Ryanair - 6
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from the EDI sched looks like more routes to come.
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FR airports
I just came across a piece of very interesting statistics published a few days ago by Ryanair's favourite ”Düsseldorf-Weeze” (NRN) airport in Germany. As you know, Weeze is situated very close to the Dutch border. The data reveals the origin of customers flying therefrom.
For a long time I have been interested in the origin of pax coming to the small secondary airports used by FR across the EU and the distance the customers are willing to travel to get there. A special interest of mine pertains to the trans-border movements of passengers and the means of surface transportation used by them.
Yes, I did realize that in Weeze and other similar airports a significant amount of customers come from across the border. I must admit, however, that the actual percentage of the foreigners using NRN did exceed even my expectations! Could you imagine, the German people are not a majority of NRN customers any more. Last year, the Dutch share of all customers in Weeze has risen to... 52 percent! It's very, very much!
The catchment area in Germany is not to blame. To the South of the airport there are centres like Düsseldorf and Cologne and to the West the entire vast and densely populated Ruhr region, one of the largest urban areas in Europe. In spite of that, the clients from an other side of the border constitute the majority. Apparently, people being able to travel freely do not hesitate to choose more distant airports that give them better connections or prices if the motivation to do so is simply good enough.
Apart from their sociological and behavioral character, these observations can have an important influence on the selection of some airports giving the predictability of these choices and helping to estimate the growth abilities of some potential locations. Yet regardless of all the potential these places might have, most of them would require some significant investments. Unfortunately, it's usually very hard to make the low-cost airports profitable and thus to get the interest of potential investors.
A couple of years ago, I was investigating which European airports were optimal from the trans-border passenger movements' point of view. NRN was high on my ranking list, albeit not atop of it. Actually, I've classified the airports in three different groups: 1. - airfields (not airports being in use for scheduled passenger traffic) with suitable runways but usually missing other important elements of the infrastructure, 2. - the airports that already in use by FR or its close competitors, and 3. - other existing airports not used by any major lcc.
In the airfields group there were a great deal of options available. In many cases, however, there was lack of consent, will or simply money to go ahead. Like two or three objects East of Berlin with excellent runways that could serve both Berlin and Western Poland – but with no permission of the local authorities to do it. Anyway, in that group the airfield of my choice became Weelde in northern Belgium. Situated very close to the Dutch border, not far from Tilburg, Breda and Rotterdam and close enough to Amsterdam to be considered as an alternative to get there. Still, it's a very theoretical option. I'm not aware of any existing plans to develop the object as a low-cost airport, it has a good runway, but pretty much other infrastructure is missing.
Among the airports "in use", it was Slovak Bratislava (BTS) that got the most points in my research. Close to Vienna, good surface transportation links, the perfect catchment area. Two years later... well, I'm not sure if BTS has fulfilled FR's expectations, some routes had to be stopped apparently. But of course the good location is just one factor, one must consider also other aspects, mainly the competition (in that case SkyEurope on both BTS and VIE).
Finally the third group, where belong some other existing airports not noticed by the lccs. My favourite two years ago was Finnish Lappeenranta (and still remains). 10 km from the Russian border, the Easternmost airport in the entire European Union. Located close enough to Saint Petersburg with almost 5 million inhabitants, while over 6 million people live in its vicinity. Even if just a minority of Russians can afford travelling to Western Europe therefrom – it's a knockdown potential to be harnessed, with no true low-cost competition existing.
Don't ask me why I made this research, I will not disclose it. To be clear, however: it was not ordered by FR. Ryanair's management has a very weird attitude towards any researches concerning the destinations, route selection, demand otlook and the passengers' opinions. In many occasions they simply prefer the empirical approach (try-as-you-go) – but it looks pretty chaotic sometimes. The more rational analysis could save them a significant amount of money, I'm pretty sure.
.
For a long time I have been interested in the origin of pax coming to the small secondary airports used by FR across the EU and the distance the customers are willing to travel to get there. A special interest of mine pertains to the trans-border movements of passengers and the means of surface transportation used by them.
