CORK - 5

[ryan2000]

Ryan2000

DEC ORK MAN EI 44% WW 58%

ORK BHX EI 48% WW 57%

So it looks as if WW are doing better on these routes although it is a smaller aircraft.

[en2r]

Ya I think they both carry roughly the same number of passengers per flight, but I don't think either carrier are making money on the routes, so I'd say its a question of who blinks first. Personally I think WW will give up first.

[brian_dromey]

Are there any stats for on time performance out of ORK?

I'd guess FR are probably best? Probably EI or WW next, and God knows RE can be hit or miss. I know there are other airlines too, but their operations at ORK are quite a bit smaller.

Good for ORK to have 4 big/medium players in the market though. FR, RE, WW have most of the UK well and truly covered! EI offeres some duplication, and of course JER.

[EC-ILS]

Register on www.flightstats.com

Its free and is a great tool for looking at ontime performance at airport on of indvidual airlines right across the world.

[en2r]

Skylink

Skylink now offer early morning services to catch the early morning flights. The first Bus Eireann service is too late for the first flights. Hopefully business is improving for Skylink, I travelled with them from the airport in September and I was the only passenger!

[840]

I've used them twice recently and they've been around 40% full both times. The passengers seem to be evenly split between airport workers and passengers. The early morning service may be aiming as much at employees who start an early shift at the airport as aiming at passengers. I know the Bus Eireann bus carries as many passengers to the Airport Business Park as it does to the airport, but Skylink doesn't stop there so it's missing that market.

One problem I find with the Skylink service is that because they operate two routes, it's hard to know when and where to get picked up in the city centre without checking their website. A slight route tweak could send both routes past the bus stop on Anglesey St and guarantee at least one spot that gets a regular service.

[ryan2000]

CAT3

Sources at Cork say that it has been agreed in principle to upgrade Runway 17 to CAT3A standard in the near future.

Should virtually eliminate diversions for EI and FR but will have a neglible effect on many of the other carriers including one low-cost that refuses to carry out CAT 2 approaches at Cork.

[en2r]

Thats great news. All we need now is a taxiway. During the morning in particular, having to taxi down the runway can create delays when a number of planes want to take off/land at the same time

Should virtually eliminate diversions for EI and FR but will have a neglible effect on many of the other carriers including one low-cost that refuses to carry out CAT 2 approaches at Cork.

We may still have diversions due to crosswinds because of the imbicile who decided to build Cork's runway at right angles to the prevailing winds. Is the low cost airline you mention BMI Baby? I'm guessing because they seem to have more diversions than any other airline, even Aer Arann.

[brian_dromey]

Well, thats good news, probs gonna cost a few bob but good to see things are finally getting done at ORK. As for the taxi-way, would a possible solution be a holding point? Possibly up to 3 aircraft at a time could then taxi to the 17 end, and hold. To be honest this would probably be more than adequate for the level of traffic ORK currently receives, and cheaper to boot, also avoids conflict with the flight school.

Need to get the debt finally sorted now though. No new routes or significant announcements will be made until this is sorted. Probably no new routes or carriers until summer 09, at this stage.

Brian.

[en2r]

Probably no new routes or carriers until summer 09, at this stage.

Well we do have Carcassonne and Plymouth, admittedly Carcassonne is at the expense of Dublin rotations, but Plymouth is new. However given the economic situation at the moment with no significant route announcements from any of the Irish airports bar Belfast, this year will probably be a year of consolidation for Cork.

[Tom the Tenor]

Cork to get CAT3A - that is great news if confirmed! A long time overdue but will be very welcome. It's installation should go some way to prove all the Rad Alt dip issue on the final phase of the approach before touchdown to runway 17 was hardly much more than a convenient excuse for inaction for many years now from parties with a bias for whatever reasons against Cork.

As for new routes - well there is the fairly recent BTS, PIK, EMA and the seasonal Carcassone to come from FR and some other new French routes from RE and the above mentioned Plymouth. All very welcome of course but what a blow to lose out on both Budapest and Warsaw in particular along with Wroclaw.

Am also hearing that there appears to be one less IT this summer - Zakynthos. Anyone know more as to confirmation? A pity if so as I would have liked to have made a visit.

