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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:40
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nobody had published a definitive, official known flightpath/track, even a partial one..........
The plot (which I can see was deleted) was made based on this piece of news from Reuters.
It is entirely up to you how much credence you want to put in it:

Exclusive: Radar data suggests missing Malaysia plane deliberately flown way off course - sources
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:41
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Originally Posted by porterhouse
There were too many turns after the alleged "incapacitation", the theory doesn't make much sense in view of the known flight path. All other known occurrences of incapacitation had aircraft following the original track.
I agree in full as to the complete nonsense of that theory. But, if I am allowed to ask: which is the "known flight path" of MAS370?
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:42
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Let me ask a question of those who see the sim as completely innocent.

Suppose a plane disappeared under odd circumstances such as this one did. After the disappearance, it was found that the pilot had a very elaborate and expensive sim setup hidden in his basement which nobody knew about.

Then would you find it at least a little suspicious?
DID you really seen his cockpit pictures?

Few toys from Saitek, computer, few LCD, nothing more. Nothing really expensive. And nothing hidden - as he posted pictures on web by himself.

Just another childish conspiracy theory based on REALLY twisted facts.
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:46
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The observer on the oil platform, did he state what bearing or direction from his position the event he saw occurred ?
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:46
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Unusual seismic activity

Newbie here. I have been a silent watcher for 10 years, appreciating the input from the pros. I tried to post this earlier, when it happened but mods said no.

There's an unusual seismic activity SE in the vicinity of the planes supposed direction, (based on reurter's data).
M5.5 - 111km E of Mohean, India 2014-03-14 13:38:06 UTC

Being both a plane nerd and a geological nerd this looks odd. Its away from a fault line by a good margin. And unusually large for this region. Gt my brain thinking....
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:49
  #3386 (permalink)  

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I have to ask the same as GvonSprout:

are those pings attributable to an individual source? Yes or no. And I would bet that this was the very first question to Inmarsat. And if they said yes the follow-up question was "prove it".

The rather random course plotted in a graph earlier could also just be the coincidential return of 'pings' from other aicraft systems doing the same at an expected location.

So the question remains, same ping for all or individual pings?
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:51
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Are those pings attributable to an individual source?
The answer = Yes - a few pages back the protocol was explained.
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:52
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Originally Posted by olasek
Read my post #3416 above for the "known" flight path.
Yes, I read your post and Reuters' article too. And I am obviously aware about all the claims that put the aircraft flying West, pinging satellites for four or five hours, flying over the Indian Ocean or even landing in some remote Andaman Islands airport. But, to the best of my knowledge, there is zero conclusive evidence so far.
I only wouldn't call that a "known flight path".
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:52
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ACARS Operation

I've been doing some research myself. Not sure if this might help others:

http://www.universal-radio.com/catal...s/acarsweb.pdf
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:55
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Seems several people are having a hard time accepting the satellite pings and the associated theory that this plane is no where near the point of last contact. How many more sources need to come out for you to consider there could be something to it? Inmarsat, the White House, the WSJ, Reuters, etc. Granted none of this has been corroborated in full yet and one those sources is owned by Rupert "Faux News" Murdoch but...

That Inmarsat systems ping makes perfect sense. Most all wireless systems ping in one way or another. And just the ping itself in the absence of any other data can still be used for geo-location purposes. Which satellite was being targeted, the round-trip signal time, signal strength and signal quality all can form a basis for figuring out a rough location. What level of precision this provides, I don't know but I'd bet it could get you within 500 square miles and probably a lot less if you look for a track between pings.

Further to that, I'd bet that within one or two hours or so of last contact, US military intelligence would have caught wind of the missing plane. At least very basic steps to make sure satellite based reconnaissance was listening would have been taken. The extent of that capability we will never know. The US could very well have picked up VHF data broadcast packets that DID have telemetry in them.

If the plane ditched in the water near the point of last contact, odds are the Inmarsat ping would not have lasted 5 hours for multiple reasons.

And if your plane was in the South China sea, it would have been found by now.

