MANCHESTER - 7
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Stockport
Age: 69
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The difference is Calgary gets more snow and expects in one winter than Manchester
does in a couple of decades and buys the expensive equipement which it knows will be used many times each winter where as I have lived in Manchester for 30 years and
don`t think I can remember having so much snow at one time
Ian B
does in a couple of decades and buys the expensive equipement which it knows will be used many times each winter where as I have lived in Manchester for 30 years and
don`t think I can remember having so much snow at one time
Ian B
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: MCT
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Its not that they cant be bothered to operate 2 runways....they are only allowed to operate 2 RWYs at certain times due to a legally binding contract....
In previous years 05R/23L has not been used over the holiday period due to reduced demand and to appease the locals. I think this is also happening this year, so I guess they didn't bother to clear it on Saturday pm when the snow started and in any case the new runway is not used on Sunday am. Of course on Sunday there were frequent snow showers and it took all their time to keep the one runway open, albeit with several closures. And once you have left the other runway untreated with this amount of snow and sub zero temperatures, only rising temperatures will clear it without a massive effort.
I suspect those staff who are left at MAN in Ops are genereally not experienced in this extreme (for Manchester) weather and this my have contributed to the situation. Couple this with the fact that jobs seem to be reviewed every few months and you can imagine that the enthusiam to get stuck could be less than it was a few years ago where people volunteered to come in and help out in this type of situation. In addition there may be an attitude on high that the extra expense of vehicles, materials and staff to shift snow is not worth it for the very limited times it happens at MAN - and I'm sure that this applies at many other airports where the beancounters hold sway.
However, having lived in the area for many years, this is one of the worst snowfalls in recent years, so I suspect that even if there had been more resources, there would still have been problems. After 6 days there is still 15-20 cm of snow in the area and it's freezing again tonight.
Have a Happy Christmas
Suzeman
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
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Plenty of aircraft de-icing delays mind, but then that's the airlines' responsibility.
Think about it Javelin.
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Dibley
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Manchester may be on a latitude north of calgary its just that canada etc doesnt have the gulfstream to warm them up,hence calgary expect to use their snow equipment for around four months a year so its well worth getting the best tackle ,airports in the U.K. expect around two days of snow per year so the bean counters dont allow a large expenditure,it costs less to close a couple of days than spend thousands on machines that do less work than some airport managers we all know.
Also we cannot use the old type cow p**s deicer any more as it harms the enviroment,the new stuff is about as good as orange squash but the health and safety say its less harmful to fluffy cuddly things.
All this will be irrelevant soon because as honest Gordon an his chums say as they tax the a**e of us and try to ruin our industry global warming is melting everything.
Also we cannot use the old type cow p**s deicer any more as it harms the enviroment,the new stuff is about as good as orange squash but the health and safety say its less harmful to fluffy cuddly things.
All this will be irrelevant soon because as honest Gordon an his chums say as they tax the a**e of us and try to ruin our industry global warming is melting everything.
Join Date: Mar 2007
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Surely the snow never classed as an emergency.
I can understand a flight needing to divert using an out of hour approach but how could they justify tens of flights because they need to clean snow off of the other runway?
I'd be pissed if I lived under the flight path and they got away with that reason...
Merry Christmas to all!
I can understand a flight needing to divert using an out of hour approach but how could they justify tens of flights because they need to clean snow off of the other runway?
I'd be pissed if I lived under the flight path and they got away with that reason...
Merry Christmas to all!
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The Ops Dungeon
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Manchester - 7
'Would seem for 2 days running now, MAN has refused permission for BA widebodies to divert from LHR. Apparently, the stands are not safe' !!! - The96er
I'd heard that too. . seems they'd rather tell large airlines to keep their nasty Diverts away rather than face the embarrassment of having them stuck on stand (or on a taxiway, remember we cant take more than 2 A380s at the moment . . 3rd strike and its out!) for hours and then being too icy for anyone to deal with them (or have any busses, steps, equipment etc etc) for ages as they are 'extra'. How oft do we hear of diverts 'tell them they're an extra and they'll have to wait' . . .And how REASONABLE and UNDERSTANDING flight deck and Airline representation are when given this as a reason for being unable to provide the very basics of service to a disrupted flight!
More and more we hear of police being called to aircraft to protect the poor staff forced to deliver bad news re service times to either airlines or the travelling public (most often both!), might one say that the 'Ladies and Gentlemen' announcements should now read 'Louts and Thugs' as i'm told true Ladies and Gentlemen went out with the good old days of 60's aviation (they wore hats too i'm told)!
T-M-D
I'd heard that too. . seems they'd rather tell large airlines to keep their nasty Diverts away rather than face the embarrassment of having them stuck on stand (or on a taxiway, remember we cant take more than 2 A380s at the moment . . 3rd strike and its out!) for hours and then being too icy for anyone to deal with them (or have any busses, steps, equipment etc etc) for ages as they are 'extra'. How oft do we hear of diverts 'tell them they're an extra and they'll have to wait' . . .And how REASONABLE and UNDERSTANDING flight deck and Airline representation are when given this as a reason for being unable to provide the very basics of service to a disrupted flight!
More and more we hear of police being called to aircraft to protect the poor staff forced to deliver bad news re service times to either airlines or the travelling public (most often both!), might one say that the 'Ladies and Gentlemen' announcements should now read 'Louts and Thugs' as i'm told true Ladies and Gentlemen went out with the good old days of 60's aviation (they wore hats too i'm told)!
T-M-D
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ACC
This is precisely when you need max capacity.
