Whatever they are looking for, the simulator block at Cranebank is a squalid building. The simulator I used had poor visuals and no sound for important things such as Tcas warnings or the gear retracting or extending.(Sound had been paid for!).
One of the toilets in the building had a bucket to catch urine that was leaking from one of the urinals and the other toilet had an aroma worse tnan a beachfront hole in tne ground in the sub-continent. Not exactly what you would expect from the World's favourite.

That is everything i am looking for. :)

Presumably they used that sim because it didn't need sound?

Shame you weren't in the new sim hall with the nice shiny new sims. It's very nice indeed.

Tubby
 

Trust us, we know, we know.................I think that bucket was there when I did my assessment in 198X and I've done my bit to fill it up every time I visit the place...:ooh:

Anyhow you might be pleased to know that as Stocious has pointed out the ground training hardware (sims, SEP rigs, the lot) is in the process of moving to a brand new home inside one of the refurbished hangars at the old base area adjacent to Hatton Cross...I've not been over there but I gather it's all jolly spiffing....:8 and a great improvement.

Here's a link to an article about it all in a publication worthy of HIGNFY :ok: :cool:

ISG lands contract to build BA flight simulator centre ? Construction Enquirer

I'm not sure whether the bucket will get to move or not...the contract for that is probably still out to tender...

I was just surprised that a normal looking bucket with all the appropriate qualifications to catch and contain waste had passed the selection to be there!

maybe the bucket was integrated into the toilet and not a modular unit.

What! It is not Carbon fibre with Titanium trimmings........???

On schedule
 

The link provided to the new sim building project by ISG shows a completion date of 'Spring 2014'. Is that a typo and should the correct date be 2041?

As shown by the bucket things never move quickly in BA.

I read on PPJN that DEFO will start on - £52000 plus allowances ? Really ?
Thats a take home of £3100 per month plus some allowances. Take Home.
Unbelevable . Its horrible and is less than 20 years ago lol

I was misguided and was under the impression that a long haul FO would be on upwards 80k plus gross ?

Oh well, I can be happy to stay put & not to waste my time applying with salaries like that. For rich kid's kids only.

Words fail me...

:D and you believed the stories of 80k plus starting salary, one out then four days off before flying home. Do that three times a month and we will have your car valet done for your return. Next you will be asking for the cheese board.

Reality check....yes 52k after allowances 63-64k. 18-21 days a month flying. Mainly 3 sector days, some four as well and at heathrow that's asking.

If you expect more money may I suggest you join as a CSD on world wide :}

Umm it's ba the most junior of said group gets to remove the bucket of piss.

Hi all,

Quick question. I would hate to let this rare NTR opportunity pass me by, given that the last time BA opened up for non Airbus/Boeing guys and girls was years and years ago. Now I appreciate I'm at the bottom of the pile when it comes to 'preferred' criteria, I have approx 430hrs on jets. By the end of next month I expect to have near enough 500hrs thus fulfilling the minimum requirements, is it worth/reasonable applying now? If the 500hrs was arbitrarily plucked out of the air then I would understand that they are the requirements they have laid down and that's that. However, BA have made it clear that the 500hrs is there to satisfy the zero hours flight time training requirement, so if I was jammy enough to be offered a job with them, by the time I would start my training there would be no issues as I'm sure after swimming in the hold pool for a while I'd be well on my way to 1000+hrs. Only aspect that makes me uncomfortable is in the preliminary questions it asks if you have the 500hrs and at this moment in time I don't and they make the point of answering honestly blah blah...sorry that wasn't really a quick question as originally stated, but a penny for your thoughts good people? Thanks.

I think you have answered your own question, however for the sake of 4wks I would definitely suggest waiting. Have the questions drafted and hit the submit button as soon as you surpass the 500hrs. For reference BA will take your logbook on any selection day.

Bex, oh yes it was like this before, well not quite that cushy , but a reasonable lifestyle.

So a take home pay of say £3500 for a long haul 777 FO. BA was the epitomy of British aviation. A place where all would aspire to work, rest n play. If you didnt get in,and were capable you could join a second tier airline such as Caledonian, Britannia . Failing this , then go east young man, and work for CX$$$

BA is a facade. Fly to serve. But it all boils down to lifestlye. No money no honey. The average British home price is £272000. On a takehome of £3100 and to save a deposit of 20% and come up with the £2000 a month to service the mortgage a month will leave you broke. There fore its rental only.Or a park home with granny.

