Ryanair Cancelling flights!
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 216
Likes: 0
From: Ireland
You decide the solution to a problem when you choose the person tasked to fix it. Setting the chief of personnel to sort out rostering is bound to lead to a manual solution with even more human resources, which there is no need for since the computerised rostering system has the ability of a nearly fully automated process provided you utilize all of it's features including long term requirements, analytics and crew holliday preference selection adjusted to availability.
Sometime companies that are in part highly regulated forget to adequately train the areas of the operation that is not. Internal training might in some cases be do the job, but one can't expect internal trainers to have full knowledge about all newly developed features in an outside sourced system without regular updates from the third party.
Sometime companies that are in part highly regulated forget to adequately train the areas of the operation that is not. Internal training might in some cases be do the job, but one can't expect internal trainers to have full knowledge about all newly developed features in an outside sourced system without regular updates from the third party.
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,788
Likes: 1,205
From: Baston
Please forgive SLF ignorance: could the poor Monarch aircrew be easily hoovered up by Ryanair?
If so, I suppose good for them but it could defuse the crisis, which would be a pity as crew fight for better conditions.
If so, I suppose good for them but it could defuse the crisis, which would be a pity as crew fight for better conditions.
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
From: mids
takes at least 3 months to induct someone if they don't have the type rating. That is if your training stream is empty. I suspect Ryanair's is backed up just now.
The other thing is most have airbus type ratings and there is no shortage of airbus jobs out there.
The other thing is most have airbus type ratings and there is no shortage of airbus jobs out there.
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,013
Likes: 15
From: Isla Grande
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,817
Likes: 1
From: Hotel Gypsy
.....and there lies a problem. The public (MOL?) don't understand or even care what someone needs to do to sit in 1A or 1B. Surely an Airbus is exactly the same as a 737? They have a similar number of seats.
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 4,507
Likes: 4
From: last time I looked I was still here.
I was reading these comments in the DT recently. These are paragraphs quoted from 3 different journalists discussing the London dispute with Uber. It made me make comparisons with some discussion going within our industry, and make comparisons with the topics under discussion. It also made me wonder why the similarities in our industry are NOT in focus and being debated in public. First it was Sports Direct, now Uber; when will an airline be the focus of attention on similar issues?
“While not mentioned by TFL, and not mentioned within the regulator’s remit, Uber has received a lot of criticism for the way it treats its drivers, who are self-employed instead of Uber workers. Politicians have rounded on the company as an emblem of the ‘gig economy’ that does not guarantee work benefits or a steady income for drivers. (That matter has become the subject of its own legal battle.)”
“London’s black cab drivers, and all private hire drivers in UK, deserve a level playing field with Uber. They don’t have one currently.”
“Uber is no stranger to controversy, whether that be for the record of its founder or for where it pays its taxes and how it treats its workers. All these things are real challenges. It’s right for them to be tackled.”
“Cynics might also suggest that the objections of TLF are veiled. Might it be that although TLF’s objections focus on safety concerns, what it actually objects to – and what the powerful trade union lobby who speak for London’s black cab drivers object to – is the flood of private hire vehicles on the street of the capital.”
“Others, like the GMB union, attack Uber for supposedly exploiting its drivers. They argue that Uber drivers are denied basic workers’ rights, like sick-pay, holiday leave and minimum wage. But Uber drivers are free to work for other providers, they choose their own hours, and polled the majority said they preferred the maintaining flexibility to having additional workers’ rights.”
The journalists also declared their own philosophy that Uber gave customers a choice; that it allowed free-wheeling entrepreneurship and markets forces to be in play; encouraged investment into job creation and broke closed shop cartels. i.e. if the customer benefited from lower prices and reasonable safe standards then all was right with the world.
The question of a how to create a level playing field, both in complying with the same regulations and workers’ rights, was not answered. They all seemed to come down on the side of free market business and passenger choice triumphed over basic employment conditions.
“While not mentioned by TFL, and not mentioned within the regulator’s remit, Uber has received a lot of criticism for the way it treats its drivers, who are self-employed instead of Uber workers. Politicians have rounded on the company as an emblem of the ‘gig economy’ that does not guarantee work benefits or a steady income for drivers. (That matter has become the subject of its own legal battle.)”
