LUTON -8
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True but totally co-incidental according to my source, there is (obviously) a tech reason for the ILS downgrade but it's not the car park.
DUE TO ROLLOUT GUIDANCE BEND APPROACHING AND JUST BEYOND TOUCHDOWN ZONE RWY 08/26 ILS HAS BEEN DOWNGRADED TO CAT3A
Having no technical knowledge of how an ILS would get a kink in the signal at both ends if it wasn't caused by the multistory car park I would struggle to see what else would cause it.
Anybody considered the implications on the ILS (if any) of the mass transit rail link going so close to the 08 threshold as well ?
There is another hotel planned to go in further up the hill on the Ibis roundabout opposite the Ibis
Last edited by LTNman; 29th Oct 2016 at 22:03.
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There is approved planning permission for hotels either side of the one currently under construction. Here's a composite picture based on the plans from Luton's planning website (roughly pieced together with my limited photoshop skills!)
What a dump.
Dropped a pax off the other day, and decided to splash out on the £3 drop off tax. Traffic was flowing nicely up to the new multistorey.
I then queued for a bit to get round the first left hand bend off the drop off. Pax quickly jumped out. Queued to cross the first pedestrian crossing. Queued to cross the second pedestrian crossing. Joined an almost stationary queue to get out. This dribbled all the way round the short stay and took 13 minutes. Total time in the paid part...?
19 minutes.
The charges are £3 for 10 minutes plus £1 per minute after that. So that'll be.... £12.
I see now why the pay barrier is miles away. Allows them to charge for sitting in their massive queue.
Ready for an argument I was relieved to see the barriers were up and they were just waving through the angry drivers.
Dropped a pax off the other day, and decided to splash out on the £3 drop off tax. Traffic was flowing nicely up to the new multistorey.
I then queued for a bit to get round the first left hand bend off the drop off. Pax quickly jumped out. Queued to cross the first pedestrian crossing. Queued to cross the second pedestrian crossing. Joined an almost stationary queue to get out. This dribbled all the way round the short stay and took 13 minutes. Total time in the paid part...?
19 minutes.
The charges are £3 for 10 minutes plus £1 per minute after that. So that'll be.... £12.
I see now why the pay barrier is miles away. Allows them to charge for sitting in their massive queue.
Ready for an argument I was relieved to see the barriers were up and they were just waving through the angry drivers.
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There are normally no queues at the barriers so the fact that you had to wait and the barrier was up suggests the paymemt system had gone off line.
Also unless anyone knows different I don't think the airport has any means at the moment of charging the per minute fee as there is no number plate reader on the approach road or in the drop off area. Well none I can find and I have had a good look!
So is the multi story car park but the protected area is not the issue.
Also unless anyone knows different I don't think the airport has any means at the moment of charging the per minute fee as there is no number plate reader on the approach road or in the drop off area. Well none I can find and I have had a good look!
Hotel is outside the protected area for the ILS.
Last edited by LTNman; 30th Oct 2016 at 16:02.
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Dropping off passengers by car
I use to disagree with charges for dropping off passengers at the airport but based on how busy it has become these days, if there was no fees then many drivers would literally be hanging around and there would be more problems with traffic flows.
However an issue I have is people turning up in my street with already limited parking for residents and then getting out of their cars and waiting with their luggage to be picked up by taxi and no doubt heading for the airport!
Many streets in Luton are experiencing the same problems which is having a detrimental effect on people living in this town.
The only way this can be remedied is for all streets to be resident parking permit only which then leaves us paying for permits-unless the council agree to supply permits free of charge knowing airport passengers would then have to pay for car parking?
Once the new rail link is opened it could be promoted for drop off passengers as well as train passengers alike-thus greatly reducing traffic to the terminal?
However an issue I have is people turning up in my street with already limited parking for residents and then getting out of their cars and waiting with their luggage to be picked up by taxi and no doubt heading for the airport!
