Aer Lingus - 5
Interesting if true.
Star alliance would make sense in so far as the UA joint venture. One wonders how it will affect the BA codeshare on DUB-LHR.
As for business class on that route, does anyone have any insight into whether there will be any changes to cabin config to facilitate it and if so which aircraft (basically if it's 320's then the 321's are likely to be sold off).
As to the Business class on the route, I recall flying EI business class from DUB to LHR just before it was removed a few years back (not so much by choice more that it was the only seat left) and it cost less than the FR fare to Stanstead or Luton on the same day due to being booked 48 hours before departure.
At the right price point, a business class service on the route might work well, if they provide in flight laptop power point and internet access (especially if you get priority boarding and you're kept away from the "rabble" for boarding and security!)
JAS
Star alliance would make sense in so far as the UA joint venture. One wonders how it will affect the BA codeshare on DUB-LHR.
As for business class on that route, does anyone have any insight into whether there will be any changes to cabin config to facilitate it and if so which aircraft (basically if it's 320's then the 321's are likely to be sold off).
As to the Business class on the route, I recall flying EI business class from DUB to LHR just before it was removed a few years back (not so much by choice more that it was the only seat left) and it cost less than the FR fare to Stanstead or Luton on the same day due to being booked 48 hours before departure.
At the right price point, a business class service on the route might work well, if they provide in flight laptop power point and internet access (especially if you get priority boarding and you're kept away from the "rabble" for boarding and security!)
JAS
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Ballymun
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Good work on the direct Aer Lingus/GOAL flight into Dominican Republic, well done everyone involved..........looks like its EI-EAV, going at 1310z......
Aer Lingus joins Goal in direct airlift of aid
CIARÁN HANCOCK, Business Affairs Correspondent
AER LINGUS has joined the airlift of relief aid to Haiti by agreeing to fly an A330 aircraft directly from Dublin to La Romana airport in the neighbouring Dominican Republic on Friday afternoon with much needed aid supplies.
The aircraft will deliver more than 25 tonnes of emergency medical equipment and food to earthquake survivors on the island in conjunction with Irish aid agency Goal, which will then transport the relief into Haiti from the Dominican Republic.
The flight will also carry 15 doctors and volunteers, who will travel to Haiti to assist relief efforts following the recent devastating earthquake.
The aircraft will leave Dublin airport at 1pm on Friday, arriving in the Dominican Republic at 7pm local time on the same day.
It will be on the ground for two hours to unload before returning to Dublin via Orlando.
The decision to fly into La Romana airport instead of Port-au-Prince in Haiti was taken because of safety concerns, following severe aftershocks yesterday.
Aer Lingus has agreed to cover the cost of fuel for the flight with its crew offering their services voluntarily.
All aviation, take-off, navigational and associated charges have been waived by both the Dublin Airport Authority and the Irish Aviation Authority respectively to facilitate the flight.
“Aer Lingus sincerely thanks these organisations for their co-operation,” the airline said in a statement last night.
Irish Times online
Aer Lingus joins Goal in direct airlift of aid
CIARÁN HANCOCK, Business Affairs Correspondent
AER LINGUS has joined the airlift of relief aid to Haiti by agreeing to fly an A330 aircraft directly from Dublin to La Romana airport in the neighbouring Dominican Republic on Friday afternoon with much needed aid supplies.
The aircraft will deliver more than 25 tonnes of emergency medical equipment and food to earthquake survivors on the island in conjunction with Irish aid agency Goal, which will then transport the relief into Haiti from the Dominican Republic.
The flight will also carry 15 doctors and volunteers, who will travel to Haiti to assist relief efforts following the recent devastating earthquake.
The aircraft will leave Dublin airport at 1pm on Friday, arriving in the Dominican Republic at 7pm local time on the same day.
It will be on the ground for two hours to unload before returning to Dublin via Orlando.
The decision to fly into La Romana airport instead of Port-au-Prince in Haiti was taken because of safety concerns, following severe aftershocks yesterday.
