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Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10175325)
This last flight each Sunday night from DUB into SEN has had its fair share of cock ups. The a/c is generally getting caught up in some issues throughout the days schedules but seems it''s a common issue impacting the particular flight at this particular day and slot.
Couple of regular pax at checkin queue commenting they've had enough of how sh!t Flybe have been in running a reliable punctual service on the route. Even had the comment 'Ryanair wouldn't be this sh!t' I haven' a clue what the issue is but whoever works in flight ops needs to look at this ridiculous inability to provide the service pax expect and pay for. As for the Stobart operate the service argument. I am the pax, I book Flybe using their app and pay for the flight to Flybe. Transparently speaking Flybe are the airline responsible. It is for Flybe to get its sh!t together and if there are issues at Stobart flight ops too then it' not for a pax to sort that out it is responsibility of these two sh!t operators to organise their business and passenger services. As I've said, this is the last time I'll use Flybe at all. From the sound of the other pissed off pax sitting here in Dublin I think it' fair to say many of them will not use Flybe again either. The word will spread in the SEN area. I pitty the skipper and hostie's on this delayed flight tonight... there are a lot of extremely annoyed pax. But we'll get the usual BS scripted skipper announcement to pax in the rear... Anyone know when this franchise is due to end ? |
Originally Posted by PDXCWL45
(Post 10175324)
So if Eastern Airways E170 goes tech operating for BA Cityflyer we blame BA then do we? Or if Avion Express run late operating for Jet2 then we blame Jet2 then?
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There is clearly an issue at Stobart Air at the moment and it centres on the E195 routes and a missing aircraft. I posted a question on this subject a few days back in the Stobart thread as I’m ever more nervous about a flight I’m taking which also seems to be continually hit. Touchwood (I say this as I’m flying SEN-MAN-SEN tomorrow) the normal ATR routes aren’t affected and seem to run very punctually. But over the last few weeks there has been a random selection of aircraft doing particular routes - CGN, DUB, GLA, LYS - Bulgaria Air, Titan and Stobart’s own additional ATR. It’s the latter where delays really build up. The problem for BE is it is their name on the ticket and on the side of the plane (unless you’re in a plain white Titan 737), their social media harassed by angry pax and their name in the papers. That said the waters are a bit muddied because the problem E195s have come from BE themselves. |
They've cancelled the flight. Pax can't get back to the UK on Flybe tomorrow cause no availablextra seats. No word of extra aircraft coming online to grab tonight' pax affected by themail pulling the flight.
Some pax stranded in airport. Some in hotels adjacent to Dublin airport. Bit of a disaster. A few of us managed to buy tickets on other airlines (BA and Aer Lingus) into Gatwick or Heathrow early tomorrow morning (cost a fortune for a one way which Flybe will be getting the bill to compensate). Ryanair and Cityjet both had no seats available to and London airports tomorrow until after 17:00. Total and utter car crash from Flybe tonight. Pax received text with link to the website saying rebook or ask for refund. Nobody could get through to and call centre. Totally sh!t service. I can tell you the amount of people who were insensed and angered by how bad Flybe have been was not surprising. As I've said this particular flight has habitually been cocked up most Sunday's now or delayed or something generally goes wrong and we get the usual weak excuses from the captain. Not good enough. Never fly with Flybe again. |
Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10175404)
They've cancelled the flight. Pax can't get back to the UK on Flybe tomorrow cause no availablextra seats. No word of extra aircraft coming online to grab tonight' pax affected by themail pulling the flight.
