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Southampton-2

Old 7th May 2020, 17:56
  #2261 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Groundloop View Post
Just being pedantic - there is no Outer Marker on the ILS these.
Yes, I know...
Edited...
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Old 7th May 2020, 17:59
  #2262 (permalink)  
 
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I think the real reason behind Southampton development plans is to unlock the land east of the 20 threshold for development. The runway extension is a bonus.
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Old 7th May 2020, 18:10
  #2263 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Groundloop View Post
Just being pedantic - there is no Outer Marker on the ILS these.
When there was an Outer Marker it was located in the sewage treatment works at Chilcomb, just east of the M3. Strange place to live!
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Old 7th May 2020, 18:13
  #2264 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Mickey Kaye View Post
I think the real reason behind Southampton development plans is to unlock the land east of the 20 threshold for development. The runway extension is a bonus.
With the extension in place it will compound access to the east side unless the rail yard operator is going to sell off some of their land.
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Old 7th May 2020, 18:20
  #2265 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TCAS FAN View Post
When there was an Outer Marker it was located in the sewage treatment works at Chilcomb, just east of the M3. Strange place to live!
He He, we've all got our dream home ideas TCAS FAN...

Yep, I'm actually about a mile W of there. So, not really even on the OM even if it was, which it isn't, still there.
I know that sewage works well - you get a lung full as you head up out of Winch on the Morestead Road when the winds are right - or wrong!
Then, if the red flags are afluttering when you get to the apex of the hill you need to watch out for stray lead from the ATR shooting range down below.

Last edited by Auxtank; 7th May 2020 at 18:30.
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Old 7th May 2020, 18:34
  #2266 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
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Originally Posted by TCAS FAN View Post
With the extension in place it will compound access to the east side unless the rail yard operator is going to sell off some of their land.
And THAT is the question.
I thought the rail yard works were being a quiet success story - more servicing, refurbs, etc, and being viewed as valuable - and mostly importantly - a viable asset these days to NR.

One has to admit that that patch of land between Hedge End and SOU is infill and ineveitably, one day it will be infilled.
Depressing.
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Old 7th May 2020, 23:02
  #2267 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
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Just maybe with improvements to Marlhill Copse easing airfield restrictions slightly, CDG and AMS will enter on the radar of EZY for route re-introductions, time will tell who picks these up!
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Old 8th May 2020, 12:39
  #2268 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Rivet Joint View Post
Anyone would think there was an international health crisis and a government enforced lockdown in place.....

To all the doom merchants on here you might want to look how the crisis has affected even the likes of LHR before singling our SOU. You could of course focus on the fact that the long term tree issue at Marhill Copse is finally being dealt with or that the planning application for the runway extension is still full steam ahead despite the crisis. Not to mention the fact a lot of BEs routes were back filled within a few weeks of BE going bust. I guess some people just live a glass half empty life.

It looks to me increasingly likely that SOU has potentially done a deal with a low cost operator to open up a base at SOU conditional on the runway being extended. I am not saying that this is definitely the case, but pension funds rarely make large investments in assets without a solid return being locked in. It might well be that It is just a speculative investment, but the fact it’s being pursued in a crisis might suggest that the business case/financial reward is still contractually in place. Whilst the aviation industry is going to take time to recover, it always does. 9/11 is the perfect example.
I would agree with this.

It does seem like easyJet may be on the cards with perhaps a few aircraft to be based at SOU for services to AMS and CDG but also aircraft based around their network in the likes of GLA and EDI flying into SOU. It could be quite a large potential base and wouldn't take too many aircraft (possible 3 at SOU and 3 around the UK?) to take SOU's passenger traffic to 2m or so. They would do well on SOU-BFS, SOU-MAN and SOU-NCL too. Strategically it makes a lot of sense - BRS catchment doesn't really overlap at SOU but they have no presence at LHR so this would be very welcome competition for BA there for people living in the Central South. LGW access is not as good as LHR for this catchment.

I really believe that these types of routes are not suitable to Eastern Airways or Loganair anymore. Loganair needs to be focusing on its core Scottish route network providing lifeline services if they are to come out of this crisis alive.
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Old 8th May 2020, 13:29
  #2269 (permalink)  
 
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I think the comment regarding LHR is probably key.

