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Oh I think you do know, Chesty, it's amazing how you manipulate your words for the furtherance of making yourself look like a messiah. I think most people on here know how you like to load the gun and wind people up, it's you who's been doing that for years and then accuse people of being passive aggressive when they respond to your diatribe, which, in the grand scheme of things has a slightly sinister nature wrapped around it.
whilst we're on the subject, let's look at it in more detail
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
At least we can be guaranteed of a few things:
1) The new livery will be hailed as a new era for Flybe
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
2) Promises of return to profit
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
3) Loses will continue
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
4)Blame the government for not enough support, and claims train operators get a better deal.
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
5) More claims to solve the problems, and more staff coming and goings.
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
This new livery is an aim to cover the cracks of a failing airline, and a failing CEO.
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
Christine has also failed to explain who will cover the cost of Blue Islands repainting its fleet since all 5 ATR's have only just received the all over purple livery
So whilst there maybe a tiny but of fact in the above, what percentage is actually fact and what percentage is opinion? |
Originally Posted by Deano777
(Post 10242058)
Oh I think you do know, Chesty, it's amazing how you manipulate your words for the furtherance of making yourself look like a messiah. I think most people on here know how you like to load the gun and wind people up, it's you who's been doing that for years and then accuse people of being passive aggressive when they respond to your diatribe, which, in the grand scheme of things has a slightly sinister nature wrapped around it.
whilst we're on the subject, let's look at it in more detail Why are you asking me if Airsouthwest is stating facts or opinion?! Although if I may offer an opinion everything you’ve quoted by Airsouthwest has historically accuracy where Flybe are concerned. As a percentage he’s on about 100. |
Think people are reading more into the repaint than is really there: The company may be spinning it as a rebrand for whatever incidental publicity may be available (very sensible), but I suspect the reason behind it is more practical and mundane. The new livery is simpler, easier, and therefore presumably cheaper to apply, and it was noted during the recent very hot weather that the cabin temperature on the ground of the purple aircraft was higher than that of the others (dark things absorb more heat than light things), so painting the cabin area a light colour is probably a sensible move.
As PDXCWL45 says this appears to be a in-house job with no fanfare about external brand consultants or the like, and the work will probably be done as the aircraft cycle through regular maintenance anyway. |
It's not a great deal simpler than the previous livery, just one colour less but with more complicated application; the purple livery had the advantage that all the masking lines were at the same angle and all quite short. The new one has a couple of angles on the tail and also a long concave curve to the lilac.
I can believe the cabin temperature issue, though somehow Southwest manages to operate blue aeroplanes in Texas and Arizona. |
Originally Posted by Chesty Morgan
You think I’m amazing and have messianic status?! And what is it that you think I do know?
Why are you asking me if Airsouthwest is stating facts or opinion?! Although if I may offer an opinion everything you’ve quoted by Airsouthwest has historically accuracy where Flybe are concerned. As a percentage he’s on about 100. Now either you're completely ignorant or you're doing exactly what I stated up there, manipulation of words, you're an expert at it. Firstly you state I never state facts, so whilst you love facts (on a rumour site) I thought I would ask you what part of what airsouthwest said is fact? Well as you manipulated what was written by saying historically he's 100% right he/she is actually talking about what IS going to happen. Incase that's difficult for you to comprehend I'll help you, future means "a period of time following the moment of speaking or writing; time regarded as still to come". Historical means "of or concerning historical or past events" so he's not on about 100 because the events haven't taken place yet, now unless you're some kind of palm reader or Nostradamus I'd say nobody can actually state what he wrote is true until the event has taken place and in which case if it does indeed turn out to be true then that's called a hunch, or a calculated guess.
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
I've told you before Deano777 my username has nothing to do with Air Southwest the airline! I'm an aircraft engineer who lives in the South West end of! To be honest your just a child. I've previously worked for Flybe and needless to say since Christine took over everything went to pot, Personally the treatment I received by them during a time a close relative of mine was dying of a terminal illness actually caused me to walk away from them for good, so if it comes across that I'm bitter to Flybe that's why.
Personally I don't see any reason why they needed a new livery when 2/3 of your fleet are already in one that has a good 6 years left before needing repainting. I'm sorry for your loss, I really am, I've suffered the same in the last couple of years but my experience was the opposite of yours, one particular manager couldn't do enough so if that's not the case with you then yes, I can understand your bitterness. Well I most certainly agree with your bottom statement, however, needed or not I do like the new livery. |
Originally Posted by Deano777
(Post 10242182)
Hmm your powers of observation clearly needs alot of work. No I didn't say you're amazing or have a messianic status.
