Airport Security (Merged) - Effects on Crew/Staff
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A quick question for fellow commuters - what is happening at Lhr with your baggage - you used to take it to the gates when on standby and in the case of Aer Lingus you have to go to the gate to check in!!!, can you still take all your baggage with you through security?
I suppose it's all changed again!!!!
I suppose it's all changed again!!!!
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Services eastward bound over the Pond from my outfit now have a selection of pens and other writing materials in a pouch left on the flight deck, by forward thinking Canucks rather than operational policy !
In-bound, I lost my beloved Bic, to an over-jealous screener, and as Roy Hudd says, the envy seems to be present in spades, allowing for the behaviour to be exacerbated.
At least here in Canada, we are exempt from the farce...for now. Understand, CATSA are looking at it, as we speak
Suggest somehow pens from amenity kits if available etc. are placed in the flightdeck until the curtain comes down on this nonsense...
In the end, it's not sustainable for crews nor passengers, and as many have said here, the Israeli intelligence led approach is the only way.....sooner the better...
In-bound, I lost my beloved Bic, to an over-jealous screener, and as Roy Hudd says, the envy seems to be present in spades, allowing for the behaviour to be exacerbated.
At least here in Canada, we are exempt from the farce...for now. Understand, CATSA are looking at it, as we speak
Suggest somehow pens from amenity kits if available etc. are placed in the flightdeck until the curtain comes down on this nonsense...
In the end, it's not sustainable for crews nor passengers, and as many have said here, the Israeli intelligence led approach is the only way.....sooner the better...
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I operated out of LGW North yesterday, Jubilee House. I have to say as a visiting pilot with non BAA ID I was pleasantly surprised at security.
Yes I was allowed to carry flight bag, pens, keys with electric fob, etc totally unhindered apart from normal x-ray. Shoes were x-rayed, and I was frisked, but all in efficient and friendly manner.
Company colleague operating a long haul to SFB popped from crew room to staff security point to enquire if he could carry his lap top and was advised that he could.
Seems there are differing standards around, but having prepared for a possible epic at LGW, I endured nothing like it
30W
Yes I was allowed to carry flight bag, pens, keys with electric fob, etc totally unhindered apart from normal x-ray. Shoes were x-rayed, and I was frisked, but all in efficient and friendly manner.
Company colleague operating a long haul to SFB popped from crew room to staff security point to enquire if he could carry his lap top and was advised that he could.
Seems there are differing standards around, but having prepared for a possible epic at LGW, I endured nothing like it
30W
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Good to hear 30W...seems the different standards apply to each individual security screener, rather than by location..inconsistency being the watchword.
Very interesting..
Very interesting..
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BALPA Letter
Originally Posted by LD Max
Here are your main BALPA contacts. I suggest we all get on to it: I think we all know what needs to be said!
In the BALPA Security Briefing (http://www.balpa.org/intranet/BALPA%20Security%20Briefing%2010%20August%202006.htm) our Chairman stated:
"If there any are issues or anomalies that you feel we should be addressing or that have been overlooked, please do let us know as all the agencies involved in this are liaising closely and are keen to make this work as well as we can in the circumstances."
Accordingly, I am writing to submit my comments.
Does BALPA have ANY IDEA of the concern being expressed by British Pilots over this fiasco? There is serious talk of pilots turning on their heels and walking back to their crew rooms when faced with such draconian measures that prevent them even taking a PEN onboard!
I would refer you to a thread which is running on the Professional Pilot's Rumour Network (PPRuNe). I'll start you off on page 10, as the situation has escalated since the earlier posts. We're now up to page 20. To save you the time of sifting through all of it, some pertinent extracts follow below. Edited out for brevity. While it may be a bit time consuming, I would kindly urge you to read them.
These comments express views supported by me and many others. While some of the "opinions" on specific security procedures may be "uninformed", there is an undercurrent of unrest and a belief that BALPA is not representing it's members interests in this crisis. There is a feeling by many that industrial action may be called for.
In summary, we feel that the procedure outlined in the Chairman's statement is not being followed and there are major inconsistencies between procedures at different airports - all (apparently) run by BAA. In particular, Flight Crew are generally not being screened separately from PAX and there seems to be no effort in setting up such screening procedures. Hand-searches of crew items are not being performed in many cases, and petty confiscations, (such as pens, tea bags and toffee crisps), extending to PDAs, Electronic Flight Bags and Mobile Phones are beginning to obstruct the crew in their duties, elevate stress and fatigue and destroy any sense of cooperation between crew and security services. The security procedures are so draconian, that not only can crew members not bring personal refreshments on board, but the short turnarounds prevent crews from obtaining any personal refreshments throughout the course of their duty periods.
Of less immediate concern, (but an issue nevertheless), is that blanket banning of hand luggage for passengers will, if not revised, damage the industry and jeopardise jobs. This would not take long, and there is much speculation that there must be a better way. With the insurance situation often not covering valuable electronic items in the hold, passengers and crew are now often faced with Hobson's Choice. Indeed many laptops and PDAs contain such sensitive information that they are not permitted to be let out of their owners sight by virtue of the Data Protection Act. Many passengers will opt to take the boat or the train for destinations in reach. Corporate customers may well resort to tele-conferencing as an alternative. These are all serious threats to our industry, (especially on the more profitable business sectors), and must be addressed in short order.
