Anyone who thinks NAS is the same as FR needs to get their head checked.

Some observations since I joined NAS:

1. Basic salary. In FR I had none.
2. Paid annual leave. In FR I had none.
3. Transparent basing system. In FR there was no system IMHO.
4. Seniority list. In FR none.
5. Crew food. In FR none.
6. As much tea coffee and bottled water as you want during your duties.. In FR none
7. Union recognition. In FR none.
8. Uniform crew bags etc which are provided by the company at a cost of just over 1100 pounds sterling. In FR none.
9. ACARS/CPDLC. in FR there was none.
10. Electronic Flight Bag. In FR none. The First Officer lumbers around a big trip kit. The EFB makes life so much easier with performance, flight plans etc.
11. Weather radar that has auto tilt. In FR standard one fitted.
12. Standbys paid. In FR I had none.
13. Medical and licence renewal paid. In FR not provided for me.
14. Hotel at the sim provided. In FR not provided for me.
15. Hotel provided when out of base. In FR not provided for me.
16. Loss of Licence. In FR I had none.
17. Sky interior. In FR awful interior IMHO.
18. Short field performance 737 with carbon brakes. In FR standard model.
19. Night stops in some nice places and some not so nice. Variety. In FR none.
20. ID travel. In FR I had none
21. Commuting to and from base via S2 tickets which are booked via a simple SMS booking system on your phone that takes about 10 seconds to do. Pick your allocated seat. Travel in civilian clothes. Bottle of water/ tea coffee provided. Turn on your laptop and turn on your WIFI. More legroom than in standard 737 with reclining Recaro seats. All small things you might think but add up to make a big big difference to the commute.
In FR commuting is in uniform where you turn up at the gate and will be the last one to board the aircraft. No allocated seat,endless sales PAs to endure and lovely bright fluorescent lights to keep you awake in your cramped seat.
22. Airport ID provided and paid for. In FR at my own cost.
23. Car parking provided. In FR none.

There is so many more things but I can't think of them all right now.

Ok management are trying to cut terms and conditions but they are being met with fierce resistance unlike FR. And long may it continue by the way.

jedy are you actually insane? That's a genuine question by the way.

I would hazard a guess that you were one of those passive types in FR that didn't engage in the RPG and didn't have any interest in getting union recognition and better terms and conditions. Am I right?

If I am right it's people like you that we don't need here IMHO. There is a career here that's worth fighting for.

I hope you get back into FR. Don't forget to pack your lunch and bring a tea bag :mad::ugh:

Great post go-around!! 23 points jus to name but a few!!! :ok:

Smooth - Exactly, balpa tried more than once and failed miserably! If they cant break the fr machine then the boys and girls on their own have no chance!

Completely agree though, in NAS once they get away with degrading the t's&c's and get a whiff of a weakness that will be the start of a downward spiral!! It cant be allowed to happen!!!

The CURRENT T&C's are good and it's a nice place to work.

The PROPOSED new T&C's are such a massive and insulting reduction that I would simply stop working if and when they were implemented.

I really don't want this to happen, obviously. As someone who is heading to LGW later this year I am very worried indeed.

What to do? Join BALPA is a start I guess. Must admit to being rather dubious about their effectiveness outside the BA world though.

I think our only real hope is that the HEL boys really stand up and fight hard for us all. Good luck to them and we'll do whatever we can to help.

You forgot about the bit where they :mad: you off downroute somewhere where you have to find yer own way, accommodation, transport, food after you've followed a set of rules just to jumpseat which if abused our "privledge" will be withdrawn!!! Hang on, privilege?? You mean necessity!!! Do they expect us to drive?? Its so hard to explain how big a bunch of they are in the higher echelons!

That is exactly what NAS is doing to me. Oh¡ I forgot maybe at the end of the month I will be rostered out of my promised base but meanwhile you can talk to Crew replanning (they have no idea about what is going on) or you can take the issue with your contracting company (because you are a BRK service provider, remember) Don't forget to pay everything at your expense and travel on your days off.
The nice thing though, is that instead of the usual :mad: from RYR they will tell you have a lovely day.

