book in advance. i have many friends who tried the J* experience and they wont ever travel on them again internationally. given that QF is not there they will go to any alternate carrier. Fortunatly GD had the bonus of an booming aviation market. AJ will have a much tougher time.
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Old 29th Jul 2008, 04:27
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GENEX: You wanted a sky-god gag ??

Q: What does a QF captain's wife do to her ar$ehole just before sex ??

A: She drops him off at the airport.

Can we make it a bottle of tanqueray ??

Oh and my mates at JQ tell me that Joycey pax's JQ regularly and always pops up front to say G'day..... Dixon never did either !
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Old 29th Jul 2008, 04:39
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Keg.....I was for the first time ashamed to call myself a professional pilot when I saw some of the pics that were posted here on this thread the last few days. They rank with the monkeys pic that was posted during the EBA.

You're probably isn't orchestrated....but it is simply nasty, way beyond the pale. I understand the frustration you guys feel....but there are two parties in an EBA and you folks forgot that in unity is strength. If Geoff upset you its because he could.....there was once a world where a pilot union leader could have stared him down and said "there has to be another way, lets find it" and it would have worked.

Jetstar, where I have many good friends, and Joyce are not the enemy. But you wouldn't know that from many of the posts recently. If they weren't from AIPA members thats good.

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Old 29th Jul 2008, 05:07
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Thread Drift

Have heard AJ was once an engineer or has actual hands on maintenance experience of aircraft.

If this is true, perhaps there is a future for engineering as he will be able to see through the smoke mirror show put on by characters whom run it now.

But I did enjoy "the Chaser" calling AJ a prique on national TV over his employment policy

YouTube - Alan Joyce on The Chaser's War on Everything

Last edited by Bolty McBolt; 29th Jul 2008 at 07:10.
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Old 29th Jul 2008, 05:17
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From what I have been told by a J* Capt is that AJ is not a bad guy at all. Quite approachable and willing to engage.

Maybe he is the answer to all the folk who complain about management disegagement.

Try getting a fresh new outlook and as a whole company, work together, new a/c coming, the rough patch will pass, and you never know, many of you might enjoy your jobs again!

Its all about attitude they say.......

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Old 29th Jul 2008, 05:28
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Today's take on it from

What sort of Qantas will Jetstar-Joyce deliver?

Ben Sandilands writes:

Former Jetstar boss Alan Joyce is taking over at Qantas just as the Jetstar model runs into real problems. The lower fare paying passengers, those that were suckered by a five-cent fare in one direction and screwed with a $200 fare return, aren’t rocking up like they once did. Source: Guidance from Geoff Dixon, the Qantas CEO in the executive departure lounge. Reason: The so called ultra low fare customers that spawned Ryanair, the Jetstar template which is currently losing financial altitude faster than QF 30 did when it dropped in on Manila, can no longer afford the petrol to get to an airport, never mind being gouged for the parking.

Jetstar International is in serious trouble in Japan because it is considered an insult by consumers, and doesn’t have the support of the major tour wholesalers who control on-line and off-line leisure sales.
Dixon’s decision to replace many Japan flights with Jetstar services is not just bad strategy according to tourism insiders, but a factor in the disastrous collapse of Japanese travel to Queensland. The myth that Jetstar somehow saved Qantas from the wicked Virgins is also turning into a problem. By the time Jetstar started flying in 2004, Virgin Blue had already stopped the massive and unsustainable rate of expansion it underwent through 2002-2003. Instead it began replacing near-new jets with brand new jets bought outright or at better leasing rates.
Before Jetstar, the Virgin Blue share of contested domestic routes was measurable by DOTARS data on passenger numbers boarded. It sat at just over 30%. It is still hovering around 32% and looking at Virgin and Qantas capacity cuts, it could stay there even in a shrinking total market.

What Jetstar really achieved was to drive higher yield Qantas customers across to Virgin Blue (which had wisely stopped the involuntary face painting of persons in suits) when they were confronted with routes from which most if not all Qantas full service flights had been withdrawn.
Jetstar is poison for regular business flyers, or "new world travellers" as Virgin Blue CEO Brett Godfrey calls them. The cosy little duopoly that has now emerged on the mainline domestic routes between Qantas and Virgin Blue is a division of the spoils in terms of regular travellers who normally fly economy and routinely pay around $250-400 for a one way flight between the SE cities without blinking.

Joyce’s other problem is that Jetstar is despised at many levels in Qantas, including senior managers who will presumably soon leave, who insisted that the original Jetstar offering be so bad that customers would know they were being punished for not paying rip off fares to the full service carrier.
If Joyce had been freer to act on his instincts, Jetstar could have done enormous damage to Qantas and Virgin Blue. All it would have taken was a bit more legroom and check-in procedures and ticket conditions that didn’t treat customers like sh-t. But the real and legitimate agenda for Jetstar has always been higher productivity. It's an agenda for Qantas that’s stencilled on Joyce’s forehead.
Many in Qantas hope that Joyce’s alleged disdain for "legacy" concepts of engineering and piloting excellence vanishes (if it really ever existed).

Jetstar’s worst incident, a bungled attempt at a foggy landing at Melbourne Airport in July last year, not only put lives in jeopardy, but raised doubts that the carrier even understood its obligations in the transitional training of pilots to the A320 airliner or the inadequacy of its flight standards oversights.
The incident was inexcusable. Two pilots sat there wondering why a jet kept descending on lower than expected power without actually checking that the throttle was in the right detent and then blamed a system’s failure, an excuse that lasted as long as a snowflake in Surfers when the ATSB finally demanded to see the data.

Given the meeja hysterics over a trivial and routine problem with a Qantas flight that returned to Adelaide last night, it won’t get away with anything without intense scrutiny.
But we may not have seen the full Alan Joyce in action. Now that some of the restraints of his Jetstar brief are gone so are all bets about what sort of Qantas it is that Joyce and the notably engaged chairman Leigh Clifford really have in mind.
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