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Old 16th Oct 2016, 12:32
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How much of that could have actually got into Church Fenton because of runway length
There are bigger delays at Manchester just because of the sheer volume of traffic and believe it or
not we get low vis and wind as well.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 12:57
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Originally Posted by chaps1954 View Post
How much of that could have actually got into Church Fenton because of runway length
There are bigger delays at Manchester just because of the sheer volume of traffic and believe it or
not we get low vis and wind as well.
None at the moment - to your first point (but not because of weather at 700ft). It is because the airport is newly born.

To your second point - But sheer volume of traffic creates lots of wealth whereas fog at 700ft creates no wealth.

The sheer volume of traffic at MAN is partly due to you not being at 700ft in the fog.

Yes you get low viz and wind but nowhere near as much as you would at 700ft.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 13:11
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To your second point - But sheer volume of traffic creates lots of wealth whereas fog at 700ft creates no wealth.
In a dog eat dog civil aviation world where airlines and airports compete to the death inefficiencies are bad bad bad and cost money and that is why I highlight them.
So the inefficiencies caused by congestion should be decreasing wealth? All airport locations are compromises - get over it (unless it supports you agenda )
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 13:18
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Leeds gets low cloud we get fog, it`s just the position of the airfield, as soon as low viz comes in a 2 runway airport loses a very large percentage of the movements, when flow control comes in places like LGW very busy single runway and LHR and MAN and to an extent BHX and LTN
can suffer.
I thought Church Fenton used to be bad for fog with being in the Vale of York

Ian
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 13:28
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Originally Posted by SWBKCB View Post
So the inefficiencies caused by congestion should be decreasing wealth? All airport locations are compromises - get over it (unless it supports you agenda )
Let me be clear - any inefficiency is a bad thing as it inherently adds to costs so if there must be inefficiency let it be caused by gaining wealth rather than fog at 700ft.

We have compromised in the North East and Yorkshire for too long and now we have the opportunity to make less of a compromise by having an airport in a better location where flights to New York will be viable (in the long term). My agenda, as you put it, is simple and has never been hidden - let's have an airport for the North East and Yorkshire in the right place so that millions of us do not have to travel to Scotland or the North West or the East Midlands to take basic flights.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 13:36
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Originally Posted by LEEDS APPROACH View Post
Let me be clear - any inefficiency is a bad thing as it inherently adds to costs so if there must be inefficiency let it be caused by gaining wealth rather than fog at 700ft.

We have compromised in the North East and Yorkshire for too long and now we have the opportunity to make less of a compromise by having an airport in a better location where flights to New York will be viable (in the long term). My agenda, as you put it, is simple and has never been hidden - let's have an airport for the North East and Yorkshire in the right place so that millions of us do not have to travel to Scotland or the North West or the East Midlands to take basic flights.
You don't have to travel. Simply go to LBA. Or were you a regular user of Concorde? I think you will notice there are very few airports outside of the south east that offer long haul destinations, save a few Emirates routes. Your potential forecasts are based on the idea there is an appetite for 90% of Yorkshire jetting off to the US every year. Which they won't.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 13:39
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Well it can't be denied that you have an Agenda but seriously we can all dream but I'm afraid yours are met with constant negativity and for the right reasons as well.

It's nearly the end of 2016 are you going to debate this Agenda for ever and ever as it's becoming so boring as others on here will agree with.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 13:42
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Originally Posted by chaps1954 View Post
Leeds gets low cloud we get fog, it`s just the position of the airfield, as soon as low viz comes in a 2 runway airport loses a very large percentage of the movements, when flow control comes in places like LGW very busy single runway and LHR and MAN and to an extent BHX and LTN
can suffer.
I thought Church Fenton used to be bad for fog with being in the Vale of York

Ian
LBA and MAN are incomparable when it comes to diversion rate. Diverted passenger per passenger handled and number of weather affected days as you would expect at vastly different elevations and factoring in LBAs short exactly perpendicular to prevailing wind runway.

Yes there will be weather related diversions and inefficiency at 'the other thread' but at a less rate than LBA at 700ft. = increased efficiency = improvement.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 13:47
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Originally Posted by jamesgrainge View Post
You don't have to travel. Simply go to LBA. Or were you a regular user of Concorde? I think you will notice there are very few airports outside of the south east that offer long haul destinations, save a few Emirates routes. Your potential forecasts are based on the idea there is an appetite for 90% of Yorkshire jetting off to the US every year. Which they won't.
Not Concorde but the most basic route to Cork! - gone because of airport location! 5.5 million people and Cork bites the dust. Wake up to the obvious!
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 13:53
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Originally Posted by canberra97 View Post
Well it can't be denied that you have an Agenda but seriously we can all dream but I'm afraid yours are met with constant negativity and for the right reasons as well.

It's nearly the end of 2016 are you going to debate this Agenda for ever and ever as it's becoming so boring as others on here will agree with.
I wont debate the issue but we can both watch it grow in front of us while we chat about building a new terminal in the car park at LBA lol.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 14:08
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So in your opinion CORK has gone due to airport location so why does every other route still operate, so it's not down to loads or anything like that but poor airport location!

