HEATHROW
Thanks for the responses. Are they legally allowed to do that considering the alternating runways operation that are in place?
See http://www.heathrowairport.com/stati...-prog-2012.pdf
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northerly runway landings
@davidReid - thanks but this is for 06:00 onwards, these landings are prior to that and are not covered in the PDF. It is on a daily basis that the early birds are landing on the northerly runway regardless of wind direction but mostly coming in from the East.
thanks but this is for 06:00 onwards, these landings are prior to that and are not covered in the PDF
Let's take an example - BAW26 from Hong Kong is one of the first arrivals, usually landing between 04:30 and 05:00.
Here is the landing runway that it has used for the last 28 days:
20/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
21/06/2012 09R southern runway easterly
22/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
23/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
24/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
25/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
26/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
27/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
28/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
29/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
30/06/2012 27L southern runway westerly
01/07/2012 27L southern runway westerly
02/07/2012 27L southern runway westerly
03/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
04/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
05/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
06/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
07/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
08/07/2012 09L northern runway easterly
09/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
10/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
11/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
12/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
13/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
14/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
15/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
16/07/2012 27R northern runway westerly
17/07/2012 27L southern runway westerly
Can you see the pattern ? Two weeks using the northern runway, followed by two weeks' use of the southern runway.
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Thank you Dave, I can truly see a pattern emerging. Hence my question of why they were on the northerly which is happening on an almost nightly basis. The night time alternations are not being adhered too and last night was yet another example. The earlies were once again landing on the northerly.
The night time alternations are not being adhered too and last night was yet another example. The earlies were once again landing on the northerly.
The first landing this morning on the northern runway (27R) was AAL100 at 06:02, conforming to the daytime alternation programme.
That was preceded by BAW26, BAW12, VIR201, BAW56, BAW28, QFA9, BAW16, UAL958, CPA251, MAS2, BAW64, SIA322, and CPA255, all on the southern runway (27L) as per the night alternation programme.
Actually from 04:30 to 06:59 dual runway arrivals are operated and have been doing so for a very long time.
There are only around 15 flights scheduled/allowed to land from 04:30 to 06:00, so one runway is more than adequate during that period.
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Quote: "Not quite. Heathrow normally operates with one runway closed until 06:00 - that's when dual runway arrivals start.
There are only around 15 flights scheduled/allowed to land from 04:30 to 06:00, so one runway is more than adequate during that period."
This is to allow for longhaul overnight arrivals. AFAIK (but stand to be corrected!), no departures are allowed before 0600.
There are only around 15 flights scheduled/allowed to land from 04:30 to 06:00, so one runway is more than adequate during that period."
This is to allow for longhaul overnight arrivals. AFAIK (but stand to be corrected!), no departures are allowed before 0600.
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Whilst one runway is adequate for the 04:30 to 06:00 my question is that it has constantly been the northerly for a very long period. Should this not switch to the southerly as an alternate on a rotating basis? Thanks for all the repsonses thus far.
Whilst one runway is adequate for the 04:30 to 06:00 my question is that it has constantly been the northerly for a very long period. Should this not switch to the southerly as an alternate on a rotating basis?
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There is a preference for 27R arrivals (in the said time frame) for operational reasons since the majority of landings at the time are coming off either Lambourne or Bovingdon holds.
That said the Kenya and few T4 long haul carrier may get 27L as may the QF/EK A388s for operational reasons.
That said the Kenya and few T4 long haul carrier may get 27L as may the QF/EK A388s for operational reasons.
AFAIK (but stand to be corrected!), no departures are allowed before 0600.
But it's true that no carriers currently schedule departures before 06:00. BD used to have the occasional 05:55 departure to JED/MED, but it normally left late and rarely got airborne before 06:30.
It would make sense that those scarce pre-06:00 night quota slots are of more value to airlines for long-haul arrivals than for short-haul departures.
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Quote: "I don't know if it's a ban (I haven't seen it documented anywhere), in fact the night quota restricts numbers of movements without differentiating between arrivals and departures."
Thanks for the info.
Quote: "But it's true that no carriers currently schedule departures before 06:00. BD used to have the occasional 05:55 departure to JED/MED, but it normally left late and rarely got airborne before 06:30."
Makes sense, there would be little demand.
Quote: "It would make sense that those scarce pre-06:00 night quota slots are of more value to airlines for long-haul arrivals than for short-haul departures."
Exactly, and increasingly so with the projected growth of longhaul destinations.
Thanks for the info.
Quote: "But it's true that no carriers currently schedule departures before 06:00. BD used to have the occasional 05:55 departure to JED/MED, but it normally left late and rarely got airborne before 06:30."
Makes sense, there would be little demand.
Quote: "It would make sense that those scarce pre-06:00 night quota slots are of more value to airlines for long-haul arrivals than for short-haul departures."
Exactly, and increasingly so with the projected growth of longhaul destinations.
There is a preference for 27R arrivals (in the said time frame) for operational reasons since the majority of landings at the time are coming off either Lambourne or Bovingdon holds.
That said the Kenya and few T4 long haul carrier may get 27L as may the QF/EK A388s for operational reasons.
That said the Kenya and few T4 long haul carrier may get 27L as may the QF/EK A388s for operational reasons.
Since the beginning of April, I can only count around 10 landings that haven't conformed to the published night time alternation programme.
That said, in the weeks when the southern runway was the designated one, there were, on average, around 2 fewer landings daily between 04:30 and 06:00 than there were in weeks when it's the northern runway.
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Good article on the issues facing European hub airports, if anyone is interested;
IN FOCUS: Heathrow proves a poisoned chalice for UK government
IN FOCUS: Heathrow proves a poisoned chalice for UK government
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The duty runway during the night period is rotated on a fortnightly basis and is rigidly adhered to unless there is a particular issue (engineering fault etc) as to why the duty runway cannot be used. This does not happen very often. I'm afraid to say that your thought that the northern is used more often will not be backed up by the statistics. Sorry!