LUTON - 6

[OLNEY 1 BRAVO]

Given that both FBO's have been turning away aircraft as they couldn't handle any more during the last 6 months of 2007, any economic downturn might not have any impact on bizjet movements as demand will just reduce to equal the supply of FBO handling ..... if you see what I mean!

[CAP493]

A/c already going the long way round through the main apron

Surely it's actually a case of ATC using the most expeditious route or the one that results in the lowest overall traffic delay to all affected aircraft.

This is quite normal, rather like at other big airports, e.g. LHR, LGW, STN, MAN...

And BTW, the 'Main Apron' route is actually designated as Taxiway Alpha and has been for over 12 months...

[vintage ATCO]

But what would a LTN ATCO know . . . . .

[gilesdavies]

Ryanair have today announced a new base at BHX, basing eight aircraft there...

I appreciate most of LTN's traffic comes from South of the airport, but I know a lot of people from the likes of the Milton Keynes, Northampton and Wawickshire area that use the airport for their LCC travel. I wonder if any of this traffic will be going up the M6 now?

This year LTN overtook BHX passenger number wise, this looks like this was only a temporary thing!

Maybe BMI Baby, will look for an airport less dominated by Ryanair and choose to serve some of the London market?!

[OLNEY 1 BRAVO]

Impact of Ryanair @ BHX

Giles - I would have thought any impact will be gradual rather than immediate.

The press release states than two aircraft will be based there initially which should build to ten over a five year period. Not sure where you got eight from!

[LTN ATCO]

I know nothing, anyway whatever i post there will always be 'something' wrong, gramatical error or whatever for someone to pick up on.

It was only an observation and yes it is more expeditious overall, but thats what i always aim for, contact tower on.....

[Powerjet1]

As expected, LTN just missed out on reaching the 10m pax figure for the calendar year, finishing at 9.9m for 2007, up +5.1%. Dec was up +3.4% at 682k.

[CAP493]

I wonder if any of this traffic will be going up the M6 now?

Probably depends on where the pax are going and how they choose to access the airport.

Can't see much advantage in driving north from MK/Northampton, etc., just to fly south again. However, Dublin and Shannon might be a different matter if Ryanair serves these destinations from BHX.

Travelling by public transport from MK and Northampton to BHX in theory should be very easy i.e. train to BHX International Station. However, it's as easy from MK to LTN by simply taking the Railair Link coach.

My bet is that most of Ryanair's BHX pax will probably originate from the West Midlands and from the M6 corridor northwards from there, rather than from the south midlands area.

[ebenezer]

But what would a LTN ATCO know . . . . .

I know nothing, anyway whatever i post there will always be 'something' wrong

Now, now children, let's not have temper tantrums otherwise you'll be kept in after school...

I appreciate most of LTN's traffic comes from South of the airport, but I know a lot of people from the likes of the Milton Keynes, Northampton and Wawickshire area that use the airport for their LCC travel. I wonder if any of this traffic will be going up the M6 now?

However, it's as easy from MK to LTN by simply taking the Railair Link coach.

Actually, all that RYR is doing is re-opening its base at Birmingham. Undoubtedly, this will boost passenger numbers there but it didn't have that much effect on Luton previously when the airline had a much larger presence, so whilst there might be some impact, on its own it'll probably be marginal. As for taking public transport, there is indeed a very good hourly direct train service from Milton Keynes to Birmingham Airport which takes just 45 minutes. The Rail/Air coach link to Luton Airport on the other hand takes 55 minutes to an hour (and that's before they start the M1 widening between Junction 10 and Junction 13). Faced with the sort of disruption and traffic jams that are probable (and the temporary closure of some junctions) during the work I think this is more likely to make Luton's passengers from Milton Keynes, Northampton, etc., who prefer to drive to the airport, go north to the likes of Birmingham, East Midlands and even Coventry.

[Daza]

BHX FR much larger presence???????????

Actually, all that RYR is doing is re-opening its base at Birmingham. Undoubtedly, this will boost passenger numbers there but it didn't have that much effect on Luton previously when the airline had a much larger presence

When did FR have a much larger presence at BHX than they will have by this summer?
They did offer GRO, MJV and DUB a few years ago but that was all and they upped sticks to EMA over fees. Looks like they are returning in force now. They plan to base 10 aircraft at BHX by 2012 heres looking forward to returning to the UKs 5th busiest airport again.
Daza

[LTNman]

EDI could also overtake LTN again this year

[GayFriendly]

There was never an FR base at BHX!

Ebenezer - sorry, there has never been an FR base at BHX. As Daza says, FR operated GRO and MJV in addition to DUB, they were flown by DUB based a/c and crew eg DUB-BHX-MJV-BHX-DUB. The reason there was no effect on LTN pax figures was for the reason they operated just the three routes! With this summers hugely increased schedule, it remains to be seen how this will affect LTN but IMHO I don't think a huge amount, pax in the middle (MK/Northampton etc) are well placed for both airports so it will depend on who offers the best price and schedule when deciding where to fly from. As for annual pax figures, well let the race begin, will BHX regain its 5th biggest airport crown?????