Now either you're completely ignorant or you're doing exactly what I stated up there, manipulation of words, you're an expert at it. Firstly you state I never state facts, so whilst you love facts (on a rumour site) I thought I would ask you what part of what airsouthwest said is fact? Well as you manipulated what was written by saying historically he's 100% right he/she is actually talking about what IS going to happen. Incase that's difficult for you to comprehend I'll help you, future means "a period of time following the moment of speaking or writing; time regarded as still to come". Historical means "of or concerning historical or past events" so he's not on about 100 because the events haven't taken place yet, now unless you're some kind of palm reader or Nostradamus I'd say nobody can actually state what he wrote is true until the event has taken place and in which case if it does indeed turn out to be true then that's called a hunch, or a calculated guess. Notwithtanding what you think might hapoen Flybe still has, as a matter of record, hailed a new paint job as a new era, promised a return to profit and on and on and on buzz word buzz word management speak etc blah. There’s no particular reason to think anything else will occur. You know - leopards and spots...a well calculated guess. What’s the profit been like for the last few years out of interest? |
I did see a social media post the other week of the CEO at ATR HQ in Toulouse.
|
Originally Posted by gkmeech
(Post 10236121)
what do you suggest, a dash 8? Same number of seats. What point are you trying to make? |
Originally Posted by JobsaGoodun
(Post 10241689)
Sorry, but is this not a bit contradictory? The full purple livery saw the slogan 'Faster than Road or Rail' plastered on the side of the engine nacelles which you agree is a nonsense, but you state that Flybe does not need a rebrand?
The newly painted aircraft (G-JECP) clearly needed a new coat following repairs carried out recently. Flybe will probably have needed to confirm what livery was to be applied to the new E175's coming from Embraer next year too - should they paint them full purple or not? Personally, I think this a far crisper, cleaner and professional design. it looks business like and is all about helping to define the brand. I guess that with a large number of the fleet coming towards the end of their lease and potentially reaching the point where a new lick of paint is required (new livery or not) now seems like a sensible time to decide to make a change. You believe that this struggling airline will increase its revenue as a consequence of a revbrand to a new crisper image, I agree it is nicer. But I don't see it adding value at this juncture. I dont think my commentary is contradictory, but understand your point. The faster than road and rail is just pained on the engine from memory. Hardly warrants a full fleet rebrand. How much well this cost both in design, paintshop and down time?? And a few new 175s hardly warrants a full rebrand??? Did a single 175 get the existing purple scheme?? EI-BUD |
Originally Posted by RVF750
(Post 10241111)
I quite like it. https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmf...5c621de25b.jpg
This is akin to your wife putting new curtains up, no one notices and it makes sod all difference. What kind of monumental moron thinks your average passenger even notices what colour the metal tube is that takes them from A to B? If they want a rebrand then its the flybe part that needs replacing, not a new colour palette. For me, the largely purple scheme was a masterstroke, eazy own orange, flybe could build a brand around purple. This new scheme looks like a tampon. Just a coincidence I suppose......... Replacing the Q400 with ATR's? As the new CEO, I have done a thorough review of the company, and I have decided that replacing the company's most important USP with something distinctly average and at great expense is the way forward. Sure, we are struggling to even afford to take delivery of 4 175s, but the ATR with its slower speed, more intrusive engines and less range are worth every penny. N.B I do not hate flybe, I hate what they have become. |
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
(Post 10242201)
Thank you Deano, it's appreciated, sadly these day's many people don't even bother or have the heart to say it.
From my own experience it was a particular manager, who is well known as B*tch by a lot of the engineering staff at HQ. I don't want to say much more than that encase anyone knows who i'm talking about. I generally feel sorry for a lot of Flybe staff, apart from a few odd ones, most of them are good people who quite frankly I feel deserve better. My problem with Flybe isn't the airline as in pilots, cabin crew, check-in, ground staff. But those in the offices and higher up who generally seem to think they are better than anyone else and can treat those staff like a piece of dog muck. Whilst Flybe have made small profits in the last years it is only a profit for that specific tax year, in general Flybe still has about £90 Million worth of debt to clear before actually being a profitable airline again, hence why I say, is a brand refresh of a brand which was so heavily pushed by the previous CEO and has become so well known really necessary? If I was running the airline myself, my main priority would be getting by day to day to a profit, sorting out legacy issues, and clearing all debts before doing any kind of rebrand. Issues like the releasing of some Q400s would have probably happened if Saad had stayed on, and I do know he was very determined to remove the E195s, if it wasn't for him there wouldn't be a Flybe anyway, there was only 3 days worth of cash flow when he took charge before they declared bankruptcy, Beside's this its actually been the Aviation Services side that has propped up the entire business for the last 2 years. I do know that Christine very much dislikes the Q400 and wanted to replace them with ATR 72's, but releasing older aircraft was chosen instead, im not sure as to why, Maybe because the stakeholders refused to give her the money to purchase or sign up to a new large leasing agreement for them? You would also have to consider the cost of retraining all your pilots, cabin crew, engineers and other ground staff. As well as buying an ATR 72 simulator for the training academy. Another thing to clear up, In a previous comment I put that Flybe claimed to get an unfair deal compared to train companies, please see: http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/articl...y-compensation |
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
(Post 10242363)
What a rude comment, I do hope you will apologise for it.