On many threads there is talk of retrenchment by the likes of BA (possibly) and Virgin back to LHR, and what, if any, impact this will have on the other London airports. Will there be a shift to LGW from STN, LTN and SEN and will they suffer as a result?
Right now, nobody really knows and as I have said elsewhere, until there is some kind of global policy on the way forward it is extremely tough for airlines, airports and associated third party industries that support them to plan their ways out.
However, I do think that the general mood music towards a reduced level of traffic for the next two to four years is probably correct. With EZY currently suggesting a reduction in fleet size for the next few years coupled with the recession we are now entering, their concentration will be on LGW and existing bases, not risking new ventures such as SOU.
Every crisis offers opportunities and the likes of Wizz are looking to expand their way out of this but what I see of EZY suggests they are not in that mindset right now. With Wizz looking to hoover up any spare slots at LGW my guess is they will look to protect that base at all costs, even through the downsizing of LTN, STN or SEN. They won't have spare aircraft for new routes any time soon.
Not looking to be anti-SOU. I like the airport, have used it in the past and believe it has a future. However, like the entire aviation sector, it will need to be patient and realistic in it's expectations for the next few years.
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Old 8th May 2020, 13:35
  #2270 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
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I want SOU to thrive as much as the next man but surely there isn't the physical space for either easyjet or another lo co to base aircraft there?
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Old 8th May 2020, 14:05
  #2271 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2009
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Not practically at the moment - part of the airport development plan is to change stands 1-5 over to 4 equal sized stands which will each be able to accommodate an A320/737 sized aircraft.
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Old 8th May 2020, 16:00
  #2272 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sharklet_321 View Post
I would agree with this.

It does seem like easyJet may be on the cards with perhaps a few aircraft to be based at SOU for services to AMS and CDG but also aircraft based around their network in the likes of GLA and EDI flying into SOU. It could be quite a large potential base and wouldn't take too many aircraft (possible 3 at SOU and 3 around the UK?) to take SOU's passenger traffic to 2m or so. They would do well on SOU-BFS, SOU-MAN and SOU-NCL too. Strategically it makes a lot of sense - BRS catchment doesn't really overlap at SOU but they have no presence at LHR so this would be very welcome competition for BA there for people living in the Central South. LGW access is not as good as LHR for this catchment.

I really believe that these types of routes are not suitable to Eastern Airways or Loganair anymore. Loganair needs to be focusing on its core Scottish route network providing lifeline services if they are to come out of this crisis alive.
unfortunately a lot of people choose to post flippant comments without carrying out any research. The internet has existed for a long time and has the answer for most questions if you look hard enough. Of course this is forum and everyoneís opinions are welcome but negativeness on this thread has got out of hand.

The land to the north east is undoubtedly a cash cow for SOU and will unfortunately be wasted on a load of metal sheds to store stuff with a tiny amount of associated employment. In terms of access, an extension of the road to the car parks is planned along the north of the airport land (interestingly it appears to be under a further extended runway in the plan for 2037). It is not clear whether this is the long talked about Chickenhall link road but either way the current planning does not include any mention of a road. Therefore you have to assume that the runway planning is purely associated with generating capital from flights.

LM and T3 will just be at SOU in the interim, once a low cost operator moves in they will probably just serve the odd route that does not have any competition. The comment about LGW is a valid one, why would EZY for example open a base in SOU if they are potentially reducing their LGW base. The point I was making in my previous post was that they or someone else could be under contract to open a base conditional on SOU getting its planning. Itís just a though and there would probably be get out clauses but a crisis of this nature would be very unlikely to be have considered at the time any contract was agreed. Saying that, the stands as someone else has said are pretty key to basing larger aircraft, together with changes to the security, baggage etc. Letís see, but this area of the country is very wealthy and are likely to be relatively unaffected financially by the crisis.
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Old 9th May 2020, 21:56
  #2273 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Auxtank View Post
I want SOU to thrive as much as the next man but surely there isn't the physical space for either easyjet or another lo co to base aircraft there?
There is space - no more flybe. There are at least 3 or 4 stands capable of 320 size at any one time and you donít need that many movements to deliver 2m pax each year with 186 seats on each flight.

For domestic flights you wouldnít even need a runway extension.
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Old 10th May 2020, 20:00
  #2274 (permalink)  
 
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Dreams V Reality

Its worth remembering that the current runway has limitations for the current fleet of aircraft using SOU, ie the ATR (along with even the mighty Dash) is heavily restricted departing runway 20 on all days, only made worse on hotter days. The small extension planned would no doubt benefit the current operators over any possible future operators more and open up opportunities for them. LM CEO has even said this about his mixed fleet!