If the asipring BA pilot, the best of the best ( after selection) cannot buy an average joe bloggs terrace, then whats it all come to?

And still there must be 100s clambering over each other desperate to sign up.
27 years layer, you make the top FO scale, taking home 6k a month. what a load of crok.

The only people they really want are those who have property, no mortgage, and a ton of cash in the bank. but then i aint working for40k a year . Good luck though Bex88, you reap what you sow. .

I guess highfive and those that are like minded won't be joining BA, I bet BA are shaking in their boots as to the prospect of an imminent recruitment crisis and will upping the salary scales immediately. :ugh::ugh:

It's all a choice no-one is being forced to work for BA.

Sky Rocket, applications close in under a fortnight so if I waited I'll miss the boat! Any idea typically how long it takes to process applications and invite you to a selection day?

highfive



When I joined BA quite a few years back joined the Senior chaps tended to live in "nice" houses within 10 -20 miles of LHR (e.g. Henley, Windsor). In the last few months I've flown with more then one co-pilot s who has expressed doubts they'll ever be able to buy anything larger than a rabbit hutch anywhere desirable within one or two hours drive of London. Whilst that probably says as much about the bizarre state of the south east UK housing market than it does about UK pilot's T&C's it's still a fact that does need to be considered by anyone thinking they can easily move house and home from the regions or abroad to be within easy reach of LHR.

Just to bring the house price versus income argument into perspective, I was looking at 4/5 bed terrace houses in Kew Gardens the other month.

Asking price for a terrace house ....... £1.25m to £1.5m.

I would suggest that any PAYE employee on a company starting income would 'struggle' to keep up with housing prices in the South East unless they are already on the ladder.

If you don't want to work in the SE then apply elsewhere. As always it's your choice.

highfive, no wonder you turn your nose up at £52k starting. You need to go and see a decent mortgage broker, you are being well and truly taken advantage of. A 90% mortgage on an average house (£272,000) will have monthly repayments of around £1200 - £1300. Yes, saving for a deposit is difficult, but that is true of any profession in todays world in the south east of England. If you don't like that, go into politics, become an MP and change it.

BA isn't everyones cup of tea; no one on here has any problems with that. I work for BA and Im not the company biggest fan. Some of the negativity however, over that last few pages astounds me. BA are taking on low hour pilots and paying them £52k basic; have you seen whats happened in Monarch recently?

Get in the real world. The "old" world died along time ago.

SetStandard +1

£52k needs to be put into perspective:

84% of the population of England earn less than 50k
In London, the average income is £27,868
Income in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It's about the same pay as a Dentist (7 years of Uni plus 2 years of internship, and the average for ALL dentists, not just those with NO experience, is 53k)
UK average salary is £26,500 but figures reveal huge pay gap between rich and poor - official earnings list - Mirror Online

I was hoping for some advice from chaps already in BA, as I'm really in two minds on applying. I have zero interest in long haul, so what are the prospects for a long term career on BA short haul? How many block/duty hours in a typical month, how many nights away, how many days off per month, or anything else that might be pertinent? Also looking for more detail on winter leave available (my other business interests get too busy in Winter to continue flying full-time). I know there's a lot of info posted here, but it would be great if someone could sum it up.

Of course you don't have to live in Windsor or Kew. There are many areas North and east of LHR where you can get a decent 3 bed semi for 120K or a 4 bed detached for 200K and have a commute of only 70 mins or less.

The call out time on Stby is 120 mins so that gives quite a large radius in which to find somewhere suitable. With the recruitment rate at the moment you won't be on the bottom of the 320 list for long so will be able to bid for tours. This will reduce commutes to 5-6 a month.

I would allow anything from 1 to 2 weeks and sometimes more after submission, as previously posted in this thread.
Your circumstances are manageable and I would rather that half full glass ;)

There is a lot of fixating on the lowest pay point which I don't really understand.

In my opinion looking solely from a monetary point of view, attaining a quick command and potential LTC position in Easyjet etc is going to be lucrative in the short term. My own quick ballpark maths, which may be incorrect, gives me an age of 31 as the point where it is not worth joining BA, from a monetary point of view.

If I were lucky enough to join BA I would certainly lose a considerable amount of cash over the next 10 years, but I should in time catch up. There are plenty of young pilots that don't want to endure the pain for the longer term gain because they do not wish to sacrifice their current cash-flow and lifestyle, a perfectly valid outlook. Each to their own. For me, the decision to apply to BA rests with lifestyle and longterm gain.

