SHANNON

[Una Due Tfc]

Lots of negative press around Norwegian at the moment though, director of finance resigned, losing money hand over fist, share price in freefall. Who knows where they'll be if this keeps up.

[AerRyan]

Aer Lingus apperently looking at operating a limited frequency service to JFK between January and March.

The United winter pullout took quite a few people by surprise, especially as they seemed to confirm the schedule as 4pw for winter.

[Dreamliner_01]

Originally Posted by AerRyan

Aer Lingus apperently looking at operating a limited frequency service to JFK between January and March.

The United winter pullout took quite a few people by surprise, especially as they seemed to confirm the schedule as 4pw for winter.

Was never going to be smooth sailing for Shannon unfortunately once Norwegian came - it was clear looking from the outside in that they find it difficult to sustain all the capacity into North America - be an awful shame if aer lingus start cutting also

[PPRuNeUser0176]

Would be surprised if EI stepped in. BOS loads are not massive during that period so I suspect EI will leave it pick up the slack.

[AerRyan]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner_01

Was never going to be smooth sailing for Shannon unfortunately once Norwegian came - it was clear looking from the outside in that they find it difficult to sustain all the capacity into North America - be an awful shame if aer lingus start cutting also

I don't think NAI have had any effect on this decision whatsoever. From my point of view, it looks like it may have occured anyway. However, I am still slightly surprised at the move by United.

Also, I think you read my post incorrectly, I was referring to the possibility that EI may pick up JFK for the 2 months it takes a break due to UA leaving. It leaves a nice gap in the market for them IMO, and as their current break is quite short I wouldn't be overly surprised to see them in.

Lots of unhappy to be passengers around yesterday and today anyway!

[Dreamliner_01]

Originally Posted by AerRyan

I don't think NAI have had any effect on this decision whatsoever. From my point of view, it looks like it may have occured anyway. However, I am still slightly surprised at the move by United.

Also, I think you read my post incorrectly, I was referring to the possibility that EI may pick up JFK for the 2 months it takes a break due to UA leaving. It leaves a nice gap in the market for them IMO, and as their current break is quite short I wouldn't be overly surprised to see them in.

Lots of unhappy to be passengers around yesterday and today anyway!

I hear what your saying but if EI looking at reducing winter further it would be a big call to reverse that and all of a sudden restore previously cut winter capacity - also looking at the fares on offer by Norwegian during the winter I think EI might not want to get into a bloodbath fares wise - some of the fares on offer just aren't sustainable

[AerRyan]

Aer Lingus haven't cut any capacity this winter?

Also, I don't see a 'bloodbath', as NAI fares are low for a reason, poor forward bookings. The fares go up.significantly after bookings.

Also, keep in mind Business class is the main earner, something Shannon actually performs quite well in.

[Dreamliner_01]

[QUOTE=AerRyan;9830124]Aer Lingus haven't cut any capacity this winter?

Also, I don't see a 'bloodbath', as NAI fares are low for a reason, poor forward bookings. The fares go up.significantly after bookings.

Also, keep in mind Business class is the main earner, something Shannon actually performs quite well in.[/QUOTE

Norwegian fares have been low from the outset but winter wool obviously be challenging hence lower fares

I've heard on the grapevine EI were considering 'adjustments' to their winter schedule - but that might all change given united announcement

[AerRyan]

Really? I haven't heard a thing, only thing that's changed is the BOS days off have changed from TUE/THURS to TUE/SAT.

Although, I didn't hear anything about UA prior to their cut sooo.

[bannercounty]

Not surprised with UA as I said before. Loads were chronic in winter during the periods they don't want to fly and that has only been in the past 2 years. It's a pity as I use it frequently in the winter and prefer it to EI as they can rush the food service when asked so you can sleep longer. Only 15 seats to fill in J and most have been mediocre cheap upgrades or cheap J tickets along with UA staff availing of travel. It was destined to come and poor marketing from SNN together with their parent company led to this.
I have to send 4 guys to the US in December and fares were €198.00 in economy each way. A main liner can't survive on that if you factor in the loads from the past 2 winters.

[bannercounty]

Originally Posted by EI-EIDW

Would be surprised if EI stepped in. BOS loads are not massive during that period so I suspect EI will leave it pick up the slack.

I have 4 flights to BOS in November and they have come in at €3,300.00 each. The loads are not that bad in economy.

[AerRyan]

Just to point out, the onus is not on the airport to advertise, it's completely on the airline.

However, I'd agree that Shannon has appeared to do nothing to maintain the service, something that I'm quite disappointed with. I'm also surprised at the length of the winter cut.

[Dreamliner_01]

Originally Posted by AerRyan

Just to point out, the onus is not on the airport to advertise, it's completely on the airline.

However, I'd agree that Shannon has appeared to do nothing to maintain the service, something that I'm quite disappointed with. I'm also surprised at the length of the winter cut.

Completely agree - an airports marketing of a route will never be the deciding factor on whether a route works or not - airports aren't tourism promoters they are essentially a bus stop - tourism Ireland is the vehicle for promoting the route in the US - airports have enough to do to secure the carrier and the route which is a huge financial investment initially I suspect and in addition get the operational aspects right - in addition the route is a very nature route so shouldn't need any real support from Shannon - no matter if Shannon threw a million at the route by way of marketing it's the airlines marketing efforts and yield management that decides a route and of course the most important factor of all the market demand

How do you know Shannon did nothing ? I would have thought behind the scenes they did everything they could to preserve the winter service ??

[fivejuliet]

Originally Posted by AerRyan

However, I'd agree that Shannon has appeared to do nothing to maintain the service, something that I'm quite disappointed with. I'm also surprised at the length of the winter cut.

So you go to airport management meetings to know this? The public know nothing of most commercial airport activity outside of route announcements

[AerRyan]

Originally Posted by fivejuliet

So you go to airport management meetings to know this? The public know nothing of most commercial airport activity outside of route announcements

I'm not "the public"

Although, it's obvious to someone in the public eye (hence I can publically state) that over the years pressure has been piled on United, many deals have been made to keep or gain other services, similar to the issues EI had with LHR. Ryanair getting great deals for their service, while EI providing great connectivity and the most important service to the airport, are paying the full bang.

[Dreamliner_01]

Originally Posted by AerRyan

I'm not "the public"

Although, it's obvious to someone in the public eye (hence I can publically state) that over the years pressure has been piled on United, many deals have been made to keep or gain other services, similar to the issues EI had with LHR. Ryanair getting great deals for their service, while EI providing great connectivity and the most important service to the airport, are paying the full bang.

Surely the airport would have done all they can from a deal / charges perspective to keep the services - this is the last thing they wanted surely after losing Berlin to Kerry and the Munich and Paris services been culled?

[AerRyan]

Generally there's no real budge in airport fees unless new services are enacted, or frequency/capacity upgrades occur. You can understand why though, you can't have all customers paying nothing.

[AerRyan]

PHL will return on the 4th of April, well needed boost after loss of EWR for the winter.

[AerRyan]

Shannon-Stewart NY up to 3pw from March with Norwegian.

[Dreamliner_01]

According to the Cso stats for May 412 passengers used the Lufthansa service - is this service using the 189 seater or the 90 seater CRJ?? Can only assume it's the CRJ as would represent a 27% load factor on the 189 seater - even on CRJ it's only a 57% load factor on what's an expensive Aircraft to operate - anyone any insight into how numbers have been over the summer ?? Should be a good service