Yes, I did realize that in Weeze and other similar airports a significant amount of customers come from across the border. I must admit, however, that the actual percentage of the foreigners using NRN did exceed even my expectations! Could you imagine, the German people are not a majority of NRN customers any more. Last year, the Dutch share of all customers in Weeze has risen to... 52 percent! It's very, very much!
The catchment area in Germany is not to blame. To the South of the airport there are centres like Düsseldorf and Cologne and to the West the entire vast and densely populated Ruhr region, one of the largest urban areas in Europe. In spite of that, the clients from an other side of the border constitute the majority. Apparently, people being able to travel freely do not hesitate to choose more distant airports that give them better connections or prices if the motivation to do so is simply good enough.
Apart from their sociological and behavioral character, these observations can have an important influence on the selection of some airports giving the predictability of these choices and helping to estimate the growth abilities of some potential locations. Yet regardless of all the potential these places might have, most of them would require some significant investments. Unfortunately, it's usually very hard to make the low-cost airports profitable and thus to get the interest of potential investors.
A couple of years ago, I was investigating which European airports were optimal from the trans-border passenger movements' point of view. NRN was high on my ranking list, albeit not atop of it. Actually, I've classified the airports in three different groups: 1. - airfields (not airports being in use for scheduled passenger traffic) with suitable runways but usually missing other important elements of the infrastructure, 2. - the airports that already in use by FR or its close competitors, and 3. - other existing airports not used by any major lcc.
In the airfields group there were a great deal of options available. In many cases, however, there was lack of consent, will or simply money to go ahead. Like two or three objects East of Berlin with excellent runways that could serve both Berlin and Western Poland – but with no permission of the local authorities to do it. Anyway, in that group the airfield of my choice became Weelde in northern Belgium. Situated very close to the Dutch border, not far from Tilburg, Breda and Rotterdam and close enough to Amsterdam to be considered as an alternative to get there. Still, it's a very theoretical option. I'm not aware of any existing plans to develop the object as a low-cost airport, it has a good runway, but pretty much other infrastructure is missing.
Among the airports "in use", it was Slovak Bratislava (BTS) that got the most points in my research. Close to Vienna, good surface transportation links, the perfect catchment area. Two years later... well, I'm not sure if BTS has fulfilled FR's expectations, some routes had to be stopped apparently. But of course the good location is just one factor, one must consider also other aspects, mainly the competition (in that case SkyEurope on both BTS and VIE).
Finally the third group, where belong some other existing airports not noticed by the lccs. My favourite two years ago was Finnish Lappeenranta (and still remains). 10 km from the Russian border, the Easternmost airport in the entire European Union. Located close enough to Saint Petersburg with almost 5 million inhabitants, while over 6 million people live in its vicinity. Even if just a minority of Russians can afford travelling to Western Europe therefrom – it's a knockdown potential to be harnessed, with no true low-cost competition existing.
Don't ask me why I made this research, I will not disclose it. To be clear, however: it was not ordered by FR. Ryanair's management has a very weird attitude towards any researches concerning the destinations, route selection, demand otlook and the passengers' opinions. In many occasions they simply prefer the empirical approach (try-as-you-go) – but it looks pretty chaotic sometimes. The more rational analysis could save them a significant amount of money, I'm pretty sure.
.
Last edited by eu01; 17th Jan 2009 at 11:13.
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SXF is very popular with Polish travellers as there are good rail connections to Berlin from Western Poland.
Another underutilised airport is Lille: good infrastructure on the airport and the Eurostar runs to Paris, Brussels and London from Lille station.
There are few routes in to Romania, especially the Black Sea coast and nothing yet to Ukraine or Bulgaria. Greece, Cyprus and Turkey are wide open too.
Another underutilised airport is Lille: good infrastructure on the airport and the Eurostar runs to Paris, Brussels and London from Lille station.
There are few routes in to Romania, especially the Black Sea coast and nothing yet to Ukraine or Bulgaria. Greece, Cyprus and Turkey are wide open too.
Join Date: Apr 2008
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Because of the new Eco-Tax in the Netherlands a lot of people went to Germany (NRN or DUS) or Belgium. That's why FR expands at NRN and CRL and reduce/not expand flights to MST and EIN.
