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FlyBe to acquire BA Connect (Crew thread - no spotters)

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FlyBe to acquire BA Connect (Crew thread - no spotters)

Old 25th Nov 2006, 11:01
  #501 (permalink)  
 
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The new FlyBe pay offer has received a majority yes vote by a very small margin. It favours the Dash well (nearly 20% over 3 years) once again at the expense of the Jet crew (13% over 3 years ).

Here are the basic salaries of both types and both seats :

EMB195 Capt. (+683 for every year)

FY0607 = 54170
FY0708 = 56879
FY0809 = 59154

EMB195 F/O (+525 for every year)

FY0607 = 33509
FY0708 = 35184
FY0809 = 36592

Dash 8 Capt. (+683 for every year)

FY0607 = 46151
FY0708 = 50000
FY0809 = 53500

Existing Dash 8 F/O (+525 for every year)

FY0607 = 27239
FY0708 = 28874
FY0809 = 30597

New joining Dash 8 F/O (guessing not the BAcon crew )

FY0607 = 23000
FY0708 = 26670
FY0809 = 29451

T's&C's and schedule agreement to still be negotiated.
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Old 25th Nov 2006, 12:17
  #502 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by GroundBunnie
Dear Borat
Your concern for the ground handling staff at BRS will not go unappreciated. Thanks from me, one of the CSMs, and thanks from the rest of the team at BRS.
At a meeting between Big Jim and the BACON staff reps at EXT 2 Thursdays ago, he said Flybe would not require any BACON ground handling at BRS. There have been comments further back in this thread about 50/60/70% of staff at BHX/MAN/EDI/GLA losing their jobs, but at BRS it will be 100%, including me. The initial state of shock has just about worn off, but it's becoming a real problem to keep everyone going. What will happen in the next few weeks is that the CS staff here will be leaving as and when they can. Most have little service, and waiting for a couple of hundred quid in redundancy money will not be enough to keep them from 'taking the orange'. I've started to have a recurring nightmare that I'll get into work at 0500 one morning and be the only one there. Obviously, we're not going to be recruiting, and our ability to handle the schedule, plus the 4 other airlines we handle 3rd party, will decline in the new year. All of you who are BRS based, or fly in and out of BRS, may find me on the flight deck telling you we've only managed to check-in half the passengers, and do you want to wait until we've finished, or go now. Also a request to be kind to your dispatcher, none of them currently will have a job in March.
Rgds GroundBunnie
Ground Bunnie, I'm very sorry to hear about your predicament, and that of other BA Connect ground staff at other bases. Is there another ground handling agent at Bristol, or is it only Servisair? There seems to be a recurring fear for ground staff I've spoken to at BHX that they'll end up back with a handling agent, which is fair enough considering that some probably started off as a CSA with a company like us (Servisair). Surely a monopoly at an airport the size of BRS can be broken with a new handling agent offering more jobs even if it's without the BA benefits.
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Old 25th Nov 2006, 12:43
  #503 (permalink)  
 
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If you are positive enough it is a god time to leave the GH industry as it pays little enough. The next group to follow will be the BA ground handling at LGW and if that works it should be farewell to BA GH at T5. Shortly after this a wedge of the CS will go as well with check-in represented by self service by 2010. Those of us that have been employed by airlines for the last 20-30 years have enjoyed the best of it and commissirations to those that will and are effected by these changes.
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Old 25th Nov 2006, 15:18
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Grrr What to do?????

Well it seems to come down to the basics - stay with Flybe, probly with a bit less money, and maybe working a bit harder, [although that doesn't seem likely if you're off the Emb 145!]. Or, take the orange pill if they'll have you. Got my orange 'assessment' next week, but if successful, it means a move, which Flybe maybe won't. On the other hand, if I turn EZY down, then rumour has it I'm blacklisted - anyone know? Buggered if I know what to do.
Small Prince - I think we probably all agree with you about that tosser from the rock, but then we all do about Hutchings, and Phelan, and Deacon, and Evans and De La Flosse, and McClaren and Walsh......it doesn't actually change anything, and it degrades the value of your posts. Most interested to know if you have been asked to be so pro-Flybe by management, or if you really mean it?
On more genral ground, my most sincere condolences to to all of the GH made redundant, I really feel for you guys, you have done a great job, day in and day out for as long as us, and the thing could not have continued without you. You deserve better, my very best wishes for the future.
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Old 25th Nov 2006, 22:04
  #505 (permalink)  
 
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LP should worry - copies taken of his recent derogatory post and will be copied as necessary to interested parties for legal action as deemed appropriate. And don't shoot me - I am just the messenger.