“London’s black cab drivers, and all private hire drivers in UK, deserve a level playing field with Uber. They don’t have one currently.”
“Uber is no stranger to controversy, whether that be for the record of its founder or for where it pays its taxes and how it treats its workers. All these things are real challenges. It’s right for them to be tackled.”
“Cynics might also suggest that the objections of TLF are veiled. Might it be that although TLF’s objections focus on safety concerns, what it actually objects to – and what the powerful trade union lobby who speak for London’s black cab drivers object to – is the flood of private hire vehicles on the street of the capital.”
“Others, like the GMB union, attack Uber for supposedly exploiting its drivers. They argue that Uber drivers are denied basic workers’ rights, like sick-pay, holiday leave and minimum wage. But Uber drivers are free to work for other providers, they choose their own hours, and polled the majority said they preferred the maintaining flexibility to having additional workers’ rights.”
The journalists also declared their own philosophy that Uber gave customers a choice; that it allowed free-wheeling entrepreneurship and markets forces to be in play; encouraged investment into job creation and broke closed shop cartels. i.e. if the customer benefited from lower prices and reasonable safe standards then all was right with the world.
The question of a how to create a level playing field, both in complying with the same regulations and workers’ rights, was not answered. They all seemed to come down on the side of free market business and passenger choice triumphed over basic employment conditions.
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,788
Likes: 1,205
From: Baston
Of course we know that passenger choice trades off risk for cheapness, but, hey-ho, who gives a 
until it hits the fan?.
My ar*e is seriously concerned!
As SLF I want a happy captain, a happy FO, and a happy cabin crew and am totally prepared to pay for it.
So which airline do I patronise in future please?
until it hits the fan?.My ar*e is seriously concerned!
As SLF I want a happy captain, a happy FO, and a happy cabin crew and am totally prepared to pay for it.
So which airline do I patronise in future please?
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 748
Likes: 22
From: Not Aviation House
If this was a topic that had merit, then someone sufficiently concerned would surely provide this information to the public.
One can only assume either there is not that level of concern, so no-one has spoken out; the respective unions do not feel the need to speak out; the regulator is satisfied there is 'no associated risk to flight safety' (as the parrot said); and in any case, the public are not interested / do not care.
Cheap chocolates are tempting and very tasty.
Cheap flight tickets are too good to miss out on. Many people I know fly exclusively with one loco airline, as they know they will pay rock bottom fares - they do not care about the current situation; they do not care they always get back at 3 AM, etc, etc.
Who cares how they can possibly do it so cheaply, members of the public?
One can only assume either there is not that level of concern, so no-one has spoken out; the respective unions do not feel the need to speak out; the regulator is satisfied there is 'no associated risk to flight safety' (as the parrot said); and in any case, the public are not interested / do not care.
Cheap chocolates are tempting and very tasty.
Cheap flight tickets are too good to miss out on. Many people I know fly exclusively with one loco airline, as they know they will pay rock bottom fares - they do not care about the current situation; they do not care they always get back at 3 AM, etc, etc.
Who cares how they can possibly do it so cheaply, members of the public?
easyJet Moderator
Joined: Sep 2013
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 7,009
Likes: 2,533
From: Schloss Neuschwanstein
For what it is worth, although the Monarch demise is extremely unpleasant to those associated with it, I do not believe unemployment will be their lot for long. The overwhelming majority of those pilots will pick up other jobs very quickly indeed. Good luck to them all.
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
From: Europe
I sow that Virgin, Aer Lingus and EasyJet are already offering fast track entry to Monarch's pilots and cabin crew, which means MOL won't be able to dig himself out just yet.
Does anyone have any news about the plans of the FR pilots and cabin crew? Are they planning a surprise for MOL or did they bend over and took up their like they had for years?
Does anyone have any news about the plans of the FR pilots and cabin crew? Are they planning a surprise for MOL or did they bend over and took up their
like they had for years?
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 225
Likes: 15
From: malta
If you're eferring to the compassion shown by the comments on this board, I agree. If however you see the quick scooping up of the jobless pilots and crew as compassion, don't be fooled. It has nothing to do with compassion and most with a (beginning) pilot shortage in those other companies.
And what is better to scoop up recently fired crew who are current, have experience, need less/little trainigng and, but that is speculation, are eager to join and might not negotiate the best deal just to be able to pay the morgage again?