Aer Lingus has agreed to cover the cost of fuel for the flight with its crew offering their services voluntarily.
All aviation, take-off, navigational and associated charges have been waived by both the Dublin Airport Authority and the Irish Aviation Authority respectively to facilitate the flight.
“Aer Lingus sincerely thanks these organisations for their co-operation,” the airline said in a statement last night.
Irish Times online
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 2,782
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
First signs of this alliance are already visible with the announcement by BMI of a reduction in services to LHR
If EI are going Star is there going to be more drive to feed passenger into FRA, United Hubs in USA and also take some focus demand on DUB ORK & SNN to LHR.
On a separate note, Rumours were on here yesterday that FR to announce extra planes at Cork and that coupled with them increasing ORK LGW to meet Aer Lingus challenge, will Aer Lingus retreat just to an ORK LHR at which the few slots that they have will be more hotly contested? I just hope that BFS LHR is showing an adequate return.
EI-BUD
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UIP : 4° 10’ 0” W, 47° 58’ 0” N
Posts: 341
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
But will this jeopardise the current code shares with British Airways and KLM?
Join Date: Jun 1997
Location: 5530N
Posts: 845
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
racedo Yet ANOTHER Strategy move at EI as they do them so well and so frequently
Best of luck to EIN. One airline running the whole of aviaition and its policies in Ireland=Nightmare
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: The West
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Have you seen the new notice at HOB - now thats what I call positive advertising -Dublin is Aer lingus's home and lets not forget that it has a reputation which we all love -yes it has lost it's way over the last few year BUT look at it now strong decisive decisions being made about it -2010 I believe is Aer Lingus's year roll on the Star Alliance - Roll on a premium economy service - Roll on Aer Arran involvement within the regional routes- Roll on the cead mile failte which many have forgotten about.
And yes if it takes a German to provide all these -so be it after all an English football manager helped out!!!!
And as a pilot I admire them for looking after there own.
And yes if it takes a German to provide all these -so be it after all an English football manager helped out!!!!
And as a pilot I admire them for looking after there own.
Join Date: Dec 1997
Location: Penarth South Wales
Posts: 950
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Having just been down in Dominican Republic, flying Search and Rescue teams into Port Au Prince, I can say the decision to use La Romana airport instead of Santo Domingo was purely due to no available slots in MDSD. We had to move to Salama on the north coast as we couldn't stay in SD. Nothing whatsoever to do with safety concerns or aftershocks.
All slots into Port Au Prince are allocated up to February 12th, with a limit of 5 Heavy aircraft (757 or bigger) slots a day.
All slots into Port Au Prince are allocated up to February 12th, with a limit of 5 Heavy aircraft (757 or bigger) slots a day.
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: DUB
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
While I have not seen a shed of credible evidence anywhere about EI joining Star, and I don't see any direct link with bmi's crisis management decision to cut the DUB base and remove further rotations, I can say factually that Aeroplan, AC's FFP partner company, had advanced discussions with EI and Superquinn last year. I don't know if these discussions were fruitful or not in the end.
The UA tie-up, the RE thin feed from UK regions, the potential re-introduction of a premium cabin all seem to be lending a critical mass to a Star Alliance tie up. There was also a *glitch*
on ITA's GDS software a few weeks back, where previously unused EI codes were placed on CO flights to EWR...
I'm starting to buy the idea.
The UA tie-up, the RE thin feed from UK regions, the potential re-introduction of a premium cabin all seem to be lending a critical mass to a Star Alliance tie up. There was also a *glitch*
on ITA's GDS software a few weeks back, where previously unused EI codes were placed on CO flights to EWR...I'm starting to buy the idea.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Crawley
Posts: 178
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have been critical of EIN's strategy before in this forum. My last foray was in respect of their pointless Gatwick operations. I have been proved to be entirely correct. Their losses there must have been in the order of Ł25 million in 1 year. Surplus capacity killes businesses quicker than any other factor and as a result of acquiring aircraft for Gatwick EIN now have a gross capacity excess both in short and long haul. Add to that the collapsing demand in all Irish markets and you have a disaster scenario. So what does that ivory tower in Dublin do next? Join Star. That has just got to be a strategy (if you can even call it that) with no sense behind it at all. Let me give you the reasons:
1. Alliances gobble vast amounts of management time at all levels. EIN does not have that time available
2. EIN will have to meet the minimum entry standards of Star. When BMI joined the cost was around Ł20 million.
3. Migrating to Amadeus systems (a probable joining requirement) will cost another Ł30 million per annum
4. EIN will not get a single extra passenger as a result of joining Star. (Just look at the fact that the most successful airlines in the world are able to trade globally without any alliances and their ludicrous costs)
5. Most of the time wasting management activity in alliances is directed at frequent flyers. That is trying to give the illusion of benefits that might emerge after the high fares have been charged. Frequent Flyers on Ryanair get their benefits by permanently lower fares
6. With its dreadful cash position, collapsing home market and high costs there is only one strategy that EIN can follow. It is called SURVIVAL. That means cutting out EVERYTHING. That does not contribute to profit.
Last time I was at Dublin airport (last week) I looked at the EIN boardroom window and all I could see was the directors driving nails into the corporate coffin. Very sad.
Incidentally I have flown on EIN recently (between LGW and AGP). Only 11 pax on 1 flight. Another flight before Xmas the load was excellent (largely because of a large number of cancelled flights) but the on-board service was exxcellent.
1. Alliances gobble vast amounts of management time at all levels. EIN does not have that time available
2. EIN will have to meet the minimum entry standards of Star. When BMI joined the cost was around Ł20 million.
3. Migrating to Amadeus systems (a probable joining requirement) will cost another Ł30 million per annum
4. EIN will not get a single extra passenger as a result of joining Star. (Just look at the fact that the most successful airlines in the world are able to trade globally without any alliances and their ludicrous costs)
5. Most of the time wasting management activity in alliances is directed at frequent flyers. That is trying to give the illusion of benefits that might emerge after the high fares have been charged. Frequent Flyers on Ryanair get their benefits by permanently lower fares
6. With its dreadful cash position, collapsing home market and high costs there is only one strategy that EIN can follow. It is called SURVIVAL. That means cutting out EVERYTHING. That does not contribute to profit.
Last time I was at Dublin airport (last week) I looked at the EIN boardroom window and all I could see was the directors driving nails into the corporate coffin. Very sad.
Incidentally I have flown on EIN recently (between LGW and AGP). Only 11 pax on 1 flight. Another flight before Xmas the load was excellent (largely because of a large number of cancelled flights) but the on-board service was exxcellent.
colegate - I respect your opinion, and can see that joining Star will not be a magic solution too all EI's problems. However, could you provide a little more detail as to the strategy that you think EI should be employing ? I'm not trying to have a go at you - this is a genuine interest in what EI's potential strategy could be.
FR is probably now way too large for EI to go up against them as a copycat competitor - EI needs to compete against them in a way that provides something different to potential customers. This might be a higher level of service, or perhaps emphasising flying to primary airports, or flying at times when FR doesn't - essentially something to ensure that they occupy a different sector of the market rather than engaging a long and bloody fare war with FR that EI would probably lose. In addition, while I'm not that familiar with the state of the Irish economy, the economy of the USA and the rest of Europe is now beginning to move to stability rather than recession.
Could you elucidate some more information as to what your business plan for EI might be ?
FR is probably now way too large for EI to go up against them as a copycat competitor - EI needs to compete against them in a way that provides something different to potential customers. This might be a higher level of service, or perhaps emphasising flying to primary airports, or flying at times when FR doesn't - essentially something to ensure that they occupy a different sector of the market rather than engaging a long and bloody fare war with FR that EI would probably lose. In addition, while I'm not that familiar with the state of the Irish economy, the economy of the USA and the rest of Europe is now beginning to move to stability rather than recession.