Many streets in Luton are experiencing the same problems which is having a detrimental effect on people living in this town.
The only way this can be remedied is for all streets to be resident parking permit only which then leaves us paying for permits-unless the council agree to supply permits free of charge knowing airport passengers would then have to pay for car parking?
Once the new rail link is opened it could be promoted for drop off passengers as well as train passengers alike-thus greatly reducing traffic to the terminal?
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I believe that LTN has the lowest proportion of PAX using public transport - not sure whether that refers to all the London airports or to all airports of its size. Above a certain size, it isn't possible to build more and more on-site carparks, you have to get 'persuade' PAX to use coaches or trains.
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Set down area and parking. I have used the set down area 6 times this year at all times of the day. Busy every time but twice had problems. Both with taxi drivers deciding to stop to pick up right on the return bend in the centre of the through lane. I pointed out to one of them the error of his ways. Was he bothered? This was a scenario posted by LTN man some time ago. I do not see what all the fuss is about a set down charge. Part of life in a commercial world. I live north of Wardown Park. Airport parking has arrived here. Actually saw the car park, when the taxi turned up 2 people and cases changed vehicles. The car was parked for two weeks. Very little you can do about these things.
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Any driver parking close to the airport particularly down Eton Green Road can expect to find their car somewhat modified by angry locals if it is parked there for a few days.
The new drop off area, which isn't at its full length yet, has been suffering from motorists parking up for long periods as they again wait for passengers. This problem all but disappeared when the pay barriers were at the end of each drop off lane but with the pay barriers at the other end of the CTA many motorists don't know that the charges still remain. I still hold the belief that no one is charged more than the standard £3 at the moment but that might change later on as apart from a tiny sign on the bend to the entrance the charges are not mentioned anywhere else and as I have already pointed out I can't find a number plate reader to record arrival times.
At the moment this doesn't seem to cause too many problems as there is plenty of kerbside apart from the desire of motorists to drop off as soon as they can on arriving in the drop off area and passengers to wait at the closest point to the terminal instead of spreading themselves down the drop off area.
Also the recovery truck that used to lift cars that had been left unattended has not been around since the drop off zone was moved several months ago so it is not uncommon to see cars parked up for extended periods while the driver wanders into the terminal.
The airport are planning to build another multistory car park at the other end of the transit system by Parkway which would allow passengers to use the link to get to the terminal.
The new drop off area, which isn't at its full length yet, has been suffering from motorists parking up for long periods as they again wait for passengers. This problem all but disappeared when the pay barriers were at the end of each drop off lane but with the pay barriers at the other end of the CTA many motorists don't know that the charges still remain. I still hold the belief that no one is charged more than the standard £3 at the moment but that might change later on as apart from a tiny sign on the bend to the entrance the charges are not mentioned anywhere else and as I have already pointed out I can't find a number plate reader to record arrival times.
At the moment this doesn't seem to cause too many problems as there is plenty of kerbside apart from the desire of motorists to drop off as soon as they can on arriving in the drop off area and passengers to wait at the closest point to the terminal instead of spreading themselves down the drop off area.
Also the recovery truck that used to lift cars that had been left unattended has not been around since the drop off zone was moved several months ago so it is not uncommon to see cars parked up for extended periods while the driver wanders into the terminal.
Above a certain size, it isn't possible to build more and more on-site carparks,
Last edited by LTNman; 31st Oct 2016 at 21:59.
Paxing All Over The World
Slight thread drift but to answer the problem
Lee Baker Street
I have seen this elsewhere and it requires concerted effort by the residents. Yes it will take time but here is (briefly) an experience from Watford about 12 years ago.
The local railways station upped their parking charges and, overnight, cars spilled out on to the surrounding streets with people abandoning their cars and walking up to a mile to the station.
We and others, started to document what happend. We took photographs and noted numbers of cars. We showed how they obstructed our driveways and endangered the lives of other road users.
