BA pilots 'prepared to strike'?
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BA profits up
That nice Mr. Walsh has said............
"The accounting deficit in the New Airways Pension Scheme (NAPS) is up by £101m to £2.1bn, despite the company’s increased contributions and equity markets at a five year high."
“We have announced our proposal to tackle the pension deficit and I am pleased with the dialogue we have had with staff, trustees and trade unions on this vital issue."
Bugger! Springs to mind.
PLM
"The accounting deficit in the New Airways Pension Scheme (NAPS) is up by £101m to £2.1bn, despite the company’s increased contributions and equity markets at a five year high."
“We have announced our proposal to tackle the pension deficit and I am pleased with the dialogue we have had with staff, trustees and trade unions on this vital issue."
Bugger! Springs to mind.
PLM
FX Guru
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Apologies to butt in, but the reason your pension deficit is crap is that you seem to have crap pension fund managers!
I have done no research into your situation and have not read the bulk of the preceding pages, but, at the risk of being flamed --
1) Who are your fund managers, or is the fund operated internally?
2) Does anyone (IE you folks at the coalface) get a say in how the fund is administered?
3) If you do have a representative what does he/she say? Does he/she have any input into investment decisions?
4) If you don't have a representative, why not?
5) What are the managers' fees?
As someone who has threatened to strike to protect my own pension, you have all my sympathy.
Fortunately my pension gurantees me 66 percent of a three-year averaged gross when I retire. The fund is in surplus but they have started cutting back annual increases to exisiting pensioners.
Seriously, this a fight worth fighting.
Best wishes.
I have done no research into your situation and have not read the bulk of the preceding pages, but, at the risk of being flamed --
1) Who are your fund managers, or is the fund operated internally?
2) Does anyone (IE you folks at the coalface) get a say in how the fund is administered?
3) If you do have a representative what does he/she say? Does he/she have any input into investment decisions?
4) If you don't have a representative, why not?
5) What are the managers' fees?
As someone who has threatened to strike to protect my own pension, you have all my sympathy.
Fortunately my pension gurantees me 66 percent of a three-year averaged gross when I retire. The fund is in surplus but they have started cutting back annual increases to exisiting pensioners.
Seriously, this a fight worth fighting.
Best wishes.
Keeping Danny in Sandwiches
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The deficit may have gone up because the life expectancy of the members has been raised. Actuarial valuations are notoriously broad brush.
The interesting thing is that the share price has gone up today on the increased profits. That share price takes account of the current deficit in the pension scheme and the dividend policy of BA.
Members of a pension fund have access to the accounts; ask to see them if they haven't already been sent to you. They should show the basis of the valuation.
The interesting thing is that the share price has gone up today on the increased profits. That share price takes account of the current deficit in the pension scheme and the dividend policy of BA.
Members of a pension fund have access to the accounts; ask to see them if they haven't already been sent to you. They should show the basis of the valuation.
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Angels
The truth of the matter is that NAPS is run by BAPIM Ltd based in a little office in Holboln. They are actually so good at what they do BA nearly sold them off two years ago. So it's not the investment team that have caused the defecit.
The truth of the matter is that NAPS is run by BAPIM Ltd based in a little office in Holboln. They are actually so good at what they do BA nearly sold them off two years ago. So it's not the investment team that have caused the defecit.
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I'm not a member but just like to say..
The pilot body that Walsh previously managed still have a defined benefit scheme with 100% membership.
Is it not the case that fighting back with a coordinated UNITED campaign might just see him off on this and many other future initiatives?
Not to fight will be read as weakess and reward and will invite many other attacks on conditions.
I am a member of IALPA but not an EI driver.
Is it not the case that fighting back with a coordinated UNITED campaign might just see him off on this and many other future initiatives?
Not to fight will be read as weakess and reward and will invite many other attacks on conditions.
I am a member of IALPA but not an EI driver.
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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£48 million divided by 40000 employees gives an average of about £1200 per employee, which is actually not far from what I'm getting - just over a weeks pay (before that crook Brown takes his cut).
I'm very grateful. Shame they're trying to relieve me of over £500000 from my pension fund. Only another 499 bonuses to go and I'll break even.
Thieves.
I'm very grateful. Shame they're trying to relieve me of over £500000 from my pension fund. Only another 499 bonuses to go and I'll break even.
Thieves.
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BA treat us with contempt and our "managers" daily seek-out new ways of belittling the job we do in the eyes of the rest of the company, and indeed beyond. Makes it easier and easier to create a climate of suggestion along the lines of:
"overpaid for the job they do, etc etc", ad nauseam.
The pension "proposal" is no more than licensed theft. Sure- I'll slave away with our ever expanding list of soul-crushing two man transaltlantics for another TEN years whilst our ground colleagues have but two extra to do. Of course I will, Willie-Boy.
When the strike starts BA either pay up, or cease to exist-its that straightforward. Cheating, lying little b*st...s.
"overpaid for the job they do, etc etc", ad nauseam.
The pension "proposal" is no more than licensed theft. Sure- I'll slave away with our ever expanding list of soul-crushing two man transaltlantics for another TEN years whilst our ground colleagues have but two extra to do. Of course I will, Willie-Boy.
When the strike starts BA either pay up, or cease to exist-its that straightforward. Cheating, lying little b*st...s.
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ShortfinalFred
Welcome to the colourful world of Engineering.
