Teesside-2

[Grumpy1]

Jamesair is correct to mention the war as contributing to the cost of living crisis but Harold seems to believe that it's a typical year in respect the cost of mortgages and not sure that the war has greatly impacted on the number of repossessions or the folks now in debt because of the increase in mortgage costs. Not sure that Covid is still affecting us.

[pug]

Originally Posted by Jamesair1

You are missing out a few 'minor' points...i.e. ..a war in Ukraine and the minor matter of Covid plus seemingly endless strikes

Regardless, air travel bounced back last year after Covid. I alluded to it earlier but I’ll ask now…. How is Teesside Airport going to buck the trend over the last 15+ years of airlines consolidating most of their services into fewer, larger bases?

[Harold77]

Originally Posted by Grumpy1

Harold asks why is this year different from any other year?

My response is to why is this year different. People last year and year before came off fixed rate mortgages with rates high and it is said that mortgage rates are going to start falling again this year after the previous two years. People coming off fixed rate mortgages will still be able to get competitive rates on new deals, as usually case of dropping into next percentage brackets regarding deal rates. Energy prices have come down significantly since last winter and will still drop this year. So why is this year different, People still flew all over the world last year.

[N707ZS]

Also the prices of the flights have increased.

[Bill Darlington]

Yes Ryanair said that prices will be going up another 10% , and economists often mention " confidence in the economy"....I don't see much of that right now, so many folks unhappy on strike and feel underpaid, so perhaps flights will be super price sensitive ,

[P330]

Originally Posted by Bill Darlington

Yes Ryanair said that prices will be going up another 10% , and economists often mention " confidence in the economy"....I don't see much of that right now, so many folks unhappy on strike and feel underpaid, so perhaps flights will be super price sensitive ,

I agree with you Bill. Tough year ahead economically and that will have an impact. Interestingly I read the Jet2 trading update today and it said holidays are proving resilient to economic issues….but there is only so much resilience out there.

[Harold77]

Originally Posted by Bill Darlington

Yes Ryanair said that prices will be going up another 10% , and economists often mention " confidence in the economy"....I don't see much of that right now, so many folks unhappy on strike and feel underpaid, so perhaps flights will be super price sensitive ,

Going up 10% if your fare is £35 that means increase of £3.50, if fare is £70 then increase is £7.

If your set on going on holiday an extra three quid or fifteen quid on your airfare ain't gonna stop people going on holiday. People going on holiday set a budget so extra 15 - 20 isn't going to cause any issues and if as a family it slightly changing some other budgets around. People go on holiday to relax and get away from the UK. Going to take more than 10% to put people off.

[pug]

Originally Posted by Harold77

Going up 10% if your fare is £35 that means increase of £3.50, if fare is £70 then increase is £7.

If your set on going on holiday an extra three quid or fifteen quid on your airfare ain't gonna stop people going on holiday. People going on holiday set a budget so extra 15 - 20 isn't going to cause any issues and if as a family it slightly changing some other budgets around. People go on holiday to relax and get away from the UK. Going to take more than 10% to put people off.

Whats this got to do with Teesside and its inability to generate enough volume?

[Harold77]

Well what relevance does Bill's post have to do with Teesside, as was commenting to his comments.

Since TVCA purchased the airport from Peel, the business has been increasing.

Revenues significantly UP, Highest ever recorded and increasing
Passengers UP
Cargo UP
Aircraft movements UP
Fuel sales UP
Employment UP
Facilities EXPANDING
Companies at airport EXPANDING
Companies locating to the airport

[SWBKCB]

Taxpayer funding UP

[N707ZS]

Originally Posted by Harold77

Going up 10% if your fare is £35 that means increase of £3.50, if fare is £70 then increase is £7.

If your set on going on holiday an extra three quid or fifteen quid on your airfare ain't gonna stop people going on holiday. People going on holiday set a budget so extra 15 - 20 isn't going to cause any issues and if as a family it slightly changing some other budgets around. People go on holiday to relax and get away from the UK. Going to take more than 10% to put people off.

If I were you I would go and look at the fares they have gone up more than 10%.

[Harold77]

Originally Posted by N707ZS

If I were you I would go and look at the fares they have gone up more than 10%.

I was responding to Bill's comment of 10%.

[Harold77]

Originally Posted by SWBKCB

Taxpayer funding UP

Nothing different to other Airports. Take a look up the road at Newcastle Airport, £68m tax payer loans from the local councils a decade ago that are still being repaid. No different to Teesside is it.