Its probably best people dont get there hopes up to much regarding EZY, would they really be bothered about SOU? Aurigny, Loganair, Eastern and Blue Islands will no doubt be the backbone that keeps SOU alive for the foreseeable future.
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Old 10th May 2020, 21:49
  #2275 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wanna View Post
Its worth remembering that the current runway has limitations for the current fleet of aircraft using SOU, ie the ATR (along with even the mighty Dash) is heavily restricted departing runway 20 on all days, only made worse on hotter days. The small extension planned would no doubt benefit the current operators over any possible future operators more and open up opportunities for them. LM CEO has even said this about his mixed fleet!

Its probably best people dont get there hopes up to much regarding EZY, would they really be bothered about SOU? Aurigny, Loganair, Eastern and Blue Islands will no doubt be the backbone that keeps SOU alive for the foreseeable future.
Well if you right wanna lets hope that Loganair, Eastern and Blue Islands can survive this COVID-19 disaster and can get back to flying again, whenever that will be. I expect Aurigny will get through this as it is state owned by the Guernsey goverment/taxpayers.
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Old 15th May 2020, 18:25
  #2276 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Southampton, U.K
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Post Covid Update

Since there is now a little more information on the easing of lockdown restrictions it looks like airlines and airports are beginning to plan for a return to (domestic) service from June more thoroughly than we have seen so far.

Aurigny

- Normal schedule now to resume on 01/09 following the plan for lockdown easing in the Bailiwick of Guernsey announced earlier this week.
- 14 weekly flights to GCI and 14 to ACI currently bookable from 01/09.
- 5 weekly 'essential travel only' SOU-GCI to continue as now until then. E195 being used occasionally to keep crew training up to speed.

Blue Islands

- No updates this week, 29 weekly flights to GCI and 23 weekly to JER due to resume from 29/06. The GCI flights are almost certain to be pushed back based on the Aurigny changes.
- 3 weekly 'essential travel only' SOU-JER to continue as now until then.

Eastern Airways

- Website updated this morning, normal scheduled flights now due to resume from 08/06.
- Full schedule is bookable out of SOU from that date (MAN 17 weekly, LBA 15 weekly, NCL 11 weekly, MME 10 weekly, BHD 7 weekly).
- I expect this will be adjusted down to a reduced schedule (single daily flight to each destination at most?) for at least the first few weeks as demand is going to be somewhat suppressed.
- SOU-DUB start date still tbc.

easyJet

- SOU-GVA on sale 2x weekly starting back up in December as usual.

Loganair

- Schedule for June has been updated this week, some routes dropped and seasonal routes cancelled until next year.
- SOU routes all start/restart from 15/06 - EDI, GLA and NCL all to operate 6x weekly (no Sat) late afternoon departures on ER3/4 aircraft.
- Full schedule currently due to resume from 06/07 (EDI 26 weekly, GLA 25 weekly both on AT7's, NCL 18 weekly ER3/4) although this is likely still subject to change.

TUI

- All holidays before 11/06 cancelled.
- SOU PMI bookable from 16/06 onwards at the moment.
- Govt hoping to allow EU tourists from the end of June. Depending on where the UK sits compared to this it does not seem impossible that this may operate from July or August for a (very) short season. https://www.majorcadailybulletin.com...orca-june.html
- SOU-PMI on sale 2x weekly from May 2021.
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Old 15th May 2020, 19:50
  #2277 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Cheshire
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Originally Posted by adfly View Post
Since there is now a little more information on the easing of lockdown restrictions it looks like airlines and airports are beginning to plan for a return to (domestic) service from June more thoroughly than we have seen so far.

Aurigny

- Normal schedule now to resume on 01/09 following the plan for lockdown easing in the Bailiwick of Guernsey announced earlier this week.
- 14 weekly flights to GCI and 14 to ACI currently bookable from 01/09.
- 5 weekly 'essential travel only' SOU-GCI to continue as now until then. E195 being used occasionally to keep crew training up to speed.

Blue Islands

- No updates this week, 29 weekly flights to GCI and 23 weekly to JER due to resume from 29/06. The GCI flights are almost certain to be pushed back based on the Aurigny changes.
- 3 weekly 'essential travel only' SOU-JER to continue as now until then.