Because of the huge amount of polish travellers from and to SXF FR flies to STN, EMA, EDI, DUB and SNN (over 50% on this routes). The same (but not this amount) with AOC (STN and new to EDI).
Between BTS and VIE there is a connection with the train and a new motorway. Only minutes between this cities.
Because of the huge amount of polish travellers from and to SXF FR flies to STN, EMA, EDI, DUB and SNN (over 50% on this routes). The same (but not this amount) with AOC (STN and new to EDI).
Between BTS and VIE there is a connection with the train and a new motorway. Only minutes between this cities.
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It's also the other way round. Because of the eco-tax (and other regulations) Ryanair doesn't really grow at Eindhoven. So if we need to go somewehere (cheap) then Weeze is more or less the only option. One should not forget that Weeze is close for a lot of dutch people and can usually be reached with less traffic jams then Schiphol.
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Thats is very easily noticed if you go to Weeze. I was there this week and from many (majority) passengers to airport staff to 2 of the Ryanair stewardesses of my flight, they all were dutch! I then checked it out at Google Earth and really it is SO close to the Netherlands and a bit in the middle of nothing of Germany that is immediatly clear that at least half of the people that use the airport are Dutch.
Good analysis EU01
People forget that consumers despite all the abuse they get do look at what is easy and cheap for them. They also ask their contemporaries and act accordingly.
Not got any research that underlines the benefit LCC give to an area both in economic uplift or jobs do you.
I don't mean just airport jobs I mean across a region as I believe where airports have not been serviced properly beforehand the starting up of international services has a big economic uplift in bringing income into an area.
People spending locally in Hotels / B&Bs / Restaurants etc ensures the money stays local and gets spread around i.e. the economic multipler.
Would love to see some data if it exists as reckon its more effective than a central Govt or EU dumping €1M in make work schemes with no longer term economic benefit.
Not got any research that underlines the benefit LCC give to an area both in economic uplift or jobs do you.
I don't mean just airport jobs I mean across a region as I believe where airports have not been serviced properly beforehand the starting up of international services has a big economic uplift in bringing income into an area.
People spending locally in Hotels / B&Bs / Restaurants etc ensures the money stays local and gets spread around i.e. the economic multipler.
Would love to see some data if it exists as reckon its more effective than a central Govt or EU dumping €1M in make work schemes with no longer term economic benefit.
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FR airports
Lappeenranta mentioned, I've tried to be quiet, but as I live in Finland...
Admittedly it is one of the opportunities bypassed by FR. Russians do come to fly from Finland, mostly using their own cars, we see them even at Tampere airport – and it's a place much more apart from Russia (the distance from St. Petersburg to TMP is appr. 470km versus 190km to LPP/EFLP).
Once I wrote here something like "is MOL blind not to see the potential?" But then I started to think different: maybe FR wants more than just to fly the full planes? Who would actually pay them so called "marketing support"? Hardly the city of St. Petersburg to prop up the flights to the airport located on the Finnish side of the border or Lappeenranta commune to promote Russians travelling to Western Europe.
While Ryanair's economy is a bit complex, the place is worth giving a try (say: "Come to see Saimaa Lake and the Treasures of St. Petersburg" or so, it could work) .
Admittedly it is one of the opportunities bypassed by FR. Russians do come to fly from Finland, mostly using their own cars, we see them even at Tampere airport – and it's a place much more apart from Russia (the distance from St. Petersburg to TMP is appr. 470km versus 190km to LPP/EFLP).
Once I wrote here something like "is MOL blind not to see the potential?" But then I started to think different: maybe FR wants more than just to fly the full planes? Who would actually pay them so called "marketing support"? Hardly the city of St. Petersburg to prop up the flights to the airport located on the Finnish side of the border or Lappeenranta commune to promote Russians travelling to Western Europe.
While Ryanair's economy is a bit complex, the place is worth giving a try (say: "Come to see Saimaa Lake and the Treasures of St. Petersburg" or so, it could work) .
While Ryanair's economy is a bit complex, the place is worth giving a try (say: "Come to see Saimaa Lake and the Treasures of St. Petersburg" or so, it could work) .
