HEATHROW
Paxing All Over The World
macnan
The terminal is working at less than 50% capacity. Due to the almighty foul-up, not all the flights have yet moved to T5.
L337
Well, thank you for your polite message ...
The thread was about progress in T5 and I gave feedback from an average middle-aged woman (who enjoys airports and air travel) and found that it was not a particularly pleasant experience.
The thread invites discussion and I put forward some points - yet you make petty, personal remarks. You may find that the protocol in these forums is to discuss the subject and not the individual.
Now, as it happens, I express very few criticisms - either here or in life. I have learnt that giving criticism almost always changes nothing, particularly in business, so I just change my purchasing away from the product.
From my visit to T5, delivering my sister to departures, I have several more direct criticisms of the signage (inside and out) and thought that, once working at full volume, it will be no better than T4. There are also observations following interactions with the staff but, in deference to your delicate nature, I shall not inform anyone of them.
Nowhere was packed
L337
For heavens sake your sister needs to get a life.
[snip]
You and your sister seem to want to complain for complaining sakes.
[snip]
You and your sister seem to want to complain for complaining sakes.
The thread was about progress in T5 and I gave feedback from an average middle-aged woman (who enjoys airports and air travel) and found that it was not a particularly pleasant experience.
The thread invites discussion and I put forward some points - yet you make petty, personal remarks. You may find that the protocol in these forums is to discuss the subject and not the individual.
Now, as it happens, I express very few criticisms - either here or in life. I have learnt that giving criticism almost always changes nothing, particularly in business, so I just change my purchasing away from the product.
From my visit to T5, delivering my sister to departures, I have several more direct criticisms of the signage (inside and out) and thought that, once working at full volume, it will be no better than T4. There are also observations following interactions with the staff but, in deference to your delicate nature, I shall not inform anyone of them.
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I travelled through T1 yesterday and was not impressed.
Security is stricter than at MME, you have to stand in a specific point to get your photo taken, (happens as you hand over your boarding pass at MME), you have to take shoes off at LHR, not MME, there is no space to put shoes back on so blocking access for others coming through.
Edit - note, I have no problem with security, but would like some consistency...
When you finally get through, you then have a long walk and another boarding pass check to get through to the domestic departures.
BMI wouldn't let me in the lounge, MME did, yes it was a cheap ticket so guess it was a bonus at MME.
LHR is scruffy, dirty and generally unpleasant.
I have flights booked each month until Christmas, but will be travelling home by train in future, it is easier in the long run.
Oh, and just for a change, the flight was delayed....
Security is stricter than at MME, you have to stand in a specific point to get your photo taken, (happens as you hand over your boarding pass at MME), you have to take shoes off at LHR, not MME, there is no space to put shoes back on so blocking access for others coming through.
Edit - note, I have no problem with security, but would like some consistency...
When you finally get through, you then have a long walk and another boarding pass check to get through to the domestic departures.
BMI wouldn't let me in the lounge, MME did, yes it was a cheap ticket so guess it was a bonus at MME.
LHR is scruffy, dirty and generally unpleasant.
I have flights booked each month until Christmas, but will be travelling home by train in future, it is easier in the long run.
Oh, and just for a change, the flight was delayed....
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Passed through T5 on a quiet Saturday afternoon. In front of me was a frail lady in a wheel chair, eighty if she was a day, with a nurse in attendance. She had a leather case with her, probably as old as she was. The bag was much narrower and shorter than the baggage frame, but one inch longer. They would not let it through. She was understandly upset, could not understand what was wrong. There was no-one else around. I asked the BAA lady if she had any discretion, and suggested that if she just let it go no-one would ever know. 'We have to treat everyone the same, sir.' I walked off in disgust, leaving the nurse asking for clemency.
On the other side, loads of Americans with huge carry-ons that had obviously gone through flight connections.
We English live in a mean, nasty, brutish country of which, I am sad to say, I am ashamed.
And T5? Cheap, nasty, in-human, over-staffed, built down to a price, will age dreadfully. Bit like the rest of the country, really.
On the other side, loads of Americans with huge carry-ons that had obviously gone through flight connections.
We English live in a mean, nasty, brutish country of which, I am sad to say, I am ashamed.
And T5? Cheap, nasty, in-human, over-staffed, built down to a price, will age dreadfully. Bit like the rest of the country, really.
The Position of T5 LHR
Um!
I've often wondered about the position of T5 at LHR.
The recent tragedy in Madrid, would seem on face value, to compound my concerns. A loss of control on rotate, would IMHO put T5 in a position to collect the aeroplane.
Was this senario looked at, I wonder, when the planners made their recomendations.
I've often wondered about the position of T5 at LHR.
The recent tragedy in Madrid, would seem on face value, to compound my concerns. A loss of control on rotate, would IMHO put T5 in a position to collect the aeroplane.
Was this senario looked at, I wonder, when the planners made their recomendations.