Guys, please wake up! you are still a contractor with nothing guaranteed at all (and that is including your base) the contract is far, far, far from being what I call really good and see what is coming to all of us after the sweet offer to all the HEL guys. But then again some people value a free lunch and water a lot more than I do.
We are not all that stupid, trust me and like I said before there quite a few now trying to get back to RYR. If I could get my old BRK contract in my 5*4 base I would be gone yesterday with my very kind regards.

Like I said before not worth the effort.

Sorry Jedy I'm kind of lost here,

Are you saying that when your rostered out of base that NAS dont roster you to get there or pay for your hotel and transport to and from the hotel or crew food (granted crew food is generally not great wherever you work but better than searching for the nearest carrefour!)? And also who pays for your uniform when you get to work? Didn't they pay for your medical too to enable you to do the job they pay you for?? Talking about pay........im sorry you mentioned that nothing is guaranteed?? So your saying that the basically 90% of of your total monthly salary you get before you even set foot on an aircraft, thats not guaranteed either? Could you maybe explain that? You'd prefer to go back to FR so you can sit on sby 4 day's (5 in a week wudnt be a first, i can prove that!) and get :mad: all pay for it? That holiday you want to book later in the year your not sure if you can afford it yet because you don't know how much money you'll make by then? Thats if you can get the leave, after its rejected to still show available next week on screwdock! Ive requested the same week twice, rejected both! How can it not be available if it's available! (again granted im aware leave cud do with some attention at NAS too) Very stable that i must admit, i can see why u would like to return!!

Do i sense correctly that your perhaps not in the base you wud prefer to be in for homelife, you'd prefer to be in base u where in with FR even tho it probably doesnt exist with NAS right now? If this is the case then i think its a bit un fair that you took the job knowing you wud have to commute to your base every week, then come on here and complain how :mad: it is (u compare it to FR!)!

Would any of this be correct? Just to put it into context thats all, if your based exactly where you want (same as u where in FR) then i may take your comments with a little less salt involved! If its the fact you get posted out of your assigned base (preferred maybe?) a lot to scandi or other bases for your week and return on day 5 i would have a little more sympathy, but maybe a little more foresight would be required, with a company in these stages its inevitable, until it gets to full capacity with its 300+ ac with 30+ (atleast) bases across europe!

Im not sure anyone cud keep you happy, you left FR because you obviously didnt like it, now your getting moved around europe (at the companies expense) and now your not happy at that!! Goodluck going back to FR, you might get your old base back after a fair stint in marrekesh if your lucky, then again, so many people are leaving because of the :mad::mad:treatment we receive you might be lucky, plus your ideal FR material! Goodluck!

P.s i'll swap with ya if you want! You can have my space!!

oh dear
 

Ok,

One more time for Go Arounds benefit, we're not comparing the current conditions to Ryanair's. Yes you would need your head examined to do that. We're talking about the near to long term future.

But like I've said before if you were in FR pre 2006 you'd know that actually it wasn't that bad a place to be. Things declined quickly during the mass expansion.

Similarities with NAS?? Some... NAS reputation preceded it as a friendly, forward thinking family type airline. Now they're trying to force HEL pilots onto a seriously substandard contract? And sending treating text messages to their own crew.Your surely not denying that Go Around?*Perhaps its a case of, oh well that's not my problem? Well it could be soon.

Yes yes the aircraft are fancy, perhaps that'll keep you warm at night if we end up with 9 days off a month?

A little bit of head in the sand I think. That wont help us with what's coming our way. Oh and point number 7. Union representation. Hmmm that'll be news to the lgw crew. BALPA may cry on about representing them, but how can they when we're all parc/arpi/confair contractors?? The company can simply dismiss them from any negotiations as legally they cant represent individual contractors in a collective agreement.

I'm not trying to be Mr doom and gloom, fingers crossed the management are just ,"trying it on". But I don't think so, either do 1300 CC's in Scando land.

I cannot for the life of me find a recruitment page for 737 Captains! Help please.