I'm sure Ryanair would like to be able to fly to Lappeenranta promoting it as a proxy for St Petersburg.
The big issue for a LCC, is that most people living in West Europe need a visa for Russia, which is likely to put off a good proportion of people wanting to visit. Don't get me wrong - I've applied for countless visas for independent travel in the past from countries which really don't like having foreigners talking too their citizens and know that for Russia there is a well-trodden path to getting the paperwork, but it all adds hassle and cost when the rest of Europe is visa-free.
A while ago, there was talk of tourists from the EU being able to get a visa on arrival with minimal paperwork. Did this come to anything ?
The big issue for a LCC, is that most people living in West Europe need a visa for Russia, which is likely to put off a good proportion of people wanting to visit. Don't get me wrong - I've applied for countless visas for independent travel in the past from countries which really don't like having foreigners talking too their citizens and know that for Russia there is a well-trodden path to getting the paperwork, but it all adds hassle and cost when the rest of Europe is visa-free.
A while ago, there was talk of tourists from the EU being able to get a visa on arrival with minimal paperwork. Did this come to anything ?
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Russian visas
Of course it's a hurdle. The negotiations were held between Russia and Finland to allow some form of visa-free visits for the EU citizens to come to Russia for up to 72 hours. To my knowledge, it should be introduced this year. However, conditions apply. It would concern just the tourists coming from Saimaa lake by boat via Saimaa canal or from Helsinki/Kotka on the Baltic Sea. It had to be approved by the Russian parlament, maybe it's done already, I don't know.
I think the potential of Lappeenranta is based more on Russian people living nearby. We, the EU citizens, have many options where to travel without a visa. The Russians need visas almost everywhere. But Russians do want to travel, so many of them we see in Finland nowadays (they saved our tourist industry last year using our hotels in spite of crisis). Once they've got the Finnish visa (that's achievable), they can travel anywhere within the EU. Now if Ryanair offers them cheap fares... Even if just a small part of St. Petersburg and Karelian population (some 6 million living in St. Petersburg and Leningrad Oblast and almost a million in Karelia) were interested... isn't it as much as in the entire Ireland?
I think the potential of Lappeenranta is based more on Russian people living nearby. We, the EU citizens, have many options where to travel without a visa. The Russians need visas almost everywhere. But Russians do want to travel, so many of them we see in Finland nowadays (they saved our tourist industry last year using our hotels in spite of crisis). Once they've got the Finnish visa (that's achievable), they can travel anywhere within the EU. Now if Ryanair offers them cheap fares... Even if just a small part of St. Petersburg and Karelian population (some 6 million living in St. Petersburg and Leningrad Oblast and almost a million in Karelia) were interested... isn't it as much as in the entire Ireland?
I recognise a couple of us old members of the Lappeenranta-for-Ryanair Supporters Club having another go. I think even without visa relaxation it could be a good point for departures to the places Russians like to travel to (which for Ryanair would be Stansted, Beauvais and Bergamo, among others).
Lappeenranta is a surprising airport, big runway stuck in the woods, tiny terminal, virtually no service apart from the hop to Helsinki, which has recently downgaded yet again, from a Saab 340 to a Jetstream. Whenever I have travelled there I was the only person on the flight interlining from beyond Helsinki; I think most of the locals from the region heading beyond Finland drive to Helsinki. On one occasion the FA with about a dozen pax on the Saab had a trainee assisting her and learning the ropes. They did all the safety briefing very precisely in Finnish, then repeated it all in Swedish. Then they looked at the manifest and my routing, looked at me, looked at each other, and then did it all again in English
Lappeenranta is a surprising airport, big runway stuck in the woods, tiny terminal, virtually no service apart from the hop to Helsinki, which has recently downgaded yet again, from a Saab 340 to a Jetstream. Whenever I have travelled there I was the only person on the flight interlining from beyond Helsinki; I think most of the locals from the region heading beyond Finland drive to Helsinki. On one occasion the FA with about a dozen pax on the Saab had a trainee assisting her and learning the ropes. They did all the safety briefing very precisely in Finnish, then repeated it all in Swedish. Then they looked at the manifest and my routing, looked at me, looked at each other, and then did it all again in English
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I can't help but think there's a bit of a difference between Dutch usage of a German airport and Russian usage of a Finnish one.