Originally Posted by ShortfinalFred
BA treat us with contempt and our "managers" daily seek-out new ways of belittling the job we do in the eyes of the rest of the company, and indeed beyond. Makes it easier and easier to create a climate of suggestion along the lines of:
"overpaid for the job they do, etc etc", ad nauseam.
"overpaid for the job they do, etc etc", ad nauseam.
Welcome to the colourful world of Engineering.
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36 pages still no strike, replies more than 700.hmmm
any way i dont see why you guys should be worried, your pension funds is safe all 12 billion of it with bank of new york the newly appointed people to look after your dosh
check this out
http://www.bankofny.com/htmlpages/npr_2006_2189.htm
just pray (ahem) they dont lend the money to us govt or invest in us govt bonds
any ways happy landings folks
any way i dont see why you guys should be worried, your pension funds is safe all 12 billion of it with bank of new york the newly appointed people to look after your dosh
check this out
http://www.bankofny.com/htmlpages/npr_2006_2189.htm
just pray (ahem) they dont lend the money to us govt or invest in us govt bonds
any ways happy landings folks
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BA should offer another deal to staff.
Increase the amount staff pay into pension to keep the same Terms and Conditions.
I would like to know what figure BA puts on that.
If BA did make this offer, Staff would be able to see the big picture.
Increase the amount staff pay into pension to keep the same Terms and Conditions.
I would like to know what figure BA puts on that.
If BA did make this offer, Staff would be able to see the big picture.
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Even more interesting comments........My previous post was affected by guinness - the point I was struggling to make was that any industrial action might lack overwhelming support if more emphasis was not made on linking in to the negotiations,a tangible improvement to BARP. Whilst it is true to say that currently BARP membership is relatively small, every new FC joiner will swell the ranks. As a BARP member, I fully accept that I joined BA in the full knowledge that as a pension scheme, it is woefull. However, as a member of BALPA ( for many years prior to joining BA ) I have to question both the CC's and the then BA BALPA membership's "ROLE" in allowing BARP to be introduced. I am not for one moment suggesting that the FSC wouldn't have been scrapped but the terms of BARP are insulting! My real point is this : industrial action needs unity - why should BARP members support any proposed industrial action if we don't see a concrete commitment on the part of the CC and the NAPS membership to improving our plight?????
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Because Sid, if we cave in on pensions due to lack of unity they know we won't have the balls to fight anything else. Our terms and conditions as we know them will be gone forever. Kiss goodbye to bidline.
I agree though BARP is crap. FWIW when i and many other NAPSers joined we too were on an inferior pension compared to our peers. The original APS was awesome! I felt slightly envious at the sums paid out but certainly not bitter that they didn't strike to get me onto APS.
Maybe one day in the distant future, son-of BARP will be even worse...hard to imagine though.
If you give your support to the fight i'm absoulutely certain BALPA will seek an improvement to BARP.
I agree though BARP is crap. FWIW when i and many other NAPSers joined we too were on an inferior pension compared to our peers. The original APS was awesome! I felt slightly envious at the sums paid out but certainly not bitter that they didn't strike to get me onto APS.
Maybe one day in the distant future, son-of BARP will be even worse...hard to imagine though.
If you give your support to the fight i'm absoulutely certain BALPA will seek an improvement to BARP.
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The worst fear of most of us in BARP, is that BALPA will fight to within an inch of their lives to protect NAPS, and then lack the stomach for another battle over BARP, when BA say they have used up all spare cash on NAPS.
The job advert on BA.com promised me an "industry leading MP pension", and BARP is far from that.
The job advert on BA.com promised me an "industry leading MP pension", and BARP is far from that.
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pt,
sorry yet another barp pilot on here moaning about the deal THEY SIGNED
yes you are right it's crap and i will be 100% behind future moves to improve your deal HOWEVER BALPA better fight to it's last breath to protect naps, the deal we SIGNED up for, or we will all be truly fecked!
please stop attempting to make the fight for barps linked with the fight to protect naps. one is about improvement and the other is about preventing a bunch of theiving MF's for welching on the deal i and thousands of other pilots signed up for.
you decided to leave RAF eating command, no doubt your ex sf and i'm humbled
, for a deal that is not under threat and is still exactly the same as they offered you the day you joined up. lets keep that in mind. joining the company and then moaning about balpa fighting hard to protect agreed pension rights instead of improving your deal seems a little rich.
if it was such a bad deal compared to what betty was giving you why did you accept it?
awaiting the usual 'your arrogant, poor team player, selfish ****' attacks from all those not on naps, except of course those lucky b'stards on aps! it's not fair I want to crystalise as well
sorry yet another barp pilot on here moaning about the deal THEY SIGNED
yes you are right it's crap and i will be 100% behind future moves to improve your deal HOWEVER BALPA better fight to it's last breath to protect naps, the deal we SIGNED up for, or we will all be truly fecked!
please stop attempting to make the fight for barps linked with the fight to protect naps. one is about improvement and the other is about preventing a bunch of theiving MF's for welching on the deal i and thousands of other pilots signed up for.
you decided to leave RAF eating command, no doubt your ex sf and i'm humbled
, for a deal that is not under threat and is still exactly the same as they offered you the day you joined up. lets keep that in mind. joining the company and then moaning about balpa fighting hard to protect agreed pension rights instead of improving your deal seems a little rich.if it was such a bad deal compared to what betty was giving you why did you accept it?
awaiting the usual 'your arrogant, poor team player, selfish ****' attacks from all those not on naps, except of course those lucky b'stards on aps! it's not fair I want to crystalise as well
Last edited by the heavy heavy; 30th May 2006 at 23:11.