Regards

Tonker when you fill in the application page for contract pilots it asks you if you have the required hours for captain. So Norwegian.com - about us - careers - contract pilots fill in the form and it will all become clear. Have a good weekend

smooth landings,

you may be "in a cave" , but you have seen the light (as, fortunately, the HEL guys did too & got representation before this laughable offer.)

Anyone that believes BK has any intention to behave in a nicer manner towards his staff than MOL, needs to get their head out of their rectum to leave space for what is arriving next.

Thanks very much, very civilised:ok:

In the absence of a satisfactory response from NAR (Norwegian Air Resources. . .the "proposed" Finnish employer ) NASPA (the Finnish Union for NAS pilots ) has decided initially to "work to rule" in respect of non-acceptance of roster changes / no agreement to work days off.

Doubt if this will be the last of it.

Hope it isn't the last of it as I can't really see those measures having much effect.

BALPA is a waste of time and money - they ran away with their tail between their legs last time and at the recent RPG meetings, the BALPA rep said that they wouldn't openly support the RPG because of the fear of legal proceedings by RYR! IALPA are up for a fight and know RYR well enough to be effective, but forget BALPA.

Aluminium much better sticking together through a not so good union (as you describe BALPA ) than being divided in a non-unionized company and end up like in Ryanair.
Easy choice for LGW NAS guys me thinks.

NAS have settled with the Norwegian & Danish based CC. No further info at the moment, hope they got the assurances for the future they sought.

In relation to BALPA let's be fair about this shall we.

They negotiated the new entrant contract at Easy and the command contract remained untouched.

Sitting in the right or left hand seat at Easyjet in LGW on a permanent contract is not a bad place to be in terms of conditions and pay.

BALPA and and the senior guys at Easy stood firm and made it the career airline it is.

The cabin crew in Norwegian have maintained the very good terms and conditions that they are on in Scandinavia(agreement just signed) The Helsinki guys through the Finnish union are ready for action.

LGW will soon become the biggest base in Norwegian as far I'm aware. We need BALPA to ensure a sustainable career with decent terms.

No question about that.

As was briefly mentioned earlier on this thread, are BALPA able to represent LGW based pilots on contracts?

Having an upcoming start date and hopeful of a LGW base, perhaps after a stint in Spain, I am somewhat wary of all this management sabre rattling that's going on and what this means for the future.

I'm currently out in the sandpit and life is good, but it's not perfect - it's not home here and Norwegian allows the opportunity to make the move back. I have to say that I don't want to work for a company that everyone dislikes and I am concerned that Norwegian might turn into Ryanair mk2.

Perhaps it's a case of better the devil you know.

Everyone has an opinion of BALPA, presumably based on their own personal experiences. It's is unfair to cane BALPA in regards to RYANAIR/RPG, for two reasons. Firstly, BALPA came as close as anyone has or sadly is possibly going to get in organising/unifying FR Pilots. In 2006, I believe it was a slip of the tongue regarding membership numbers, and underhand strategic base movements by FR management that led to a very narrow defeat! Secondly, Ryanair uses the more 'pro-company' employment legislation of the Emerald Isle, whereby they are not (yet) legally bound to recognise and negotiate with any unions. :ugh: :mad:

Just my humble opinion. :ok:

LoCo Commotion.

I honestly don't think, and I do have slightly rose-tinted specs, that NAS will ever be like Ryanair. Sure, they are trying to reduce costs and be competitive, but the culture is completely different. They try to help their employees, and I include contractors within that statement, wherever possible. They are not (SMS aside) deliberately unkind, rude or vindictive at a personal level, unlike FR. It is just not in the same league!

Even Ryanair are beginning to realise how bad their employee relationships are. They have recently moved both the Director and Deputy Director of Flight Operations to new roles as (wait for it) Director and Deputy Director of Sales & Marketing! :} I think this speaks volumes about the two individuals (bully boys/Hatchet Men).

It's my opinion, that BALPA can negotiate on behalf of a strong, organised, unified group of Professional Aviators. That is of course assuming we are willing to become that group of people. :ok:

Does anybody know when they are going to hire for a 320???

How long does it take to upgrade in Norwegian?

Cheers