Some pax stranded in airport. Some in hotels adjacent to Dublin airport. Bit of a disaster. A few of us managed to buy tickets on other airlines (BA and Aer Lingus) into Gatwick or Heathrow early tomorrow morning (cost a fortune for a one way which Flybe will be getting the bill to compensate). Ryanair and Cityjet both had no seats available to and London airports tomorrow until after 17:00. Total and utter car crash from Flybe tonight. Pax received text with link to the website saying rebook or ask for refund. Nobody could get through to and call centre. Totally sh!t service. I can tell you the amount of people who were insensed and angered by how bad Flybe have been was not surprising. As I've said this particular flight has habitually been cocked up most Sunday's now or delayed or something generally goes wrong and we get the usual weak excuses from the captain. Not good enough. Never fly with Flybe again. Out of interest how is performance on Aurigny’s E195? I ask because they only have the 1 and it’s not excessively used compared to the Flybe ones, both on BE scheduled services or the Stobartair flights. Is it just an unfortunate series of technical issues lately or something more specific maybe lack of engineering support at SEN? Are the E175s more reliable at other bases by comparison? |
I totally agree with mik3bravo and was caught up in these delays on the DUB route twice last week, although perhaps I as lucky to experience delays of only 2 hours each time. The first was particularly annoying because the delay was shown on the SEN website departure board from early morning so it was planned at least 10 hours ahead, yet I couldn't risk delaying my bag drop beyond normal check-in time. I know as well as anyone how difficult it can be to obtain a replacement aircraft from someone like Jota or Titan at this time of year but they did bring in an Air Bulgaria E190 for an extended period recently and I'm not convinced they couldn't have either extended that or brought in a permanent replacement. As far as the cause of these delays is concerned I couldn't obtain any firm information but it was certainly partly due to the late arrival on fleet of E195 G-FBEN which is still at EXT. I also had the feeling that crewing may have contributed to some of the delays. As an insider I blame Stobart but Joe Public will blame Flybe of course.
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Originally Posted by Expressflight
(Post 10175620)
I totally agree with mik3bravo and was caught up in these delays on the DUB route twice last week, although perhaps I as lucky to experience delays of only 2 hours each time. The first was particularly annoying because the delay was shown on the SEN website departure board from early morning so it was planned at least 10 hours ahead, yet I couldn't risk delaying my bag drop beyond normal check-in time. I know as well as anyone how difficult it can be to obtain a replacement aircraft from someone like Jota or Titan at this time of year but they did bring in an Air Bulgaria E190 for an extended period recently and I'm not convinced they couldn't have either extended that or brought in a permanent replacement. As far as the cause of these delays is concerned I couldn't obtain any firm information but it was certainly partly due to the late arrival on fleet of E195 G-FBEN which is still at EXT. I also had the feeling that crewing may have contributed to some of the delays. As an insider I blame Stobart but Joe Public will blame Flybe of course.
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The aircraft at EXT is in the process of being re-registered as EI-GGC so perhaps that is causing the delay. This is the first of the aircraft that Stobart have bought, the others being G-FBEL/EI-GGA and G-FBEM/EI-GGB. The aircraft currently operating at SEN are dry-leased from Flybe apparently and will be replaced by the re-registered aircraft in due course.
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mik3bravo doesn't take any prisoners if he fails to get the service he's paid for. And in my opinion he is correct to focus his ire on Flybe. If I get a happy meal from McDonald's and find my fries are cold or too salty, the thought of who the franchisee may be doesn't enter my head. I have a negative view towards the brand and other fast food outlets are available.
When Stobart expanded their Flybe franchise, I said that Flybe were sharing the risk and was ridiculed at the time for saying so. What does surprise me is that Stobart have allowed this to continue on their no 1 route. Still, FR are taking over SEN-DUB next year. (Come back mik3bravo!) |
Still, FR are taking over SEN-DUB next year |
The delay in the aircraft ian totally not to do with Stobart Air and I’m afraid on this one, knowing what’s happening then this is Flybe’s fault. Any crewing issues are down to the fact they’ve have had to put an extra ATR in the base at very short notice with crew levels sufficient for 2 aircraft not 3. So not only are they are aircraft short they have a surplus of EJET crew and a shortage of ejets and an extra atr and having to bring in crew from elsewhere. Flybe have not done a good job here at all and at least stobart should get credit for trying to keep the operation going ACMI capacity in June in Europe is as rare as hens teeth. |
Originally Posted by cumbrianboy
(Post 10175712)
ACMI capacity in June in Europe is as rare as hens teeth. |
Nothing more infuriating than extended delays and no appropriate contingency plans put in place.
