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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

Old 20th Mar 2014, 09:49
  #6521 (permalink)  
 
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Latest: AMSA News ‏@AMSA_News 4m
RAAF P3 crew unable to locate debris. Cloud & rain limited visbility. Further aircraft to continue search for #MH370
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 09:49
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Originally Posted by Acute Instinct
If '24 metres' is measured from the rear, does this then bring the Satcom Antennae Fuselage AD into play?
Most unlikely as this particular 777 apparently did not have the antennae the AD addresses.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 09:53
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HMAS Stirling

Australia's entire submarine fleet is headquartered at Garden Island (suburban Perth).
I presume that there is some SAR capability operating out of there.
Probably about four or five days away from current target site - presuming something is available to be mobilised.
Double that distance if you look at Diego Garcia and US or British assets.


For this aircraft to have flown to the current target area it would have travelled about 7,000 km.
Is that possible? Even with a generous allowance for sea drift, is that possible?
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 09:53
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@ coastalpilot

Anybody have an informed opinion on how long it might take an fbi expert to recover deleted files off a computer?

Answer : no 'informed opinion' to your question may be offered until the wrecked 772 body is located at the bottom of the Indian Ocean (depth : - 2000 m ? - 4000 m ? deeper ?). The crash has (if ?) happened - say - before 10h00 LT 08Mar, ie more than 300h ago, which @ surface currents of - say - 3 kts ? - resp. 7 kts ? means somewhere 900 nm ? - resp. 2,100 nm ? away in the reverse current direction ? from where these debris are located today ... many uncertainties still, I'm afraid ...
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 09:55
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If the object spotted is indeed "24m" it's simply too big to be ANY sort of shipping container..
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:05
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P3C Time on station and drop buoys?

Does anyone have figures of the approximate time on station the Aussie P3C would have? The wikipedia figures would suggest around 8 hours (16 hours endurance minus 2500nmi return trip @328KTAS). That does sound like a useful time (ignoring the fact that the general search area has roughly the size of Sweden/France/California).

If any wreckage is found floating, would it be possible to drop bouys to listen for the CVR/FDR pings (in the right frequency band)?
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:08
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No doubt the experience accumulated during the search for AF447 will help. The difficulty in mid-Atlantic, between Brazil and West Africa was the underwater terraine, the Ridge being bisected by the Romanche trench, the third deepest in the Atlantic Ocean, and with a profile resembling the Himalayas.

The underwater terraine of the Indian Ocean may be less challenging. However, the CVR won't tell us very much, being overwritten after 2 hours....
and it is very unlikely that technical difficulties were involved in bringing down the aircraft.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:11
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bono,

Right. A container comes off the ship at less than 32.5 tons, and as long as the nature of the contents only allow it take on about 38 tons of water, it'll remain a menace to shipping. If it takes on more, then it goes to the bottom.

If the size of 24m is correct, then it's too big to be a container.

I assume that several containers were found during the search for objects.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:21
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No-one is mentioning the elephant in the room here; now granted the image isn't the best, but the shape of the object, that we can see in the image released, is not that far short of being approximately square, to my way of looking at it.

If - IF - the 24m dimension is approximately correct, I would eyeball the rough dimensions of object as 24m x 20m.

Call it 80' x 60'.

I'm struggling to picture what bit of a 772, when reduced to wreckage, could be that size or anything close to it. It's the wrong shape and size for a bit of wing or fuselage or tail.

I wouldn't get over-excited by this until we know a lot more.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:24
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If any wreckage is found floating, would it be possible to drop bouys to listen for the CVR/FDR pings (in the right frequency band)?
It would be possible, but that would be a bit pointless given that the 'wreckage' is probably over 100 miles away from the crash site and even if it were right above it, it's unlikely a pinger would be heard from the surface in water of that depth.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:26
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@ xcitation

Looks like the Malaysians aren't the only ones with issues releasing data!
Nothing to hide, just thought it wouldn't be wise. I've never been convinced by the assertions that it went west, let alone that it followed that waypoint pattern. But when someone brought it up again I just plotted it out of curiosity.

Now it seems the investigation has moved on and the Australians are searching in what seems to be a likely area for the aircraft to have ended up. And now potential debris has been spotted, I think it's now just a waiting game.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:27
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The sea floor in the area where the debris was discovered is around 3000 metres and flat and featureless.

3000 metres is well within range of ROV's.

Here is a marine chart image of the seabed from a screenshot.

http://pprune1234.smugmug.com/Pprune...reckage-X3.jpg

Thanks to PJ2 for taking the time to explain to me how to post it.

Last edited by Senior Pilot; 20th Mar 2014 at 10:35. Reason: Image is waaaay too big
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:30
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I understand each wing tank of the 772 can hold 35000 liters, if they didn't rupture that's a potential for 35t of buoyancy.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:33
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From the US, extensive coverage this morning on the voice of conventional wisdom "Morning Joe" (cable, MSNBC). Preliminary reporting indicating that nothing was positively identified on the first pass due to weather. Live report from OZ as I write this.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:34
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Originally Posted by atlast
Do MH normally service ZWWW? If not, it may not be in the FMC navigation Database. Different airlines use different databases. If ZWWW was not in the database then it would have to be entered by LAT/LONG with an elevation 50' above the field.

All the Best
That is true. It might hence be interesting to know how much of a custom tailored agreement MAS have with their database supplier.

Still, going south for hours if planning to go north should alert a person that is apparently able to operate a 777's FMC.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:42
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can anyone, confirm that data collected from the pilots simulator indicated he had made several approaches to Diego Garcia?

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/...Airlines-pilot

Last edited by Livesinafield; 20th Mar 2014 at 10:43. Reason: insert link
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:47
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News interview with flight crew on Channel 7
Summary
Location is approx 1500 NM Sw of Perth.
Flying at 100ft asl
They had all sensors operating
Channel 7 have a crew onboard an orion that will return at midnight.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:47
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Route mirrored in both latitude and longitude at IGARI

The possible debris location is remarkably close to a potential reflected route after the IGARI waypoint:

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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:48
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Are you talking the Aussie AMSA Press conference or some other TV show ?


If Aussie, I don't think he said today, I think he inferred they had had then a while - few days - while they were analysing them.
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Old 20th Mar 2014, 10:51
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MH370 range

For this aircraft to have flown to the current target area it would have travelled about 7,000 km.
Is that possible? Even with a generous allowance for sea drift, is that possible?
The return journey from KUL-PEK is around 4,600 miles so if MH370 was tankering fuel, with reserves, it could easily have travelled 7000 km.
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