CORK - 5
The number of times "pan-pan" or "mayday" is uttered is irrelelevant. Both should be uttered 3 times by pilot as per ICAO standard phraseology and both should get a set response emergency services wise. Calling a pan 4 or more times will illicit no more a severe response than the standard 3, likewise mayday. To be honest if I heard it more than 3 times I would suspect hypoxia, depending on quality of any subsequent transmission
To ATC
is viewed quite differently to your interpetation.
This is we have a problem.
One little word but it means so much.
Quite simply don't call us we have things to do.
When we are finished with our checklists WE will contact you.
ATC will ring the duty office with an "Aircraft Alert" and pass what details they have.
The duty officer opens the relevant section of the aerodrome manual and starts pushing buttons.
There is no room for personal opinion at this stage, just start calling people.
In the meantime the fire crew have their checklist and start deploying as per procedures.
The fire-crew and duty office will be in frequent contact with ATC to get updated info but unless the pilot can talk they have nothing to add at this stage.
The words not the amount of times is the trigger for ATC to start their "checklists".
29M declared, ''Pan-Pan, Pan-Pan, Pan-Pan, standby.''
''Pan-Pan, Pan-Pan, Pan-Pan,'
standby.''
Quite simply don't call us we have things to do.
When we are finished with our checklists WE will contact you.
ATC will ring the duty office with an "Aircraft Alert" and pass what details they have.
The duty officer opens the relevant section of the aerodrome manual and starts pushing buttons.
There is no room for personal opinion at this stage, just start calling people.
In the meantime the fire crew have their checklist and start deploying as per procedures.
The fire-crew and duty office will be in frequent contact with ATC to get updated info but unless the pilot can talk they have nothing to add at this stage.
The number of times "pan-pan" or "mayday" is uttered is irrelelevant. Both should be uttered 3 times by pilot as per ICAO standard phraseology and both should get a set response emergency services wise.
I never once mentioned subsidies,
operational advantages, maybe this time the DAA can place Cork in an even better one
Just be careful what you wish for.
Everyone is in favor of cost savings for as long as someone else is being cut.
Very true confused, but per the documented procedures, it should be said 3 times. Every Pan/mayday I have had from a European carrier has certainly been in this format.
But we are getting seriously side tracked here. Glad to see everything worked out well re this incident.
But we are getting seriously side tracked here. Glad to see everything worked out well re this incident.
The story of the Cork hurlers flying through Dublin and Heathrow to get to Florida sums up alot of Cork's problems. If the people of Cork are willing to drive to Dublin to fly to a place served from Cork then it's all bloody hopeless!
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Oh, please, please, such nit picking may be all right in fine pendanty and acute micro economics but in any terms minus seven per cent for December, 2013 is totally woeful as a dear friend from Couny Meath might say. It shows what a tough job the yet to be appointed new marketing person has on their plate.
The Cork Hurling team disease at work too, of course.
Have folk seen how EI are increasing snn jfk up to six a week from five a week for the summer? Handy that, just to nip in the bud any teensy weensy lingering hope the people at Cork might have had for a flight of their own, not that I had any delusions of grandeur in that matter.
-7 for December, 2013 - can anyone give the whole year figure?
The Cork Hurling team disease at work too, of course.
Have folk seen how EI are increasing snn jfk up to six a week from five a week for the summer? Handy that, just to nip in the bud any teensy weensy lingering hope the people at Cork might have had for a flight of their own, not that I had any delusions of grandeur in that matter.
-7 for December, 2013 - can anyone give the whole year figure?
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But yet you call for the DAA to place Cork at an "operational advantage"
So if this not a dig out perhaps you can clarify what "operational advantage" you would like the DAA to give Cork.
Just be careful what you wish for.
Everyone is in favor of cost savings for as long as someone else is being cut.
Just be careful what you wish for.
Everyone is in favor of cost savings for as long as someone else is being cut.
You seriously want me to release details of this known practice haha? But confused atco don't you work in the sector? Please do not lampoon tripe at me to try win a point you clearly know nothing about, is that your approach to life to make up crap to justify and unjustifiable point?
but per the documented procedures, it should be said 3 times. Every Pan/mayday I have had from a European carrier has certainly been in this format.
But we are getting seriously side tracked here. Glad to see everything worked out well re this incident.
But we are getting seriously side tracked here. Glad to see everything worked out well re this incident.
Maybe to you'll notice how I have quired the above not choosing a path of b*ll to win a point. Done with this conversation now.
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Oh, please, please, such nit picking may be all right in fine pendanty and acute micro economics but in any terms minus seven per cent for December, 2013 is totally woeful as a dear friend from Couny Meath might say.
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The 7% can be attributed to the fact that Wizzair and Ryanair were head to head on several routes last year.