The brand is Flybe, their name is on the plane, on the website and the boarding pass. So Flybe will get the hit for this in terms of backlash. on a different note, maybe a bit of a grand assumption, but with Ryanair now coming to SEN, and sizeable passenger numbers to boot, will Stobart continue with the Flybe franchise? I read above that the contract expires in 2019. Would the aircraft be better displaced onto an ACMI similar to Cityjet with SN and SK? The Stobart arrangement on IOM is ending and BE assuming their own work their, and still some all white scheme ATRs floating around. I'm not convinced for the size of it, and previous behaviour of Stobart (taking the CWL DUB route over in what seemed quite predatory towards its franchise partner) that the arrangement will proceed. Equally, creating an arrangement with Loganair (ex Flybe partner) at Carlisle, doesn't show an appetite to further develop Flybe brand at a new airport... ..thoughts? Again the above is opinion, my opinion, nothing concrete I know from within the industry.. |
Originally Posted by SWBKCB
(Post 10175707)
Has it been confirmed that BE/STK are dropping DUB?
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Originally Posted by DC3 Dave
(Post 10175695)
mik3bravo doesn't take any prisoners if he fails to get the service he's paid for. And in my opinion he is correct to focus his ire on Flybe. If I get a happy meal from McDonald's and find my fries are cold or too salty, the thought of who the franchisee may be doesn't enter my head. I have a negative view towards the brand and other fast food outlets are available.
When Stobart expanded their Flybe franchise, I said that Flybe were sharing the risk and was ridiculed at the time for saying so. What does surprise me is that Stobart have allowed this to continue on their no 1 route. Still, FR are taking over SEN-DUB next year. (Come back mik3bravo!) Should have landed back in SEN last night at 21:45. Will fallout of my car on my driveway at 13:30 today - been none stop and seriously costly trying to get home in time for work meetings later today. I would have been still stuck in DUB with other unfortunate pax most of today trying to get Flybe to sort it out. I like SEN but really feel neither Flybe or Stobart are either capable or trustworthy to put customers at the centre, trust is broken. Will use City until FR start running the SEN to DUB service. I can’t face doing the STN experience in the meantime - it’s like a zoo at STN these days. FR couldn’t come to SEN quick enough if you ask me. |
Originally Posted by Cloud1
(Post 10175420)
Out of interest how is performance on Aurigny’s E195? Back up aircraft have fewer seats which means some pax are left behind when the flight does eventually depart :( |
Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10175758)
Thanks fellas. Ended up with a couple of the other pax getting Aer Lingus redeye this morning from DUB to LGW. Southern Rail rescheduling debacle meant going into Victoria then district to Tower then circle to Liverpool then Greater Anglia back out to SEN to collect the cars pax have parked. All of us are from the SEN catchment area. Should have landed back in SEN last night at 21:45. Will fallout of my car on my driveway at 13:30 today - been none stop and seriously costly trying to get home in time for work meetings later today. I would have been still stuck in DUB with other unfortunate pax most of today trying to get Flybe to sort it out. I like SEN but really feel neither Flybe or Stobart are either capable or trustworthy to put customers at the centre, trust is broken. Will use City until FR start running the SEN to DUB service. I can’t face doing the STN experience in the meantime - it’s like a zoo at STN these days. FR couldn’t come to SEN quick enough if you ask me. |
What did we do in the olden days when you BOAC clipper was cancelled? Did you write a strongly worded note to the Times of London?
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I was on the flight before yours mik3bravo.
There was limited information given at the gate and those passengers who ventured to the gate to ask questions, were handed LRVs for 5 Euro. Those who didn't go to the gate, got nothing and announcements for LRVs were not made. The 1635 departure eventually pushed at 2215. I had flown out to DUB with CityJet from LCY and thought I'd try the Flybe service back to SEN. I wont be doing that again. |
It's a Stobart service, not Flybe. I'm sure there's a Stobart thread on here somewhere.
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Originally Posted by Deano777
(Post 10175868)
It's a Stobart service, not Flybe. I'm sure there's a Stobart thread on here somewhere.
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When you partner with another company, as franchisor or franchisee, this debate just shows how important it is to do due diligence on the robustness of your partner's operation. Eventually, lessons will be learned.
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Originally Posted by Deano777
(Post 10175868)
It's a Stobart service, not Flybe. I'm sure there's a Stobart thread on here somewhere.