Could you elucidate some more information as to what your business plan for EI might be ?
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 2,782
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
davidjohnson6- I agree, it would be great to hear what the strategy, I would agree entirely in the long run Aer Lingus will not be able to outsmart Ryanair by being the exact same model, because if MOL needs to run competing services at a loss he will and Aer Lingus will not stick that .
In my view, Aer Lingus need to be different and do things that the Ryanair model cannot. These are as follows;
- Make Dublin a true connection point for all passengers wanting to travel from UK and mainland EU Airports who do not have direct services to USA. Develop an attractive pricing strategy for first year to drive the message, 'The fastest most affordable flight to the states'. This would be good for all EU Dublin routes, and also this feed of passengers into Dublin would allow for return of SFX etc. Make T2 the route to the states, and sell the benefits of Pre Immigration clearance.
- Take on a smaller aircraft eg Dash8 Q400 to make many UK routes that were previously operated, not only will this this be a key tool to keep these routes alive Ryanair would be hard pressed to match on frequency and also make profit.
- Go after costs in a big way... identify where these can be achieved.
The whole debate on LGW is good to have but so many are saying that LGW was crazy for EI. I have asked a few times now, 'If LGW wasnt the right choice where was'? I believe that a new base outside of Ireland had to be UK and where better than the biggest market in London.
Suggestions please for a better place than LGW?
EI-BUD
In my view, Aer Lingus need to be different and do things that the Ryanair model cannot. These are as follows;
- Make Dublin a true connection point for all passengers wanting to travel from UK and mainland EU Airports who do not have direct services to USA. Develop an attractive pricing strategy for first year to drive the message, 'The fastest most affordable flight to the states'. This would be good for all EU Dublin routes, and also this feed of passengers into Dublin would allow for return of SFX etc. Make T2 the route to the states, and sell the benefits of Pre Immigration clearance.
- Take on a smaller aircraft eg Dash8 Q400 to make many UK routes that were previously operated, not only will this this be a key tool to keep these routes alive Ryanair would be hard pressed to match on frequency and also make profit.
- Go after costs in a big way... identify where these can be achieved.
The whole debate on LGW is good to have but so many are saying that LGW was crazy for EI. I have asked a few times now, 'If LGW wasnt the right choice where was'? I believe that a new base outside of Ireland had to be UK and where better than the biggest market in London.
Suggestions please for a better place than LGW?
EI-BUD
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Crawley
Posts: 178
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
EI-BUD and davidjohnson6, Yes I will do that but it will take me a few hours to put it down. I cannot disclose who I am but I can assure that I have the professional background to express the views that I have.
In my reply I will try to adddress both the issue of why Gatwick failed and waht the whole company should do.
In my reply I will try to adddress both the issue of why Gatwick failed and waht the whole company should do.
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Europa
Posts: 1,443
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Heard the RE/EI tie up announcement is imminent.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Crawley
Posts: 178
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
davidjohnson6 and EI-BUD, my strategy for Aer Lingus would build on its strengths, reduce costs and recognise that specialisation is the only way forward. Some items are listed below
Strengths:
1.Aer Lingus is a well known and probably much loved brand within Ireland. It is in a similar position within the areas of the USA that it serves. MOL recognised that in his takeover offers and proposed to continue with it.
2. The seas around Ireland and Britain give Aer Lingus a massive advantage in that there is no serious surface based competitive threat.
3. It serves some of the largest airports in Europe and faces no real competition from anyone on those routes. It co-habits even with RYR on many routes.
4. I cannot find anything wrong with their in-flight service. It seems popular, delivered in a friendly way and with those excellent hot breakfasts and chicken sandwiches.
5. The thing it does best is fly from Dublin to AMS, CDG,FRA, LHR, etc. It outschedules and outcarries the main European airlines on those routes. That is its core business and it seems to do it well. It can have as an objective that it will be the preferred airline on those routes. In my view the principal management effort should be to increase these strengths. It does not need Star or any other alliance to do this. Joining Star will seriously inhibit their freedom. They should compete not cooperate with these airlines.