Fortunately it works out for both this time, assuming they do get hired there.
And what is better to scoop up recently fired crew who are current, have experience, need less/little trainigng and, but that is speculation, are eager to join and might not negotiate the best deal just to be able to pay the morgage again?
Fortunately it works out for both this time, assuming they do get hired there.
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
From: at home
Genuine question about the EI- Irish registry argument where staff pay less social tax than those employed locally (in a chocolate context)
If someone would buy a EI registered airframe, park it on a airport on the continent, buy the necessary equipment for making chocolate onboard and employ a great chocolatier and sell the product locally. Would you pay the going rate for the social in that case or do you still enjoy the EI-discount ?
If someone would buy a EI registered airframe, park it on a airport on the continent, buy the necessary equipment for making chocolate onboard and employ a great chocolatier and sell the product locally. Would you pay the going rate for the social in that case or do you still enjoy the EI-discount ?
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 487
Likes: 0
From: North Up
You'd pay as little tax as you could and you'd charge loads for crap chocolates, of course.
The chocolates would be absolute !!!!e and you'd overcharge for the crap. That's the business model and it works. That's why he's a billionaire and you're not.
The chocolates would be absolute !!!!e and you'd overcharge for the crap. That's the business model and it works. That's why he's a billionaire and you're not.
Joined: Jan 1997
Posts: 7,736
Likes: 1
From: UK
An interesting nudge back on track
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...id-to-unionize
Ryanair Holdings Plc pilots campaigning for unionization amid a staffing crisis that’s led to the cancellation of 20,000 flights have been offered financial backing from American Airlines Group Inc.’s cockpit-crew association.
The Allied Pilots Association has offered to support Ryanair crews in forming a union or joining an existing body such as the Irish Air Line Pilots’ Association, according to Daniel Carey, president of the U.S. group, who met with the Dublin-based carrier’s employees last week in the city. The APA is aiming to stem the hiring of staff on unappealing contracts through outsourcing firms.
“We’ve been following the Ryanair model and we don’t want indirect employment to come to America,” Carey said, adding that Fort Worth, Texas-based APA is open to pitching in with communication expertise, IT support, additional manpower and financial assistance.
Ryanair has been forced to scrap flights affecting more than 700,000 people after the carrier failed to prepare for a change to annual-leave rules, requiring it to cram a year’s worth of vacation into nine months. The timetable cuts will trim growth and threaten to hurt the company’s reputation, giving employees a chance to force through unionization that Chief Executive Officer Michael O’Leary said last month would come only when “hell freezes over.”
Pilots everywhere are particularly keen to head off a trend toward third-party hiring led by Ryanair, which not only results in inequitable contracts and a lack of collective-bargaining power but also makes it tougher to secure mortgages and pensions, Carey said. The APA would assist with any campaigns that might be organized as well as help fund legal costs.
“It’s time to cut out the Michael the Miser act and sit down and have a proper labor-relations department,” he said. “That works better for the passengers, the shareholders, for management and for pilots.”
Carey didn’t say how much financial support the APA, which represents 15,000 American Airlines pilots and is the largest independent union for aviators, might be able to provide to Ryanair employees. The association is active in Washington and has lobbied on issues including flight safety, training and the reduction of fatigue, though providing funds abroad would be an unusual step.
Ryanair has already agreed raises of 10,000 euros ($11,760) for captains and 5,000 euros for first officers stationed in Dublin, London Stansted, Berlin and Frankfurt, and plans to meet with other base representatives in coming months.
The carrier referred requests for comment on the APA’s involvement to a Sept. 27 statement in which it said it would not meet with pilot unions, only with its employee representative committees. Ryanair has said anonymous demands for group meetings have come from pilots and unions at competitor airlines keen to pursue an industrial-relations agenda at its expense.
Ryanair shares rose 2.7 percent to 17.34 euros. That helped erase the stock’s losses since the first round of cancellations were announced after the close on Sept. 15 and lifted the company’s market value to 20.5 billion euros.
The European Court of Justice said last month that Ryanair employee lawsuits can be heard in jurisdictions where they are based, something analysts reckon could led to it being required to employ staff on local contracts. The ruling represented a “big boost” for pilots as they seek to organize, Carey said, while also prompting investor concern that Ryanair’s labor costs might rise, undermining its competitive edge.