It took a year but we got double yellow lines and notices painted. PM me if you want as the problem you have is even worse, with people leaving their cars for days. Your Council need to be tasked with this. Polite persistence is the key.
Lee Baker Street
... with already limited parking for residents and then getting out of their cars and waiting with their luggage to be picked up by taxi and no doubt heading for the airport!
The local railways station upped their parking charges and, overnight, cars spilled out on to the surrounding streets with people abandoning their cars and walking up to a mile to the station.
We and others, started to document what happend. We took photographs and noted numbers of cars. We showed how they obstructed our driveways and endangered the lives of other road users.
It took a year but we got double yellow lines and notices painted. PM me if you want as the problem you have is even worse, with people leaving their cars for days. Your Council need to be tasked with this. Polite persistence is the key.
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MPT
I went to the MPT consultation at the Hilton hotel this evening. There were more detailed plans and I had some good conversations with staff there. I got the following info:
- Confirmed that the MPT will be in an underground tunnel from the Eastern edge of the medium term car park, under taxiway alpha, all the way into the CTA.
- The CTA station will be under the current drop off zone at a depth of c. 9 meters.
- Expectation that there will be still be a charge similar to current bus fare, but will promote through ticketing.
- In discussion with network rail, but hope to have the rail gate-line at the airport station, i.e. won't have to go through an intermediate gate-line when transferring from the MPT to Thameslink at the Parkway interchange.
- I was told the airport owners expect to put in a planning application for a second multi-storey car park in the CTA in the next 12 months.
- Airport intend to move the drop-off zone into the multi-storey car park (not sure if this will be the current one, or new one). Recognise a major complaint about the current drop off zone being exposed to the weather.
- Second, much wider pedestrian bridge at parkway station between platforms to link to the MPT station, with escalators planned from the platforms.
- Project to be constructed in a way to maintain dual-carriageway access to/from the airport at all times.
That's about as much as I can remember. One of the people I spoke to hoped that the slightly more detailed plans (ahead of the formal planning application) will be added to the website in due course.
Overall the plans seem pretty well considered. I didn't ask about the stupid gateway bridge design, which I assume is just an architect having some fun.
- Confirmed that the MPT will be in an underground tunnel from the Eastern edge of the medium term car park, under taxiway alpha, all the way into the CTA.
- The CTA station will be under the current drop off zone at a depth of c. 9 meters.
- Expectation that there will be still be a charge similar to current bus fare, but will promote through ticketing.
- In discussion with network rail, but hope to have the rail gate-line at the airport station, i.e. won't have to go through an intermediate gate-line when transferring from the MPT to Thameslink at the Parkway interchange.
- I was told the airport owners expect to put in a planning application for a second multi-storey car park in the CTA in the next 12 months.
- Airport intend to move the drop-off zone into the multi-storey car park (not sure if this will be the current one, or new one). Recognise a major complaint about the current drop off zone being exposed to the weather.
- Second, much wider pedestrian bridge at parkway station between platforms to link to the MPT station, with escalators planned from the platforms.
- Project to be constructed in a way to maintain dual-carriageway access to/from the airport at all times.
That's about as much as I can remember. One of the people I spoke to hoped that the slightly more detailed plans (ahead of the formal planning application) will be added to the website in due course.
Overall the plans seem pretty well considered. I didn't ask about the stupid gateway bridge design, which I assume is just an architect having some fun.
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MTS
I had an interesting talk with a guy in the know at the Mass Transit consultation. The key points are as follows:
The cut and cover tunnel under Taxiway Alpha will be continued all the way through the CTA to the station.
The terminal station will be underground but will be open to let in natural light and will be covered by 3 parasol structures. The entrance to the station at ground level will be enclosed by smaller but similar parasol structures.
The station will be located inside the yet to be finished drop off zone. (This is different to what clearland08 was told)
The drop off zone will be moved further away into the short term car park.
The new cores and passenger foot bridges that are yet to open won't be able to handle the extra foot traffic from the relocated drop off zone but a solution hasn't been decided yet.