6. The long haul business will always be a high risk area for them. That is because the Irish market is simply not big enough to support large aircraft operations on many routes. There are limited opportunities on leisure routes, possible low frequencies to the Caribbean and Sharm. US carriers feeding their own hubs make expansion to the States very difficult.
Costs:
1. EIN have the costs of a long haul airline and short haul is their core business. I think the company should be organised into separate divisions each with its own specialist costs. Having studied such a reorganisation for another airline I am certain that this will result in a substantial cost reduction. Both divisions would keep the same brand
2. Star will add costs and reduce EIN’s freedom to compete. It should therefore be abandoned.
3. They should look at their own system costs. I do not know which res system they currently use but they should migrate to openskies for all short haul routes
4. They should move away from travel agents as soon as possible
Gatwick failed because they chose to get tangled up with easyJet. Dominating prime routes to/from Dublin is where they will have the lease competition. Trying to compete with EZY on the same routes out of Gatwick where EIN have no real market presence and no possibility of getting any critical mass never made any sense to me. There is no other main airport in Europe where they will be able to find secure trading conditions. So they have no choice but to concentrate on Dublin.
I do not think they will ever make a go of a hub at DUB. There are not enough long haul routes and never will be. Scheduling of connections will be a nightmare because they will have to be very good to attract traffic. Short haul schedules should be optimised around the individual route requirements and not compromised around long haul connections. Anyway the traffic that would be attracted would probably only deep discount.
Strengths:
1.Aer Lingus is a well known and probably much loved brand within Ireland. It is in a similar position within the areas of the USA that it serves. MOL recognised that in his takeover offers and proposed to continue with it.
2. The seas around Ireland and Britain give Aer Lingus a massive advantage in that there is no serious surface based competitive threat.
3. It serves some of the largest airports in Europe and faces no real competition from anyone on those routes. It co-habits even with RYR on many routes.
4. I cannot find anything wrong with their in-flight service. It seems popular, delivered in a friendly way and with those excellent hot breakfasts and chicken sandwiches.
5. The thing it does best is fly from Dublin to AMS, CDG,FRA, LHR, etc. It outschedules and outcarries the main European airlines on those routes. That is its core business and it seems to do it well. It can have as an objective that it will be the preferred airline on those routes. In my view the principal management effort should be to increase these strengths. It does not need Star or any other alliance to do this. Joining Star will seriously inhibit their freedom. They should compete not cooperate with these airlines.
6. The long haul business will always be a high risk area for them. That is because the Irish market is simply not big enough to support large aircraft operations on many routes. There are limited opportunities on leisure routes, possible low frequencies to the Caribbean and Sharm. US carriers feeding their own hubs make expansion to the States very difficult.
Costs:
1. EIN have the costs of a long haul airline and short haul is their core business. I think the company should be organised into separate divisions each with its own specialist costs. Having studied such a reorganisation for another airline I am certain that this will result in a substantial cost reduction. Both divisions would keep the same brand
2. Star will add costs and reduce EIN’s freedom to compete. It should therefore be abandoned.
3. They should look at their own system costs. I do not know which res system they currently use but they should migrate to openskies for all short haul routes
4. They should move away from travel agents as soon as possible
Gatwick failed because they chose to get tangled up with easyJet. Dominating prime routes to/from Dublin is where they will have the lease competition. Trying to compete with EZY on the same routes out of Gatwick where EIN have no real market presence and no possibility of getting any critical mass never made any sense to me. There is no other main airport in Europe where they will be able to find secure trading conditions. So they have no choice but to concentrate on Dublin.
I do not think they will ever make a go of a hub at DUB. There are not enough long haul routes and never will be. Scheduling of connections will be a nightmare because they will have to be very good to attract traffic. Short haul schedules should be optimised around the individual route requirements and not compromised around long haul connections. Anyway the traffic that would be attracted would probably only deep discount.