|
Originally Posted by EI-BUD
(Post 10242315)
jobsagoodun,
You believe that this struggling airline will increase its revenue as a consequence of a revbrand to a new crisper image, I agree it is nicer. But I don't see it adding value at this juncture. I dont think my commentary is contradictory, but understand your point. The faster than road and rail is just pained on the engine from memory. Hardly warrants a full fleet rebrand. How much well this cost both in design, paintshop and down time?? And a few new 175s hardly warrants a full rebrand??? Did a single 175 get the existing purple scheme?? EI-BUD |
Originally Posted by airsouthwest
Thank you Deano, it's appreciated, sadly these day's many people don't even bother or have the heart to say it.
From my own experience it was a particular manager, who is well known as B*tch by a lot of the engineering staff at HQ. I don't want to say much more than that encase anyone knows who i'm talking about. I generally feel sorry for a lot of Flybe staff, apart from a few odd ones, most of them are good people who quite frankly I feel deserve better. My problem with Flybe isn't the airline as in pilots, cabin crew, check-in, ground staff. But those in the offices and higher up who generally seem to think they are better than anyone else and can treat those staff like a piece of dog muck. Whilst Flybe have made small profits in the last years it is only a profit for that specific tax year, in general Flybe still has about £90 Million worth of debt to clear before actually being a profitable airline again, hence why I say, is a brand refresh of a brand which was so heavily pushed by the previous CEO and has become so well known really necessary? If I was running the airline myself, my main priority would be getting by day to day to a profit, sorting out legacy issues, and clearing all debts before doing any kind of rebrand. Issues like the releasing of some Q400s would have probably happened if Saad had stayed on, and I do know he was very determined to remove the E195s, if it wasn't for him there wouldn't be a Flybe anyway, there was only 3 days worth of cash flow when he took charge before they declared bankruptcy, Beside's this its actually been the Aviation Services side that has propped up the entire business for the last 2 years. I do know that Christine very much dislikes the Q400 and wanted to replace them with ATR 72's, but releasing older aircraft was chosen instead, im not sure as to why, Maybe because the stakeholders refused to give her the money to purchase or sign up to a new large leasing agreement for them? You would also have to consider the cost of retraining all your pilots, cabin crew, engineers and other ground staff. As well as buying an ATR 72 simulator for the training academy. Another thing to clear up, In a previous comment I put that Flybe claimed to get an unfair deal compared to train companies, please see: http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/articl...y-compensation It's a shame that manager was like that, I did experience some really cold dealings with 1 manager giving me the company line etc but I then swapped to another one and it was like chalk and cheese. In your darkest hour of need all you want is support, I was even threatened with disciplinary procedures. I agree, Flybe should really start making money first then once that happens they should put the CAPEX to one side to get all the aircraft repainted within a year or something, now there's going to be 4 liveries flying around for years, the old one, the purple, the new one and the white. I think you're right, buying the ATR or even a regional jet would incur serious expense, expense Flybe simply don't have. New aircraft, even leasing them doesn't come cheep, the disappointing thing is they are throwing more money at the Q400 to improve reliability, do you know how many years I've heard that? Yet here it is, still suffering from tech problems and the fleet isn't getting any younger. When it works it works very, very well but when it doesn't then it's a rocky road towards EU261. Thanks for the link, I read that on LinkedIn yesterday morning. |
Originally Posted by JobsaGoodun
(Post 10242577)
Flybe grew their DH4 fleet rapidly in the period 2006-2010 following the acquisition of BA Connect in 2007. Most of these airframes have operated until this point without a change in livery or repaint and therefore most will require this very soon. I would imagine that all of these visits will have been planned long ago and budgeted for. A repaint would be be required if these aircraft go back to their lessors anyway. The design didn't cost huge bucks as I understand it was completed in-house. All Flybe seem to be doing is choosing an appropriate time in the fleet transition to alter the livery to bring it into line with the current brand, and on aircraft that will need repainting anyway and for which the costs of this work is already planned into the lifetime of the aircraft.