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OpsSix it doesn't matter if you paid the Queen for your flight, it's a Stobart Air Service.
Expressflight, who is legally responsible? I've no idea, that's above my pay grade, unless of course your question had a slight rhetorical theme to it? LGS6753 I completely agree, I don't know why there's a need for them to keep getting into bed with other "outfits". There's not many success stories to talk about. |
Actually it does matter as the organisation you pay is a party to the agreement for carriage whether you like it or not. And it should matter to you - assuming you are a Flybe employee - that your company's brand is covering a service with which they are unhappy, since if that happens in sufficient numbers it could put you out of a.job at worst.
That's before we get started on it being an aircraft with Flybe written in large titles down the side of it and still leased by Flybe at this point in time. And the fleet issues in the franchise company are apparently due to late return of a 195 by another airline to its lessor for onward move to the franchisee. I wonder which airline that could be... |
None of that is under scrutiny by me, what is under scrutiny is the notion that Flybe caused the issue. Who you go to for redemption is largely irrelevant. The simple fact of the matter is you were late (or whoever it was that was late) because of Stobart Air, NOT because of Flybe.
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I’ll say it again, the waters are muddied in this instance by the problems being with the E195 routes, both reliability and late delivery, and those aircraft are from BE themselves (and for a time were still operated by them). The performance of the Flybe branded ATR routes (SEN & IOM) is very good, and as far as I’m aware the EIR branded routes are generally fine. Stobart Air overall is not a bad egg tarnishing the brands it works with.
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Originally Posted by OpsSix
(Post 10175912)
Regardless, I paid Flybe for the flight.
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Originally Posted by Expressflight
(Post 10175976)
You and I, plus most on here, know it's a Stobart Air service but to probably 90% plus of paying passengers it's Flybe where the buck stops. From whom do they claim compensation when a flight is delayed or cancelled?
General Conditions of Carriage - 3.5 the carrier Also, the booking site and mobile app clearly state Flybe Ltd. In law, Flybe are responsible for the contact between passenger and carrier. Those routes operated by Stobart Air have specific general conditions of carriage but broadly similar to Flybe. Interestingly, it proves a little tricky for the consumer to access the specifics of the Stobart Air general conditions of carriage as redirects to Aer Lingus regional landing webpage which returns error messages. So again, not consumer focused or transparent or easily accessible to the consumer prior to enterING the contract (buying a ticket). Something the CPA will take a strong view on if it' obviously apparent the carrier is failing to honour their contractual legal responsibility to passengers. |
As Deano777 suggested my 'question' regarding to whom you apply for compensation was rhetorical. Of course it is Flybe that is legally responsible for that.
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Their Annual Results have just been released in RNS.
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What IT project are they referencing thats costing do much?
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presumably new reservation system and self help during disruptions
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The third SEN-based E195, registered EI-GGC ex G-FBEN, arrived at SEN this afternoon and looks like it will go directly into service although Titan are operating the DBV this afternoon. Hopefully this will put an end to the delays and cancellations that have plagued the BE/STK operation at SEN in recent weeks.
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Too little, too late. Done with them. Already booked ahead three return flights out of City to Dublin with Cityjet. We kissed goodbye to Flybe until FR rock up at SEN. Flybe had their chances and blew’em spectacularly. That’s business in the consumer world. Deal with it. |
Originally Posted by Alteagod
(Post 10176487)
What IT project are they referencing thats costing do much?
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Is that just for reservations or how are they rolling it out?
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Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10176832)
Too little, too late. Done with them. Already booked ahead three return flights out of City to Dublin with Cityjet. We kissed goodbye to Flybe until FR rock up at SEN. Flybe had their chances and blew’em spectacularly. That’s business in the consumer world. Deal with it. |
Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10176832)
Too little, too late. Done with them. Already booked ahead three return flights out of City to Dublin with Cityjet. We kissed goodbye to Flybe until FR rock up at SEN. Flybe had their chances and blew’em spectacularly. That’s business in the consumer world. Deal with it. |
Originally Posted by Alteagod
(Post 10176881)
Is that just for reservations or how are they rolling it out?
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