Comparing apples with apples I believe KLM and Aer Lingus offer a similar starting salary to BA? I have friends who joined SAS recently who describe living on their pay point one as "challenging". The decision to join these career airlines is not about starting salary, for me at least.

BA Direct Entry Non Rated
 

I for one would love a crack at the selection, I have applied and would very much like to work for them.

Good luck to all applying. :ok:

Good stuff :ok: and good luck Harry.

Out of curiosity, anyone here previously hold-pooled and emailed the recruitment team directly, as advertised, had a response yet?

Does anyone know why last month the minimum hours were dropped to 200 and now they are back to 500?

non type rated

How likely is for an expat (albeit with ELP 6) to get a job with BA?

As long as you have the right to live and work in the EU, you can work for BA.

Think very carefully!
 

In a behind closed doors deal which we were informed of lastnight, BALPA and BA have torn up Bidline for Shorthaul.

You will be working to EASA limits from Jan 1st.

In a comprehensive betrayal of its members, the Union has looked after its mates in longhaul, and thrown the rest of us to the dogs.

Pardon my ignorance, but what protections does Bidline provide to crew, over EASA FTLs?

It always was the BA Longhaul Pilots Association.

Airbus

....Just come over from this AM's debate on the BA Balpa Forum by any chance?


For completeness this what the BALPA newsletter I got actually said on that subject:

FWIW yes, I feel the deal is pants, most especially given the lack of movement in efficiencies from other areas of the workforce....and yes, I know "we" (as in Long Haul) "will be next".

As an aside beyond the heated rhetoric I really feel the BACC has a serious communications problem......personalities and their position in the scheme of things on the line is definitely getting in the way of any chance of a reasoned debate.

Wiggy I agree, until the current chairman changes, and a less confrontational, my way or the highway character takes over, the BACC will have a problem with it's comms.

Airbus Unplugged - it's not BALPA or BA that have thrown you to the dogs, it's the market. We live in a capitalist system. BA short haul needs a lower cost base to remain competitive, turn a profit and ultimately - survive. This is derived through 'efficiencies'. Bid line is not the most efficient way of rostering your human resources.
It's a cruel world. But don't worry, BA long haul will have to face it's own day of reckoning in the near / medium future. Wait for Norwegian or similar to crack an acceptable cheap transatlantic service and everyone will have to follow.
Everything has changed. It's horrible for all our T and Cs, but there's only one way this is going.
Don't go blaming BALPA or even the company. Our country's / the world's economic model is set up to make this happen. Customers will chose the lowest cost acceptable product they can find - and businesses must provide what is wanted or go under.
Sitting as a BA employee it would be easy to feel slightly immune / protected / outside the cut throat nasty world of cheap low cost no frills airlines. As Morrisons, Sainsbury's and Tesco's have found out - you're not. Aldi and Lidl are coming for you. I'm afraid BA is not Fortnum and Masons or Harrods. At best it's Waitrose - and even they have to have a competitive cost base, comparative pay and staffing.
It would also be easy to think BA just needs a little tweak here and there. Minor adjustments to bid line etc. Willy Walsh knows this isn't the case and that wholesale reform is required. Terrible, but true.
Most BA pilots know that the market and reality is barking at the door. Those close to retirement might just walk out the door and not face the new era. However, for those younger, and those contemplating joining, be in no doubt, the last hiding place from the harsher airline world is going to disappear.
I really wish it was otherwise.

The 'we've all been shafted on SH and you're alright on LH' argument doesn't really help anyone.

Excepting those who are already in the LHS on LH and will, probably, remain in that position the natural 'flow' to LHS LH is through LHS SH.

Therefore, for the majority of pilots in BA who aim for LHS LH they will have to accept the new SH regulations. Ironically these regulations would have become law anyway in 2016. What is coming in is increasing the productivity for the SH crews whilst at work without increasing the number of days at work.

Nothing is ideal, we would all like to go back to the heady days of the 60's and 70's where one or two trips a month was the norm. It isn't going to happen unfortunately.

As far as the communications from BALPA BACC have been, in my opinion, atrocious and the 'we know best we'll feed you the crumbs when we deem fit' approach hasn't helped ease tensions.

Direct entry recruitment
 

Any news on the recruitment campaign guys? Did they successfully recruit enough airbus rated people for this year and next. The same for the Boeing wide body opening? Is the Non rated recruitment just to fill a small gap in the numbers? Even after all of the above postings I'm still interested. :O