Now, we have reduced egress from the runway - AE or A1. Flow rates go down, separation increases, congestion starts.
This is a blatant poverty measure from MAN to save money.
A major international airport should easily cope with this snow, they have responsibility to their customers to provide adequate facilities in order that they may operate as normal a service as possible.
Our OTP was down to 16% this week, I flew a rotation on days off because the airport couldn't cope and a crew ran out of hours after the punters had been on board for 5 hours. Then there were no hotels so they stayed in the terminal overnight. They were not happy campers when we took them to GOI on Monday.
Additionally, the Cabin Crew who had planned on a 5 day stay over Christmas, brought friends and partners were now forced into a 1 night stay. Their Christmas was ruined, the passengers were hugely inconvenienced and all we could say was that the facilities at MAN were inadequate.........
They still blame us as the operator
This is precisely when you need max capacity.
Now, we have reduced egress from the runway - AE or A1. Flow rates go down, separation increases, congestion starts.
This is a blatant poverty measure from MAN to save money.
A major international airport should easily cope with this snow, they have responsibility to their customers to provide adequate facilities in order that they may operate as normal a service as possible.
Our OTP was down to 16% this week, I flew a rotation on days off because the airport couldn't cope and a crew ran out of hours after the punters had been on board for 5 hours. Then there were no hotels so they stayed in the terminal overnight. They were not happy campers when we took them to GOI on Monday.
Additionally, the Cabin Crew who had planned on a 5 day stay over Christmas, brought friends and partners were now forced into a 1 night stay. Their Christmas was ruined, the passengers were hugely inconvenienced and all we could say was that the facilities at MAN were inadequate.........
They still blame us as the operator
Join Date: Jan 2004
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Well, I'd like to wish a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to everyone at MAN, whether working hard to keep it open against the odds or sat in an ivory tower counting beans and cutting jobs.
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: England
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Does anyone know why most flights today have been/ are delayed usually by over an hour? My first thought was snow but thats all gone according to a friend so maybe ice still around?
Also there are two U2 LPL flights departing MAN today EZY7067 to NCE and EZY 7119. I'm guessing these aircraft were diverted away from LPL at somepoint?
Also there are two U2 LPL flights departing MAN today EZY7067 to NCE and EZY 7119. I'm guessing these aircraft were diverted away from LPL at somepoint?
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Manchester
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Two easyjet flights diverted in during the last hour due very thick fog at Liverpool (50 metres or thereabouts). MAN had fog this morning with consequential delays due to reduced movement rate.
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Manchester
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MAN Runway 23L-05R
Just to clarify. There is a restriction, a planning condition, on the use of 23L-05R at MAN. It shall not be used between the hours of 22.00 - 06:00. It can be used however in the case of emergencies, maintenance and emergency maintenance.
Just to add thoughts. In snow and ice, it makes sense to keep the snow fleet occupied on keeping one runway and the ramp available.
Just to add thoughts. In snow and ice, it makes sense to keep the snow fleet occupied on keeping one runway and the ramp available.
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Why is it that people think that they can pay £1 for a ticket and the airline can afford to have spare aircraft and crews standing by for any kind of disruption. You get what you pay for. The customer is always right and he wanted the low cost airlines which means there is no contingency when things go pear shaped.
In fairness I doubt groundbum paid as little as £1 for a ticket to Malta. I've just had a look at the easyJet website and a couple wishing to fly there from Manchester in six weeks time for a 10 day holiday will pay almost £300.
Mrs. FF and I flew MAN to BHD last night (Sunday). When we checked in it was obvious an easyJet flight had been cancelled as a large number of people were circulating in front of the airline's customer service desk. The flight in question had been travelling to Munich and the cancellation was obviously at short notice as some passengers already had boarding passes and shopping from the Terminal 3 Alpha Retail Unit which is after security. They had to retrieve their luggage with the MUC tags attached so they had definitely checked in.
From conversations overheard in the security queue I think Easy had managed to re-route at least some passengers on other airlines.
Meanwhile, an Easy flight to Tenerife was getting ready to depart more than four hours behind schedule.
When easyJet flights from Luton were cancelled during the bad weather last week a young woman travelling with her little daughter to BFS was initially told she could not travel until after New Year although they later found room for the delayed passengers the next day.
In fairness I doubt groundbum paid as little as £1 for a ticket to Malta. I've just had a look at the easyJet website and a couple wishing to fly there from Manchester in six weeks time for a 10 day holiday will pay almost £300.
Mrs. FF and I flew MAN to BHD last night (Sunday). When we checked in it was obvious an easyJet flight had been cancelled as a large number of people were circulating in front of the airline's customer service desk. The flight in question had been travelling to Munich and the cancellation was obviously at short notice as some passengers already had boarding passes and shopping from the Terminal 3 Alpha Retail Unit which is after security. They had to retrieve their luggage with the MUC tags attached so they had definitely checked in.
From conversations overheard in the security queue I think Easy had managed to re-route at least some passengers on other airlines.
Meanwhile, an Easy flight to Tenerife was getting ready to depart more than four hours behind schedule.
When easyJet flights from Luton were cancelled during the bad weather last week a young woman travelling with her little daughter to BFS was initially told she could not travel until after New Year although they later found room for the delayed passengers the next day.
Why is it that people think that they can pay £1 for a ticket and the airline can afford to have spare aircraft and crews standing by for any kind of disruption. You get what you pay for. The customer is always right and he wanted the low cost airlines which means there is no contingency when things go pear shaped