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Tell you what, why not build pax terminals 5 miles away from the runway - but, no, that won't do either, what if an aircraft drops out of the sky while on the downwind leg? That's it then, they'll have to go underground....but, blow me if the security risk assessment says that's not a good idea either. OK, I give up. Where do you suggest, IcePack?
More seriously, ICAO Annex 14 sets out the areas that should be clear of obstructions etc. for when an aircraft departs the runway in an unintended manner. Now if you want a discussion on the suitability of Runway Strips, Cleared and Graded Areas, Obstacle Clearance Surfaces etc., by all means lets have it - but for heaven's sake let's be sensible about things!
PS - I was on a railway platform the other day and I tell you, if the train had derailed as it came into the station it would have been pretty dangerous for all of us there!
More seriously, ICAO Annex 14 sets out the areas that should be clear of obstructions etc. for when an aircraft departs the runway in an unintended manner. Now if you want a discussion on the suitability of Runway Strips, Cleared and Graded Areas, Obstacle Clearance Surfaces etc., by all means lets have it - but for heaven's sake let's be sensible about things!
PS - I was on a railway platform the other day and I tell you, if the train had derailed as it came into the station it would have been pretty dangerous for all of us there!
Lets hope that in the future the stupid thread does not prove to be not stupid.
Seriously, IMHO when an engine failure at rotate is mishandled by the flying pilot the A/C tends to go about 30 degrees off the RWY heading.
Mind you I gave a comand candidate a V1 cut on No1 Engine on a VC8 (4 eng A/C) once and he rotated instead of waiting to Vr. Streuth the heading change was more like 60 deg, with me spooling up the simulate failed engine , that taught me lesson.(VMCG inc Nose Wheel stearing. Before modern thinking)
Some of you of a certain age might remember a viking (I think) that went rather off course at LHR years ago.
Keep terminals in the centre of airfields I say. Yes you can not cover every eventuality but I think (not Knowing the exact track) Madrid is QED.
Seriously, IMHO when an engine failure at rotate is mishandled by the flying pilot the A/C tends to go about 30 degrees off the RWY heading.
Mind you I gave a comand candidate a V1 cut on No1 Engine on a VC8 (4 eng A/C) once and he rotated instead of waiting to Vr. Streuth the heading change was more like 60 deg, with me spooling up the simulate failed engine , that taught me lesson.(VMCG inc Nose Wheel stearing. Before modern thinking)
Some of you of a certain age might remember a viking (I think) that went rather off course at LHR years ago.
Keep terminals in the centre of airfields I say. Yes you can not cover every eventuality but I think (not Knowing the exact track) Madrid is QED.
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Concur with Spitoon ...
In a world filled with consipiracy theories, I suppose it is unsurprising that some would consider that ICAO Annex 14 had failed to take account of the reality of aircraft operations, and what could happen, and at what probability. Hundreds of aircraft operators and ATC professionals over many decades undoubtedly just doodled something from time to time on a beer-mat, and then persuaded the entire aviation industry to accept the safety criteria they came up with.
[Retired ATCO]
In a world filled with consipiracy theories, I suppose it is unsurprising that some would consider that ICAO Annex 14 had failed to take account of the reality of aircraft operations, and what could happen, and at what probability. Hundreds of aircraft operators and ATC professionals over many decades undoubtedly just doodled something from time to time on a beer-mat, and then persuaded the entire aviation industry to accept the safety criteria they came up with.
[Retired ATCO]
Just to add a little more in the same vein to IcePack at Post#903. The Report on Canberra Accident at RAF Wyton in March 1991 is worth reading. Although heavily redacted, it nonetheless it clearly illustrates that things can go disastrously wrong when an engine fails (is failed) at this stage of flight and is not correctly handled. The report notes that the crew had "considerable experience". I would expand on that to say that the handling pilot; for whom I had the greatest respect; was a very experienced Canberra pilot.
We're all human.
YS
We're all human.
YS
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Royal Aeronautical Society - Heathrow Lecture Programme 08/09
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I know its not just from Heathrow, but there are a load of long haul flights from here, but does anyone know when flights in about Nov-Dec 09 are on sale with airlines like BA, Virgin and other airlines for long haul routes??? they go upto Aug 09 at the moment, but even low cost airlines have upto Oct 09 at the moment...
Too mean to buy a long personal title
I'm surprised to see that any low-fare airlines are booking up to October 2009. Which ones? It's more common to see low-fare airlines booking to a much shorter time horizon.
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Yes thats why I expected like BA or Virgin to have there Oct 09 flights on sale by now
bmibaby, jet2 goes upto Oct 09, Ryanairs say that it goes upto Aug 09, but you cant book a flight after April 09
bmibaby, jet2 goes upto Oct 09, Ryanairs say that it goes upto Aug 09, but you cant book a flight after April 09
Too mean to buy a long personal title
I think the reservations systems of the major airlines (and the global distribution systems on which they rely) won't do more than a year ahead, hence the limitation. So these limits are absolutely typical of major airlines.