[en2r]

Am also hearing that there appears to be one less IT this summer - Zakynthos. Anyone know more as to confirmation? A pity if so as I would have liked to have made a visit.

Ya I think we're losing Zakynthos but gaining a new route to Santorini instead.

[ryan2000]

Summer I.T's

However we're losing Corfu and two Lanzarote Charters, tour operators very conservative when it comes to expanding their Cork operations. BMI Baby has never carried out CAT 2 approaches at Cork.

Aer Arann has occassionaly done so.

Traffic in January and February is well up which is extraordinary given all the gloom and doom
that's around.

[eirbus06]

Zakynthos

Went to book it for the summer and was told by the travel agent that there was no demand for it and that my only option was from DUB.

[en2r]

Traffic in January and February is well up which is extraordinary given all the gloom and doom
that's around.

Ya, I think the airport is doing better than we give them credit for sometimes. The new Ryanair routes to Prestwick and East Midlands are doing decently enough. In January, just their first full month of operation, Prestwick carried 4,766 passengers while EMA carries 2,720. Prestwick in particular seems to be doing very well. Cork-Prestwick now carries more passengers than Shannon-Prestwick which has been running for years (it carried 4,181 passengers in January). These two routes should hopefully carry well over 100,000 pasengers this year. I think we should try to be more positive and look at the positives about the airport rather than the negative. At least we should have positive passenger numbers this year unlike other airports.

[brian_dromey]

I agree we need to look at the positives, but we need to acknowledge that things are not all rosy up on the hill. If the crap I have seen is indicative of the type of data ORK gives to perspective airlines, its no wonder ORK is not served by a single carrier which is a member of a major international alliance. The bodies could potentially be there on a few surprising routes, yet year after year none of these carriers are added.

ORK has little hope of ever seeing these carriers, much less transatlantic until the future has been guaranteed, and the business plan is there to attract some decent talent to the management at ORK.

Brian.

[Tom the Tenor]

I did not realise the IT situation for summer 2008 is as bad as reported above by ryan2000 - two ACE and Corfu also gone along with Zakynthos! Now if you mix all that in with the loss of BUD, WAW & WRO what you have is a right headache? Is this a good enough show from the talent at Cork? PIK, EMA & Carcassone are all very fine but where exactly is the quality carrier from a major international alliance as noted above by brian_dromey? It is a good question all right.

Cant help myself considering if the CAT3A rumors are part of an elaborate decoy action being put out by Cork management and the DAA for a bit of spin to to prepare the groundwork for some otherwise bad news on the new terminal's debt etc once Mr Cassells report is handed over to Minister Dempsey.

Then again, that may just be the conspirator in me coming to the fore - cant help that, it comes natural to me! Rememer that a famous Cork aviator, ex Nav RAF, is on record as reporting that there are more splits in aviation in Cork than there are in the Provos!

[ryan2000]

Cork Debt

Surprise, surprise, the report from the mediator on the Cork debt issue will not meet tomorrows deadline. Some progress has been made so hopefully it won't be kicked further into touch. One think is now clear; the idea of Cork starting with zero debt is now a non runner.

if people faced up to this reality sooner the issue might have been resolved sooner.

I know people will point to the promise made in 2003 but that was before the massive over expenditure on the project occured.

[en2r]

I know people will point to the promise made in 2003 but that was before the massive over expenditure on the project occured.

But the thing is who was in charge of the expenditure? The DAA of course
They were the ones who overspent on the new terminal, the CAA had very little to do with the spending. Yet while the DAA were happy to spend money, they want the CAA to fork out for overspending that had little if anything to do with them.

[ryan2000]

Of course the DAA can point to Aer Rianta as the authority who sanctioned the project. The DAA only came into existence some months after the contract was signed.

Of course the project would have cost a lot less if Cork hadn't been starved of infrastructural investment for decades. Roads, drainage, lighting. car parking etc all had to be upgraded so it wasn't simply a question of building a new terminal.

Furthermore massive excavation work had to be undertaken due to the location chosen for the airport in the 1950's.

Maybe someone should access the Department of Transport files from that era concerning that decsion.