Eastern Airways

- Website updated this morning, normal scheduled flights now due to resume from 08/06.
- Full schedule is bookable out of SOU from that date (MAN 17 weekly, LBA 15 weekly, NCL 11 weekly, MME 10 weekly, BHD 7 weekly).
- I expect this will be adjusted down to a reduced schedule (single daily flight to each destination at most?) for at least the first few weeks as demand is going to be somewhat suppressed.
- SOU-DUB start date still tbc.

easyJet

- SOU-GVA on sale 2x weekly starting back up in December as usual.

Loganair

- Schedule for June has been updated this week, some routes dropped and seasonal routes cancelled until next year.
- SOU routes all start/restart from 15/06 - EDI, GLA and NCL all to operate 6x weekly (no Sat) late afternoon departures on ER3/4 aircraft.
- Full schedule currently due to resume from 06/07 (EDI 26 weekly, GLA 25 weekly both on AT7's, NCL 18 weekly ER3/4) although this is likely still subject to change.

TUI

- All holidays before 11/06 cancelled.
- SOU PMI bookable from 16/06 onwards at the moment.
- Govt hoping to allow EU tourists from the end of June. Depending on where the UK sits compared to this it does not seem impossible that this may operate from July or August for a (very) short season. https://www.majorcadailybulletin.com...orca-june.html
- SOU-PMI on sale 2x weekly from May 2021.
So are Eastern and Loganair both going to do SOU- NCL ??!
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Old 15th May 2020, 19:51
  #2278 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 120
Originally Posted by adfly View Post
Since there is now a little more information on the easing of lockdown restrictions it looks like airlines and airports are beginning to plan for a return to (domestic) service from June more thoroughly than we have seen so far.

Aurigny

- Normal schedule now to resume on 01/09 following the plan for lockdown easing in the Bailiwick of Guernsey announced earlier this week.
- 14 weekly flights to GCI and 14 to ACI currently bookable from 01/09.
- 5 weekly 'essential travel only' SOU-GCI to continue as now until then. E195 being used occasionally to keep crew training up to speed.

Blue Islands

- No updates this week, 29 weekly flights to GCI and 23 weekly to JER due to resume from 29/06. The GCI flights are almost certain to be pushed back based on the Aurigny changes.
- 3 weekly 'essential travel only' SOU-JER to continue as now until then.

Eastern Airways

- Website updated this morning, normal scheduled flights now due to resume from 08/06.
- Full schedule is bookable out of SOU from that date (MAN 17 weekly, LBA 15 weekly, NCL 11 weekly, MME 10 weekly, BHD 7 weekly).
- I expect this will be adjusted down to a reduced schedule (single daily flight to each destination at most?) for at least the first few weeks as demand is going to be somewhat suppressed.
- SOU-DUB start date still tbc.

easyJet

- SOU-GVA on sale 2x weekly starting back up in December as usual.

Loganair

- Schedule for June has been updated this week, some routes dropped and seasonal routes cancelled until next year.
- SOU routes all start/restart from 15/06 - EDI, GLA and NCL all to operate 6x weekly (no Sat) late afternoon departures on ER3/4 aircraft.
- Full schedule currently due to resume from 06/07 (EDI 26 weekly, GLA 25 weekly both on AT7's, NCL 18 weekly ER3/4) although this is likely still subject to change.

TUI

- All holidays before 11/06 cancelled.
- SOU PMI bookable from 16/06 onwards at the moment.
- Govt hoping to allow EU tourists from the end of June. Depending on where the UK sits compared to this it does not seem impossible that this may operate from July or August for a (very) short season. https://www.majorcadailybulletin.com...orca-june.html
- SOU-PMI on sale 2x weekly from May 2021.
So are Eastern and Loganair both going to do SOU- NCL ??!
BACsuperVC10 is offline  
Old 15th May 2020, 20:19
  #2279 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Dorset
Posts: 256
So are Eastern and Loganair both going to do SOU- NCL ??!
If they do, recent history suggests there will only be one winner. Loganair are 8-0 up in that grudge match at the moment (I think that's the score anyway!) so it's not obvious why Eastern think they'll win this one and keep fighting. You'd think that out of all of the Flybe routes sitting vacant that they could find something better to do without another fight.
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Old 15th May 2020, 20:57
  #2280 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 71
Originally Posted by BACsuperVC10 View Post
So are Eastern and Loganair both going to do SOU- NCL ??!
Eastern Airways announced SOU - NCL soon as flybe went in administration and started flights from SOU - NCL on 9th March x11 a week
Loganair announced SOU - NCL soon as flybe went in administration and started flights from SOU - NCL on 23rd March x18 a week

cant see both staying on same route
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