Evan Cullen, president of the Irish pilots’ union, said that while organizations like the APA can be of assistance, it is for Ryanair’s pilots to decide whether they want to act as one collective body or retain the status quo. He added that Ryanair crews are “afraid individually to raise their heads,” while stating that his union is not engaged in any industrial action at the carrier.
----
Ryanair Holdings Plc pilots campaigning for unionization amid a staffing crisis that’s led to the cancellation of 20,000 flights have been offered financial backing from American Airlines Group Inc.’s cockpit-crew association.
The Allied Pilots Association has offered to support Ryanair crews in forming a union or joining an existing body such as the Irish Air Line Pilots’ Association, according to Daniel Carey, president of the U.S. group, who met with the Dublin-based carrier’s employees last week in the city. The APA is aiming to stem the hiring of staff on unappealing contracts through outsourcing firms.
“We’ve been following the Ryanair model and we don’t want indirect employment to come to America,” Carey said, adding that Fort Worth, Texas-based APA is open to pitching in with communication expertise, IT support, additional manpower and financial assistance.
Ryanair has been forced to scrap flights affecting more than 700,000 people after the carrier failed to prepare for a change to annual-leave rules, requiring it to cram a year’s worth of vacation into nine months. The timetable cuts will trim growth and threaten to hurt the company’s reputation, giving employees a chance to force through unionization that Chief Executive Officer Michael O’Leary said last month would come only when “hell freezes over.”
Pilots everywhere are particularly keen to head off a trend toward third-party hiring led by Ryanair, which not only results in inequitable contracts and a lack of collective-bargaining power but also makes it tougher to secure mortgages and pensions, Carey said. The APA would assist with any campaigns that might be organized as well as help fund legal costs.
“It’s time to cut out the Michael the Miser act and sit down and have a proper labor-relations department,” he said. “That works better for the passengers, the shareholders, for management and for pilots.”
Carey didn’t say how much financial support the APA, which represents 15,000 American Airlines pilots and is the largest independent union for aviators, might be able to provide to Ryanair employees. The association is active in Washington and has lobbied on issues including flight safety, training and the reduction of fatigue, though providing funds abroad would be an unusual step.
Ryanair has already agreed raises of 10,000 euros ($11,760) for captains and 5,000 euros for first officers stationed in Dublin, London Stansted, Berlin and Frankfurt, and plans to meet with other base representatives in coming months.
The carrier referred requests for comment on the APA’s involvement to a Sept. 27 statement in which it said it would not meet with pilot unions, only with its employee representative committees. Ryanair has said anonymous demands for group meetings have come from pilots and unions at competitor airlines keen to pursue an industrial-relations agenda at its expense.
Ryanair shares rose 2.7 percent to 17.34 euros. That helped erase the stock’s losses since the first round of cancellations were announced after the close on Sept. 15 and lifted the company’s market value to 20.5 billion euros.
The European Court of Justice said last month that Ryanair employee lawsuits can be heard in jurisdictions where they are based, something analysts reckon could led to it being required to employ staff on local contracts. The ruling represented a “big boost” for pilots as they seek to organize, Carey said, while also prompting investor concern that Ryanair’s labor costs might rise, undermining its competitive edge.
Evan Cullen, president of the Irish pilots’ union, said that while organizations like the APA can be of assistance, it is for Ryanair’s pilots to decide whether they want to act as one collective body or retain the status quo. He added that Ryanair crews are “afraid individually to raise their heads,” while stating that his union is not engaged in any industrial action at the carrier.
----
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 4,507
Likes: 4
From: last time I looked I was still here.
while also prompting investor concern that Ryanair’s labor costs might rise, undermining its competitive edge.
Which always raises the question why RYR's competitors do not raise the issue of an uneven playing field. When it comes to subsidies and tax breaks and relaxed tariffs etc. everyone is screaming at unfair tactics. Why is there no voiced concern at alleged dubious reductions in employment costs?
Which always raises the question why RYR's competitors do not raise the issue of an uneven playing field. When it comes to subsidies and tax breaks and relaxed tariffs etc. everyone is screaming at unfair tactics. Why is there no voiced concern at alleged dubious reductions in employment costs?