Now I would have given you the benefit of the doubt seeing that your no more than an aviation enthusiast and a bit to much of one if you ask me but to blame the loss of CORK on airport location really sums you up and it may be the case that you need to see a doctor as soon as possible because after reading all your tedious posts on here I seriously think all is not well!
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 14:15
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We have compromised in the North East and Yorkshire for too long and now we have the opportunity to make less of a compromise by having an airport in a better location where flights to New York will be viable (in the long term). My agenda, as you put it, is simple and has never been hidden - let's have an airport for the North East and Yorkshire in the right place so that millions of us do not have to travel to Scotland or the North West or the East Midlands to take basic flights.
How on god's earth is any long hauler going to lift off from Church Fenton's 5,600ft; destination NYC?

The North East has several airports already, NCL, MME, HUY, DSA, LBA ... Why the need to concrete over even more of an otherwise beautiful county famous for it's Dales and National Park?
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 14:16
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Originally Posted by jamesgrainge View Post
You don't have to travel. Simply go to LBA. Or were you a regular user of Concorde? I think you will notice there are very few airports outside of the south east that offer long haul destinations, save a few Emirates routes. Your potential forecasts are based on the idea there is an appetite for 90% of Yorkshire jetting off to the US every year. Which they won't.
Completely untrue - go and do some research james! 2.7 million people in the North East were not far off from sustaining a frequent flight to New York. 2.7 millon people + 5.5 million in Yorkshire [current populations] who require a direct none stop flight will sustain a frequent flight to New York.

The location of the airport is critical! The airport cannot be stuck miles from motorway and main rail on top of a 700ft hill top! Cork/Copenhagen is the empiric proof that population is not being used and is being divided up (despite linking up with football teams and having giant posters!)
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 14:20
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Originally Posted by canberra97 View Post
So in your opinion CORK has gone due to airport location so why does every other route still operate, so it's not down to loads or anything like that but poor airport location!

Now I would have given you the benefit of the doubt seeing that your no more than an aviation enthusiast and a bit to much of one if you ask me but to blame the loss of CORK on airport location really sums you up and it may be the case that you need to see a doctor as soon as possible because after reading all your tedious posts on here I seriously think all is not well!
Because the other routes are viable using the immediate population whereas Cork etc require the greater population of Yorkshire! It's not rocket science - certain routes require a bigger population for them to work!
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 14:22
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LEEDS APPROACH

YOU JUST DONT GIVE UP DO YOU, I JUST DONT KNOW WHY YOU DONT ACCEPT THE REAL FACTS GIVEN TO YOU!

Your very immature you know.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 14:32
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There are plenty of UK airports stuck miles from motorways and/or main rail, CWL, BRS, EXT, NQY, BOH, SEN, NWI, HUY, MME, NCL, BLK, LPL to name but some, his only valid argument is that LBA is elevated at some 700ft in full awareness that that is something that LBA cannot improve upon.

On this island where I live they are spending bucket loads of money on a sports arena that nobody wants whilst we don't even have a medical facility with an x-ray machine ... How about forgetting your rubber necking activities and campaign for better health facilities in Yorkshire ... i.e. Do something worthwhile and what the people want!
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 14:32
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Originally Posted by canberra97 View Post
LEEDS APPROACH

YOU JUST DONT GIVE UP DO YOU, I JUST DONT KNOW WHY YOU DONT ACCEPT THE REAL FACTS GIVEN TO YOU!

Your very immature you know.
Well let's not fall out - let's just both watch it slowly happen. You are loyal spotters and I do appreciate that.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 15:14
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Originally Posted by Harry Wayfarers View Post
There are plenty of UK airports stuck miles from motorways and/or main rail, CWL, BRS, EXT, NQY, BOH, SEN, NWI, HUY, MME, NCL, BLK, LPL to name but some, his only valid argument is that LBA is elevated at some 700ft in full awareness that that is something that LBA cannot improve upon.

On this island where I live they are spending bucket loads of money on a sports arena that nobody wants whilst we don't even have a medical facility with an x-ray machine ... How about forgetting your rubber necking activities and campaign for better health facilities in Yorkshire ... i.e. Do something worthwhile and what the people want!
Harry you cannot just trot out a huge list of airports. You take each airport individually. Each airport will have its own population catchment and geography and critically the competition it is up against. If your airport is up against very efficient and accessible competition then putting your airport in a relatively inaccessible location will have a much greater impact than if your airport had lesser direct competition such as NCL.

The Yorkshire region is under gigantic attack from very very efficient accessible competition and therefore the location of a Leeds and Yorkshire airport is utterly utterly critical. Moving an airport just a short distance can more than triple the passenger throughput.
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 15:15
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2050 or 2060 any bets on yet
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Old 16th Oct 2016, 15:35
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LEEDS APPROACH

'You are all loyal spotters and I appreciate that'

I have not been a spotter for over 30 years and back then facts didn't get in the way but as you get older and wiser you realise that facts mean a lot so I suggest you start to appreciate them rather than going round and round in circles regarding Church Fenton as its your pipe dream after all but you CONTINOUSLY try and push your personal agenda which to be honest has become VERY boring so could you please stop it or write to your local MP instead of posting utter dribble on here, as I said before you come across as VERY immature.
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