[Powerjet1]

Given LTN's ongoing problems with Luton Borough Council regarding future expansion and the Concession, I'm sure LTN will be overtaken by both BHX & EDI in terms of pax, and rightly so. LBC will soon be seeing the results of its failure to capitalise on its one major asset , the airport.

Stagnation & downturn are close on the horizon and ryanairs decision today re BHX will not do it any favours. Also easy & ryan are very happy that price capping at STN will remain, so no help here. SKy Europe back to STN ?.

Regarding ryanair, it's base at LTN must have one, if not the smallest ratios of based units to routes flown, ie 3.25 routes per aircraft. Most bases are much more, ie EMA, LPL, BRS & now BHX, BOH. This is probabably due to the fact that just about every route is flown from STN. So would we see more routes from ryan @ LTN, to say 20/25, by reducing the frequency on some existing destinations, probably not.

When MOL, added the the 3 addional based units,to the existing the then 1, he mentioned that he saw LTN probably having 7/8 based aircraft. Now, even if they could find space to night stop, I doubt Abertis would agree to a deal.

To summarise then, at LTN, is the future bright, is the future Orange, (or blue or purple) probably not, more likely black, i'm sorry to say.

[gilesdavies]

Even though a 5% growth for LTN maybe disappointing compared to the higher figures we were used to a few year back... This figure is still very respectable.

However I agree with all of PowerJets above comments and is uncertain time to what direction LTN will go over the coming year...

By now nearly all of airlines will have realeased there summer schedule and new routes would be on sale... So far none of the airports major carriers have annouced any new routes or additional capacity from May onwards...

The likes of easyJet have simply "rejigged" there timetable to accomodate Pisa and Jersey routes, and scrapped Rijeka and Rimini.

Either LTN has no interest in attracting further growth from easyJet or Ryanair or they have no further interest in the airport... Even though as discussed many times before, basing additional aircraft at LTN is very limited right now. There could be so many opportunities to fly routes into LTN from their other bases, like how FR have demonstrated at DSA and BOH over the last few years.

With First Choice not basing any aircraft here this year, and there entire routes being absorbed by TOM, into the existing schedule. It looks like we may be heading towards negative figures. Even their newly advertised scheduled services come at the expense of other charter routes!

From what I have read about about SkyEurope, they seem to be in a precarious situation and may even be gone by the summer. They have already postponed several 737NG deliveries from Boeing and urgently seeking and struggling to find additional investment. Their load factors for the last few months have been between 59-65%!

Wizzair's growth at the airport seems to be slowing down, and already have all their bases connect to LTN, with much of there growth focused on other areas of the UK or Europe.

Even the news rom SilverJet doesn't sound good, and news reports say they will be gone by next year!

Any future growth is going to have to come from new customers, and possibly steeling some from STN. But with the news of fees there being frozen, the airport is going to have to work hard this coming year. STN has already experienced a drop in passengers for the past few months by 3-6% and I wonder if the management have taken notice that the same could happen here!

IS THERE ANY POSITIVE NEWS?!

[BIZZYBOY]

Is There Any Positive News?!

LTN is fast becoming a popular Bizjet airport and first choice for a lot of Operators.

Heavy investment is coming in from the LTN FBO's.

The future is bright the future is Business Aviation.

[pabely]

LTN is fast becoming a popular Bizjet airport and first choice for a lot of Operators.

Heavy investment is coming in from the LTN FBO's.

The future is bright the future is Business Aviation.

I think everyone knows this has been happening for a few years now, we all know about Harrods FBO operation or are you implying investment from another FBO?

[BIZZYBOY]

are you implying investment from another FBO

Have'nt the foggiest was merely commenting on the future of Ltn airport. Maybe LTN should consider the future to be in Business Aviation?

[CAP493]

Given LTN's ongoing problems with Luton Borough Council regarding future expansion and the Concession, I'm sure LTN will be overtaken by both BHX & EDI in terms of pax, and rightly so. LBC will soon be seeing the results of its failure to capitalise on its one major asset , the Airport.

This has been said many times before in this Forum and it's unfortunately, very true.

The single 'saving grace' for Luton is that notwithstanding LBC's total ineptitude, it remains one of the five major London airports and with the three BAA locations still all slot restricted for much of the day, there remains available runway capacity at Luton for anyone that wishes to serve the London market and whose operation is compatible with Luton's runway and facilities.

But if the present economic downturn becomes a full-blown recession, then everyone - including Birmingham and Edinburgh - will see a contraction and so will suffer falling business; the sad fact is that unfortunately, Luton will harder hit than the likes of Stansted and Gatwick.

It's just a shame that as a result, despite ACDL's best efforts in the face of nothing short of LBC's crass short-sightedness, Luton might not quite achieve that magic 10M ppa figure

[Powerjet1]

A few "facts" have appeared on the airport website re 2007.

1: 9.94m pax carried.
2: 93% schd, 7% charter.
3: 85% International, 15% domestic.
4: Top 4 destinations - 1st Edinburgh, 2nd Malaga, 3rd Glasgow. 4th Warsaw(somewhat surprising)

[LTNman]

I noticed a swanky new bendy bus in full station - airport shuttle bus livery today. Have to say it looked impressive and should help ease the overcrowding.