Furthermore Aerlingus has less flights this year and chose not to operate any extra flights for Christmas.
Looking ahead to 2014 there are grounds for some optimism but there are also lots of hidden cuts to schedules particularly in the 1st Half of the year.
As of now it's difficult to see where any growth is going to come from in Q1 and Q2.
Furthermore Aerlingus has less flights this year and chose not to operate any extra flights for Christmas.
Looking ahead to 2014 there are grounds for some optimism but there are also lots of hidden cuts to schedules particularly in the 1st Half of the year.
As of now it's difficult to see where any growth is going to come from in Q1 and Q2.
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The comments re. the Cork teams travel plans are not warranted, no one seems to have confirmed the reasons why they chose Dublin over Cork. If it was due to cost, the fact that they were able to get to Dublin, and across to Heathrow for less than from Cork direct, that's Cork's problem. Not the airports problem directly, more so Aer Lingus and their fare structure.
May I ask confused atco are you in ATC?
for my sins
congratulate amazing efforts by this crew.
You seriously want me to release details of this known practice haha?
Because for someone who maybe is you seem very ill-informed.
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Back to the Cork thread, Aer Lingus have now taken out the Monday and Thursday slots from Cork to Barcelona so it will operate on Wednesdays, Fridays and Sundays for S14 ~ However Aer Lingus and Aer Lingus Regional are still capacity wise ahead for S14 - There are no seasonal reductions by them from the 30 March onwards compared to S13.
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Problem for Cork is that Ryanairs' flights to Bergamo, Girona and Palma are bookable only from June to August as distinct from March to October inclusive in 2013. While much is being made of Aer Arann's new route to Newcastle, there is no mention of Jet 2's withdrawal from the same route.
There are also other significant gaps in the schedules such as the lack of any Charter flights to the Canaries until May and of course there is the Wizzair factor which will surely impact on the traffic for the early part of the year.
While I understand the need for airports to sound upbeat and put on a brave face going into a new year, I certainly wouldn't put more than €20 on Cork achieving growth in 2014.
There are also other significant gaps in the schedules such as the lack of any Charter flights to the Canaries until May and of course there is the Wizzair factor which will surely impact on the traffic for the early part of the year.
While I understand the need for airports to sound upbeat and put on a brave face going into a new year, I certainly wouldn't put more than €20 on Cork achieving growth in 2014.
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Actually Ryan I have to agree with your worries about the seasonality of S14, particularly with Ryanair - I'm not worried about Aer Lingus. They have really increased the seasonality operation of their base in Cork. Would hope this will change toward Oct 14, hearing there will be a positive announcement then for us by them.
One thing I also find surprising is how we have no year-round Cork-Faro service especially when next summer Aer Lingus will be operating 8x weekly on that route as well as Ryanair with 4x weekly services, so to go from 12x weekly to 0 in the Winter maybe shows how seasonal sensitive this market is. But I believe with even a weekly service this winter (they definitely had a slot for it, 2 in fact) it could have worked. And believe it or not, Faro does bring its share of inbound tourism, especially in October for some reason, very popular with the Southern Portuguese in that month.
One thing I also find surprising is how we have no year-round Cork-Faro service especially when next summer Aer Lingus will be operating 8x weekly on that route as well as Ryanair with 4x weekly services, so to go from 12x weekly to 0 in the Winter maybe shows how seasonal sensitive this market is. But I believe with even a weekly service this winter (they definitely had a slot for it, 2 in fact) it could have worked. And believe it or not, Faro does bring its share of inbound tourism, especially in October for some reason, very popular with the Southern Portuguese in that month.
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Quote:
All ryanair routes are bookable for S14 bar Krakow, La Rochelle and Warsaw-Modlin there are gaps in the schedules for those routes.
Krakow and Warsaw not on sale still, could be just complete speculation but anyone think its might just have something to with SNN getting these routes for the summer.....they could drop them or delay the release to boost SNN numbers, La Rochelle only operated for a small period this year so it could go anyway.
If FR were to not operate the polish ones (I know you said there is gaps) the ORK would want to work hard to try and get Wizz back to one or both of them (meaning KTW for KRK).
All ryanair routes are bookable for S14 bar Krakow, La Rochelle and Warsaw-Modlin there are gaps in the schedules for those routes.
Krakow and Warsaw not on sale still, could be just complete speculation but anyone think its might just have something to with SNN getting these routes for the summer.....they could drop them or delay the release to boost SNN numbers, La Rochelle only operated for a small period this year so it could go anyway.
If FR were to not operate the polish ones (I know you said there is gaps) the ORK would want to work hard to try and get Wizz back to one or both of them (meaning KTW for KRK).