Last edited by ianwood; 14th Mar 2014 at 19:59. Reason: Clarity
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:57
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Lithium Battery theory

Now CNN seems to be pushing a 'lithium batteries did this' theory. Any evidence?
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 19:59
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@ ianwood:

Totally agree and you might add the total lack of any sign of the plane in the South China Sea, in whatever form, really only re-enforces that. Given the relatively shallow depth and the sheer number of SAR assets looking, that seems an incredibly slim shot at this point. It's somewhere else.
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 20:00
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Seems several people are having a hard time accepting the satellite pings and the associated theory that this plane is no where near the point of last contact............Granted none of this has been corroborated in full yet
That's the problem ian.., once/if this is corroborated then hopefully we will get somewhere near closure and a sensible debate can hopefully take place, but at the moment IMHO apart from the extreme cases (alien abduction, rescue mission for Elvis) I reckon everyone has a valid scenario if that scenario is a technical possibility ...
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 20:01
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If highjack, there is always the possibility that those responsible believed it could be flown farther than the fuel actually allowed. In such a situation it may have crashed short of the hijackers' destination.

TME
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 20:01
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Pitot Static on the 777 are fed to ADM (3 for pitot and 3 for static) the ADMs feeds 3 separate arinc 629 bus.The 629 bus feeds the ADRIU, SAARU( for standby instruments) and the ACMF cards in the AIMs cabinet. The ACMS collects all data engine data ,air data, navigation data etc. The ACMF send this to the transponder , FDR , EADI, EICAS etc.
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 20:01
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Originally Posted by captainjim47
If one of those US destroyers in the area is ASW equipped they should run their towed array sonar along 060 to 075 from LKP. The idea it was still in the air for 4 hrs lacks any published data... same as the "military radar" theory. Lets see some data.
Don't think the water depth fits your idea there.*l am not convinced that is a fruitful area for search, but who knows?
*Since my last ASW mission was a few years ago, I may have missed some developments in shallow water uses of various towed arrays.

As to the report from the oil rig ... not sure what to make of that. Not as confident as yourself regarding its fit to the missing aircraft.

Last edited by Lonewolf_50; 14th Mar 2014 at 20:13.
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 20:01
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Pings

Thanks garage. I'll try to find it.
The reason for asking is that if the identity being pinged relates to the engine numbers (say for onward data transmission to Rolls Royce), rather than the airframe number, it would still be be necessary for Inmarsat to link those engines to the plane. As many know, airlines frequently swap engines around.
However, I'm guessing they thought of that or, more likely, that the pings are identifying the airframe itself.
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 20:02
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I don't understand

We are officially 1 week into one of the most mysterious and devastating aviation disasters ever

Along the trail the scope of the investigation included
- most recent plane inspection
- Planes equipment activity during the flight
- the stolen passports and the background of those individuals
- backgrounds and possible terror connections of all other passengers
- apparently the US is also just finding out about the cargo (CNN is reporting an official indicating Lithium batteries in cargo and the possibilities they could have caused a fire - although the official apparently went out of his way to say that wouldn't explain all the other known aspects)

That is the Plane itself, its Cargo and its Passengers - apparently no one questions people looking into all those aspects in this Search And Rescue situation. So then why is it a few here seem adamantly determined to squash anyone saying the Crew should not be excluded from this checklist of things that must be looked at?

I don't want the Crew to be involved either, but to act as though they should never be quested under any circumstances, and that doing so in any way is just some "wild conjecture" that has no place ever being considered ...well, it's just way beyond illogical.

More and more evidence and confirmation is (finally) coming in in this disappearance, and most of this evidence indicates a human was likely behind both the plane going dark and the planes flightpath after that darkness. All aspects are being investigated in hopes they lead to any possible clues as to what happened and where the plane might be... except, apparently, one group - the last known people to control the plane. How does that make sense?
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 20:04
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Originally Posted by olasek
There is zero evidence of aircraft landing anywhere.
There is SOME evidence it flew west.
If you want to limit yourself to a 'conclusive' evidence - stop reading this forum. The only conclusive evidence is that aircraft disappeared.
You don't get my point.
I have nothing against speculations and rumours themselves. I had myself defended speculation some posts ago within this thread as a vital part of any investigation, as long as no solid evidence is found. I only refuse to call such hearsay and unverified reports as the "known flight path" of MAS370.

Maybe "known" to someone who has real information he did not bother to release so far. Not to me and you.

Anyway, I just wanted to point out.
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Old 14th Mar 2014, 20:04
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@ianwood

Too right and follows the points I was alluding to some posts back.

The large SAR operation to the West of Malaysia would not be happening unless corroborated by other intel, ie the SATCOMM tracking and other.
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