P-Jumper - thanks for the proposed salary info however just because you have won a ballot by
a very small margin
doesn't mean that it will be approved - take a reality check. A good ballot result presents a credible threat of industrial action and the company might take note. Or not. However a weak majority (as suggested here) leads to further negotiation and compromise.

And considering that the majority (we only have 7 Dash versus something like 42 jets) of BACON are already on jet fleets - with the now prospect of moving to Dash means yr 1 BACON Captains potentially take a cut of £5769 to fly a large turboprop. And there aren't any year one Captains anyway - most are year 5 or more (continuous service counts - no going back to zero when promoted) (hence £8749 pay cut). Similarly yr 1 FO jet with BACON moved to Dash with you faces a cut in pay of £7061. Perhaps Flybe pilots can have some understanding now why BACON pilots are very concerned AND LEAVING (and/or applying to leave) IN DROVES. Nothing personal I would suggest - but if our existing pay isn't (as a minimum) frozen at present levels - then no way can people afford to stay. Mortgages etc.

The only potential BACON winners are those FO's who take a Dash command - however many of our jet FO's could have had a Dash command with us 4 or 5 years ago - but hung on for the jet command. So I would suggest limited interest especially if bonded. Especially when they could pick up a direct entry command on 145 with bmi (with far better career prospects) at £52320.
Not to mention easy jet etc. So I would suggest that much of the negativity towards Flybe from BACON pilots is due the above. Should our respective CC's reach suitable agreement that resolves the above issues there will be far more content!

Last edited by Sidings; 25th Nov 2006 at 22:14.
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Old 25th Nov 2006, 22:59
  #506 (permalink)  
 
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Grrr

There seem to be a lot of posts disappearing tonight, and why has the thread vanished to another forum - I would have thought the activity shown deserves an R&N headline. LP, any confirmation you are acting at the request of Flybe management?
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Old 25th Nov 2006, 23:03
  #507 (permalink)  
 
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Sidings,

"the pay offer has been accepted".

Those are the words of one of our CC.

If you can persuade Jim to change it and increase ALL salaries so that you will have enough to pay the mortgage, your a better man than I.

PJ
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Old 25th Nov 2006, 23:16
  #508 (permalink)  
 
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I say again,posts are being deleted...lets have the details to make up our own minds....censorship by whom ?
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 00:15
  #509 (permalink)  
 
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If you can't pay a mortgage with 52k pa I am seriously worried

Think of the poor soles who really are 'flipping burgers# and 'stacking shelves' on £5.70 PER HOUR!
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 07:02
  #510 (permalink)  
 
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Thumbs down

Ok, come on, own up. Who is deleting posts from this topic? Dosn't make for a fare debate if all side can't have their say! Deleting posts regarding deleted posts eh? Comment from the moderator please.
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 07:55
  #511 (permalink)  
 
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Chrism20 i am pleased that your salary is so good that you can contemplate a drop on average of £6000 as merly an inconveniance and not as a belt tightening experiance.
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 08:15
  #512 (permalink)  
 
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Question for the BACon pilots ...

If offered the choice of having your salary red-ringed until it naturally slotted in your equivalent salary but you would have to go to the bottom of the seniority list, or maintaining your seniority but therefore you must move onto Flybe terms and conditions inc salary, which would you opt for?

I don't genuinely believe one single BACon pilot is going to be made to take a salary cut at Flybe. Q300 boys and girls get a massive pay rise. 145 f/os waiting 145 command will be offered Q400 command and given a massive pay rise. Others will have pay freeze until Flybe salaries catch up with theirs over the next couple of years. Don't forget at present 2000 hrs is the time to command at Flybe on the Q400, so the majority of BACon f/os could get command and the associated pay rise well before all the 145 are phased out.