[Grumpy1]

Some classics from Harold tonight.

[pug]

Originally Posted by Harold77

Nothing different to other Airports. Take a look up the road at Newcastle Airport, £68m tax payer loans from the local councils a decade ago that are still being repaid. No different to Teesside is it.

Interested how you could compare Newcastle airport with its 2022 passenger figures at over 4 million and likely higher last year, with multiple daily flights to a number of key European and long haul destinations, to Teesside which handled less than 300,000 passengers, the bulk of those on an airline that is most likely being paid to fly from there.

I get it, there’s more to an airport than passengers. But actually, when it comes to the electorate, so they really care about Draken or some paint spraying business? I question the value for money when compared to how it was being run under a private sector operator where it maintained the KLM link and cost the local tax payer nothing.

[SWBKCB]

Some classics from Harold tonight.

I question the value for money when compared to how it was being run under a private sector operator where it maintained the KLM link and cost the local tax payer nothing.

Yes, eventually had to resort to 'whataboutery' and pug is right to pick up on value for money. If you ignore all the Mayoral tomfoolery and shennanigans, you get down to the fundamental issues of spending taxpayers money and there are three concerns:

1. is the money being spent in the right areas? Are you getting the best for Teesside, what's the opportunity cost to the area? Note all talk of 'Global connectivity' and 'if you can't fly there, you won't invest' has disappeared;

2. are you getting value for money - are you spending the money on the right things? Did all that money have to be spent in the terminal, is the freight centre a 'white elephant'?

3. Is the money being spent appropriately - is it being spent in an open and transparent way, are contacts awared fairly, is there competition, are the individual contracts value for money?

[Bill Darlington]

Just think about it, it's not the few extra £ on a flight it the whole holiday has gone up 10% and on a holiday for a family with 2 children,that could mean an extra £400 and if you put that on a credit card, which I'm sure a lot of people do, nowadays because of the cost of living, ........that comes with a 25% interest, ... so now your 2024 holiday really has gone up significantly, I just wonder if it will have some effect...oh I nearly forgot I'm sure holiday insurance will also have risen ,

[pug]

Originally Posted by Bill Darlington

Just think about it, it's not the few extra £ on a flight it the whole holiday has gone up 10% and on a holiday for a family with 2 children,that could mean an extra £400 and if you put that on a credit card, which I'm sure a lot of people do, nowadays because of the cost of living, ........that comes with a 25% interest, ... so now your 2024 holiday really has gone up significantly, I just wonder if it will have some effect...oh I nearly forgot I'm sure holiday insurance will also have risen ,

To add, that is the price of a holiday usually from a busy airport where, as said previously, there is critical mass and a pooled resource which means typically those seats are cheaper. Back in the days of MME and HUY punching above their weight in IT Charter programs, the passengers were charged a premium for flying from their local airport. Doesn’t work that way any more really.

[Harold77]

Originally Posted by Bill Darlington

Just think about it, it's not the few extra £ on a flight it the whole holiday has gone up 10% and on a holiday for a family with 2 children,that could mean an extra £400 and if you put that on a credit card, which I'm sure a lot of people do, nowadays because of the cost of living, ........that comes with a 25% interest, ... so now your 2024 holiday really has gone up significantly, I just wonder if it will have some effect...oh I nearly forgot I'm sure holiday insurance will also have risen ,

You said Ryanair prices rising by 10% for which I commented on. Now you are changing your tune to include whole holiday deal. Since when was Ryanair responsible for holidays, they only do flights and nothing anything else.

So my comments were about you inferring that Ryanair's 10% fare increase would have ramifications. It didn't refer to anything else other than the fare increase.

So please don't take my comments by adding anything other to than what I was replying about.

If you want to have included other stuff then you should have made that clear originally. Then my reply to your original comment would have reflected to what you said.

[Grumpy1]

Thanks to the last couple of posters for introducing some sanity. Based on his comments last night, Harold seems to operate in a world where mortgages (and presumably rents) have not gone up dramatically, the masive increase in utility bills are not impacting on families with the rising cost of a family holiday limited to the increased cost of a ticket for one.
The increased parking charges at MME (that the mayor forgot to anounce) means that it could now be less expensive to drive to LBA or NCL where the air fares and the cost of a package is generally less expensive.
Incidentally, although the mayor is still telling drivers who object to being charged to drop off to "buy a coffee" it seems that the minimum spend is now £5!!! Ouch.