As has been pointed out, there's no visa issue between Germany and Holland. But more than that, as they're both Schengen countries, you don't even have to stop at the border.
Additionally, Holland and Germany share a currency. No having to change anything just for the hour you'll spend in your departure airport.
Finally, there's a language issue. Most Dutch people can speak German to some reasonable level. How would that work between Finland and Russia. I can't imagine any Russians speak Finnish; a lot don't seem to have any second language. Do many Finns speak Russian?
Now that Bratislava is in Schengen and the Euro and given most Slovaks speak German, it really is an option for Vienna. I doubt similar things can be said for many other airports near a border.
As has been pointed out, there's no visa issue between Germany and Holland. But more than that, as they're both Schengen countries, you don't even have to stop at the border.
Additionally, Holland and Germany share a currency. No having to change anything just for the hour you'll spend in your departure airport.
Finally, there's a language issue. Most Dutch people can speak German to some reasonable level. How would that work between Finland and Russia. I can't imagine any Russians speak Finnish; a lot don't seem to have any second language. Do many Finns speak Russian?
Now that Bratislava is in Schengen and the Euro and given most Slovaks speak German, it really is an option for Vienna. I doubt similar things can be said for many other airports near a border.
The fact that the truckers roadsigns at the big pulp mill in Lappeenranta are all bilingual in Finnish/Russian, and the huge long queues at the Russian border down the road, maybe gives a bit of a clue about cross-border trading.
It's true that most Russians and Finns don't speak each others language. But a substantial number from both sides speak English, including many of the Russians who want to travel to Europe.
It's true that most Russians and Finns don't speak each others language. But a substantial number from both sides speak English, including many of the Russians who want to travel to Europe.
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True, there are some very fundamental differences between Russia's and Netherlands' neighbourhoods. In former numerous limits exist, like visas, difficult border crossing, the poverty of Russian population and so on, no doubt about it. Nevertheless you must put things into some perspective. Russia constitutes so vast market! Even if first steps were difficult, there is no big risk at all in starting something (it's like a drop of water in the river, look at some unprofitable routes they've kept for years). Probably, FR should team up with a bus enterprise and give Russians some services they need. I'm pretty sure the airport could provide a Russian speaking staff to attend the visitors, it's not so difficult.
Just some imagination! MOL is thinking very locally in fact, wants to dominate the local market first while some opportunities should be anticipated and tried in more aggressive way. On another side, you have so much options to fly from the Netherlands and neighbouring countries. Does St.Petersburg have any true low-cost connections? Air Berlin's LED-MXP starting at 130€ one way (up to over 360)? Or perhaps Paris from 119€ one way on some rare days only?
Once in my life I've been to Russia (former Soviet Union in fact). Me too, I dislike the visa issues, that's why I did not travel there any more. Cheap flights, however, could soften my attitude. And who knows, one day the Russian state (and EU) could soften their visa regulations too. It's worth considering gaining some brand recognition and position/exposure there, before it happens.
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Russians would need not only a visa to go into Finland but also a Visa card or something like to book a Ryanair flight - and be able to read our alphabet, and print their tickets in a civilized language ! 
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Yes, some changes at LBC:
New from 30.03. PMI 7/7 (Flight arrives from PMI, so X-PMI-LBC-PMI-X)
GRO 0/0 to 2/7
DUB 3/7 to 5/7
PSA 3/7 to 7/7
NYO 7/7 to 4/7
No changes to STN 14/7 (but one flight in the morning-the other in the evening), HHN 7/7, BGY 3/7
New from 30.03. PMI 7/7 (Flight arrives from PMI, so X-PMI-LBC-PMI-X)
GRO 0/0 to 2/7
DUB 3/7 to 5/7
PSA 3/7 to 7/7
NYO 7/7 to 4/7
No changes to STN 14/7 (but one flight in the morning-the other in the evening), HHN 7/7, BGY 3/7