Don't forget the BACon aircraft will be on the BACon AOC until they are one by one phased out, so the pilots will presumably still be on BACon contracts to operate these BACon aircraft. Pilots will be phased on to Flybe aircraft as a BACon aircraft are one by one phased out, and at that time they will be made to sign a contract with their new employer. Forced pay cuts = strikes and Flybe management will not want that.

For those of you who were recently made to leave your homes in SOU and GLA to stay with your employer, presumably base transfers back home will be an option, but under the Flybe relocated conditions (i.e. you volunteer - you pay the costs!)

But hey every single person on this forum is guessing at how it will work. Why not just wait and see what the proposed scheme is rather than getting your class 1 medical suspended in the mean time due to stress and high blood pressure!
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 08:46
  #513 (permalink)  
 
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Talking Pay rise spyay rize -

I am most definitely NOT acting or posting at anybody's request. I reckon any pay rise is better than a cut or a P45. Remind me how many pay rises BACON have had over the last couple of years?

I think Alpha C has put better than I the points I have been trying to make. Sure, everyone may not be around when the final details filter through, however I'm willing to bet there will be a significant number who will wish they were back in the Flybe pan when they look at how hard they are now working in the fire of their new EZY uniforms!
Finally, some heavy wording about Libel zipping around here, along with posting deletions without explanation, yet other posts making the same points of ID and implication left alone
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 09:25
  #514 (permalink)  
 
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So TLP,

you didn't delete your thoroughly nasty post about a certain BACON pilot from the Rock?

If not, perhaps you'd like me to copy it here for all to see just what kind of individual you are.

Please advise.

Last edited by osbo; 26th Nov 2006 at 10:00.
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 09:59
  #515 (permalink)  
 
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I'm pleased somebody deleted it!

Last edited by Thumperdown; 26th Nov 2006 at 12:55.
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 10:23
  #516 (permalink)  
 
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Thumbs up

No Osbo, I didn't. However, he and I are corresponding with a view to sorting out another of his misunderstandings. BTW, I hope you're enjoying retirement - how is the vintage car collection?
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 10:43
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Red face Benevolent Dictator.......

Do you mean who I think you mean??? Does he have anything to do with the Flybe takeover - if not, why mention the old so and so.
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 12:28
  #518 (permalink)  
 
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Wink Focus!

I think this important forum is in danger of losing its focus. I also happen to know TLP personally, and he is a top banana (pilot ), a good bloke, and more importantly, an excellent judge of character - I would back up all he has said about ALL the individuals he's named. However, I'm now just as guilty of thread-creep, so let's please have this thread back where it belongs on R & N, and have someone tell those of us, like me, who have long left the creaking wreckage of a once great Regional Airline what the latest official party line is. Please.
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 12:50
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Removed at the request of "Anotherflapoperator"

Last edited by osbo; 26th Nov 2006 at 13:20. Reason: Removed at the request of "Anotherflapoperator"
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Old 26th Nov 2006, 13:00
  #520 (permalink)  
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Yes certain posts have disappeared, and I have deleted all mine, well except this one as I should offer an explanation. I have stated my beliefs about the situation, the implications and wishes for a prosperous airline, and one of my comments was mistakenly taken as refering to another serving pilot, and presumable friend of TLP.

He and I have sorted this matter out between us via PM, and I have also attempted to let him know why his information about me is somewhat one sided and untrue. I would say nothing I've said has really contributed to the discussion much, and I appear to have made a couple of people forget their responsibility to not name drop or imply things that they shouldn't on open forum. Thus I've withdrawn from this thread completely, and at least it's shortened it a bit for newcomers to read!

TLP's character judgements are probably well placed usually, but I reckon his information is a bit biased in this case as he doesn't know me personally very well at all. If you have a copy of his post, please delete it, I am satisfied now it's gone.

Final post out.

Mark.
 

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