The cut and cover tunnel under Taxiway Alpha will be continued all the way through the CTA to the station.
The terminal station will be underground but will be open to let in natural light and will be covered by 3 parasol structures. The entrance to the station at ground level will be enclosed by smaller but similar parasol structures.
The station will be located inside the yet to be finished drop off zone. (This is different to what clearland08 was told)
The drop off zone will be moved further away into the short term car park.
The new cores and passenger foot bridges that are yet to open won't be able to handle the extra foot traffic from the relocated drop off zone but a solution hasn't been decided yet.
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The station will be located inside the yet to be finished drop off zone. (This is different to what clearland08 was told.
I also asked about frequency and one of the guys told me that definitely 2 trains in each direction, i.e. aiming for a shuttle taking 5 mins leaving every 5 mins, but possibility to have 3 trains each way.
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The CTA with the new station located in the drop off zone.
Note the building holding up the passenger footbridge on the terminal side will be removed and replaced by a new building that will sit south of the station. As already stated the footbridges will not be able to handle all the passengers from the relocated drop off zone as the building in the short term car park only has 2 lifts and the staircases and bridges are not wide enough. Also do passengers really want to lug luggage up any sort of staircase?
The railway will cross the mid term car park in a trough.
Parkway will get another bridge crossing the tracks to serve the MTS
The gateway bridge will be in a cutting when it crosses the road. It will be lit in LED's as flood lighting would interfere with landing aircraft.
Note the building holding up the passenger footbridge on the terminal side will be removed and replaced by a new building that will sit south of the station. As already stated the footbridges will not be able to handle all the passengers from the relocated drop off zone as the building in the short term car park only has 2 lifts and the staircases and bridges are not wide enough. Also do passengers really want to lug luggage up any sort of staircase?
The railway will cross the mid term car park in a trough.
Parkway will get another bridge crossing the tracks to serve the MTS
The gateway bridge will be in a cutting when it crosses the road. It will be lit in LED's as flood lighting would interfere with landing aircraft.
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I was told the airport owners expect to put in a planning application for a second multi-storey car park in the CTA in the next 12 months.
Reference the crossing of the approach road from the new drop off zone to be located in the short term car park. This would only work if passengers had a gentle slope to climb. There is no way several thousand passengers an hour could be expected to climb stairs in safety.
One thing is for sure and that is the airport is in for another 5 years of building work. Cut and cover into the CTA is going to be a messy business with a great deal of soil to be removed from the route and underground station. The approach road and exit is going to have to be realigned several times during construction of the MTS.
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Flippin Heck... Where is All The Copenhagen Demand Coming From?
I have a few days off work and was planning a last minute weekend trip to Copenhagen...
Just looked on easyJet and Ryanair, most there flights this weekend are sold out!
While I am sure they are piling passengers on the flights for sub-£20 fares, the flights that are still available are £140+ each way and only 3-4 seats left on the flight.
This also applies to the Friday and Monday flights too.
Looks like it might be a quick trip to Gran Canaria instead with fares for £87 return, this weekend!
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On another note, just noticed on the Blue Island thread and seems a Luton to Guernsey route going to be announced imminently!
Just looked on easyJet and Ryanair, most there flights this weekend are sold out!
While I am sure they are piling passengers on the flights for sub-£20 fares, the flights that are still available are £140+ each way and only 3-4 seats left on the flight.
This also applies to the Friday and Monday flights too.
Looks like it might be a quick trip to Gran Canaria instead with fares for £87 return, this weekend!
----------------------------------------------
On another note, just noticed on the Blue Island thread and seems a Luton to Guernsey route going to be announced imminently!
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All because of Leicester playing Copenhagen. The 1st 2nd and 3rd of November has had 5 flights by Ryanair and 4 by easy jet. To make it better both ways are sold out on all 3 days. Will easyjet be announcing CPH tomorrow in the summer flights or has it finally gone???