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I think most people would prefer a better OTP & an APP that works rather than another paint job.
Are they still keeping the Thunderbirds cabin crew uniforms? |
The hats went some time ago - shame as I liked them.
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Originally Posted by Mr A Tis
(Post 10242691)
I think most people would prefer a better OTP & an APP that works rather than another paint job.
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Originally Posted by ajamieson
(Post 10243375)
This. So much about the operation remains rinky-dink that customers who value their time still avoid Flybe where there's a choice. Fix that, and the money will come in. Couldn't care less if the fleet was in lessor all-white.
https://news.sky.com/story/flybe-bla...venue-11314945 |
Originally Posted by PDXCWL45
(Post 10243461)
You say that but passenger numbers were up last year by 3.7% and revenue per seat was up by 9% so not an airline that people are avoiding.
https://news.sky.com/story/flybe-bla...venue-11314945 |
Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10243519)
What's the monthly analysis of load factors out of SEN. They have aircraft at SEN which putting it frankly are constantly experiencing technical faults. At this stage, it's beyond a joke. I've heard through grapevine those E195s are sparsely seated over recent months. There is a major issue on those three E195s and their maintenance overheads. Safe in the air, who knows?
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That was a question, not a statement or claim. Just to be legally clear on that.
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I think you'll find it was a rhetorical question and an insinuation with no basis in fact. Perhaps you would rather the airline operated in an unsafe manner with the faults not rectified?
Quite pathetic. |
Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10243519)
What's the monthly analysis of load factors out of SEN. They have aircraft at SEN which putting it frankly are constantly experiencing technical faults. At this stage, it's beyond a joke. I've heard through grapevine those E195s are sparsely seated over recent months. There is a major issue on those three E195s and their maintenance overheads. Safe in the air, who knows?
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Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10243519)
What's the monthly analysis of load factors out of SEN. They have aircraft at SEN which putting it frankly are constantly experiencing technical faults. At this stage, it's beyond a joke. I've heard through grapevine those E195s are sparsely seated over recent months. There is a major issue on those three E195s and their maintenance overheads. Safe in the air, who knows?
|
Originally Posted by tophat27dt
(Post 10243575)
I thought you was going to stop pounding this topic.
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Originally Posted by RVF750
(Post 10241111)
I quite like it. https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmf...5c621de25b.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmf...81bd204fc0.png Pretty obvious :suspect: White and purple is not a good look. |
Are you suggesting gagging anybody asking on an open forum. If it's doing your head in, them go elsewhere buddy. It's really that simple. So I'm afraid put up with it |
Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10243519)
What's the monthly analysis of load factors out of SEN. They have aircraft at SEN which putting it frankly are constantly experiencing technical faults. At this stage, it's beyond a joke. I've heard through grapevine those E195s are sparsely seated over recent months. There is a major issue on those three E195s and their maintenance overheads. Safe in the air, who knows?
|
Originally Posted by mik3bravo
(Post 10243706)
Are you suggesting gagging anybody asking on an open forum. If it's doing your head in, them go elsewhere buddy. It's really that simple. So I'm afraid put up with it
|
Flybe Reliability
I have flown many many times on Flybe over the years and have never had a seriously delay or cancellation. Have I now jinxed that? Graham |
Same here, will be doing my 4th this year in the coming week, no probs so far, but I guess that doesn't make news.
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Correct me if I am wrong, less paint means better fuel consumption, unless of course the repaint is taken back to the undercoat. Just a thought.
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[QUOTE=gkmeech;10243857]
I have flown many many times on Flybe over the years and have never had a seriously delay or cancellation. Have I now jinxed that? [/QUOTEGraham #metoo |
Any News on Stobart franchise? AGM to come.
Flybe timetable is still no longer available on their website. All Stobart operated routes from SEN are currently only bookable until the end of March 19, although their timetable previously contained several destinations after March. This could point to that soon we will see an announcement on a significant change in the relationship between the Stobart and Flybe?
Flybe's AGM will be this week. UBS has just topped up their holding by 1.5p.p. and is now almost 10%. Any views? |
Received a response yesterday regarding the timetable being unavailable online since late August. Just technical - or so they say.
Dear David Thank you for your email in regard to our timetable. I am sorry to hear you have been having difficulties with accessing this online. I can advise that we are aware of the situation, and our IT Department is working on resolving it as soon as possible. In the meantime, you can use the 'Find flights' option to view our available flight times for a particular route and date. We appreciate your patience and understanding in this matter. For future correspondence regarding this case, please quote the reference number and we will be glad to assist you. Kind regards Milena Milena Jankovic - Customer Service Advisor |
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