There is considerable alarm that these measures may not be temporary - and there will be some pressure to make them a permanent feature. The Aviation Security Commission (TRANSEC) is charged with the responsibility for these decisions and we believe this must NOT be allowed to happen. BALPA does have representation on TRANSEC. It is time this unholy mess was sorted.
Yours sincerely,
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=238656&page=10
"If there any are issues or anomalies that you feel we should be addressing or that have been overlooked, please do let us know as all the agencies involved in this are liaising closely and are keen to make this work as well as we can in the circumstances."
Accordingly, I am writing to submit my comments.
Does BALPA have ANY IDEA of the concern being expressed by British Pilots over this fiasco? There is serious talk of pilots turning on their heels and walking back to their crew rooms when faced with such draconian measures that prevent them even taking a PEN onboard!
I would refer you to a thread which is running on the Professional Pilot's Rumour Network (PPRuNe). I'll start you off on page 10, as the situation has escalated since the earlier posts. We're now up to page 20. To save you the time of sifting through all of it, some pertinent extracts follow below. Edited out for brevity. While it may be a bit time consuming, I would kindly urge you to read them.
These comments express views supported by me and many others. While some of the "opinions" on specific security procedures may be "uninformed", there is an undercurrent of unrest and a belief that BALPA is not representing it's members interests in this crisis. There is a feeling by many that industrial action may be called for.
In summary, we feel that the procedure outlined in the Chairman's statement is not being followed and there are major inconsistencies between procedures at different airports - all (apparently) run by BAA. In particular, Flight Crew are generally not being screened separately from PAX and there seems to be no effort in setting up such screening procedures. Hand-searches of crew items are not being performed in many cases, and petty confiscations, (such as pens, tea bags and toffee crisps), extending to PDAs, Electronic Flight Bags and Mobile Phones are beginning to obstruct the crew in their duties, elevate stress and fatigue and destroy any sense of cooperation between crew and security services. The security procedures are so draconian, that not only can crew members not bring personal refreshments on board, but the short turnarounds prevent crews from obtaining any personal refreshments throughout the course of their duty periods.
Of less immediate concern, (but an issue nevertheless), is that blanket banning of hand luggage for passengers will, if not revised, damage the industry and jeopardise jobs. This would not take long, and there is much speculation that there must be a better way. With the insurance situation often not covering valuable electronic items in the hold, passengers and crew are now often faced with Hobson's Choice. Indeed many laptops and PDAs contain such sensitive information that they are not permitted to be let out of their owners sight by virtue of the Data Protection Act. Many passengers will opt to take the boat or the train for destinations in reach. Corporate customers may well resort to tele-conferencing as an alternative. These are all serious threats to our industry, (especially on the more profitable business sectors), and must be addressed in short order.
There is considerable alarm that these measures may not be temporary - and there will be some pressure to make them a permanent feature. The Aviation Security Commission (TRANSEC) is charged with the responsibility for these decisions and we believe this must NOT be allowed to happen. BALPA does have representation on TRANSEC. It is time this unholy mess was sorted.
Yours sincerely,
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=238656&page=10
LD Max
totally agree with your sentiments too. but Balpa have only a token representation on the commitee, and are not included in the TRANSEC or NASP decisions, they can make recommendations to the board and advise of potential impact connotations. These are mearly guidelines, and then the relelvant Airport Security Manager has a decision to make on these "recommendations" or "guidelines".
Islandhopper, no you can't check in at the gates, and no you can't take any baggage through security. At times over this weekend, if you didn't actually have a ticket or proof of purchase etc, you weren't even allowed into the terminal.
The next 24hrs are going to be intersting, as many stupid ideas about revamping and ammending LHR security are being banded about. Some ideas are worth exploring, some are laughable. I just enjoyed chatting to people BAA employed on the terminal doors, great job but not alot of clue about what was going on inside the terminals. They kept our pax outside for hours, in the rain and only when I told Ops and Apron that I would be waiting for everyone, did they actually get their fingers out and find my pax in the melee outside.
My VP flight ops flew yesterday, unfortunately I cannot print his comments about his experience as a passenger, safe to say he if had a choice LHR and BAA would be last on his list.
totally agree with your sentiments too. but Balpa have only a token representation on the commitee, and are not included in the TRANSEC or NASP decisions, they can make recommendations to the board and advise of potential impact connotations. These are mearly guidelines, and then the relelvant Airport Security Manager has a decision to make on these "recommendations" or "guidelines".
Islandhopper, no you can't check in at the gates, and no you can't take any baggage through security. At times over this weekend, if you didn't actually have a ticket or proof of purchase etc, you weren't even allowed into the terminal.
The next 24hrs are going to be intersting, as many stupid ideas about revamping and ammending LHR security are being banded about. Some ideas are worth exploring, some are laughable. I just enjoyed chatting to people BAA employed on the terminal doors, great job but not alot of clue about what was going on inside the terminals. They kept our pax outside for hours, in the rain and only when I told Ops and Apron that I would be waiting for everyone, did they actually get their fingers out and find my pax in the melee outside.
My VP flight ops flew yesterday, unfortunately I cannot print his comments about his experience as a passenger, safe to say he if had a choice LHR and BAA would be last on his list.
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Originally Posted by Stall Horn
Thanks LD. Letter sent as follows: (Copied here if anyone else wants to use it as a template).
CD
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I was issued with a notice at crew check-in listing the different requirements for both LGW and LHR about what can and can't be carried with flight crew to the aircraft. For LGW the list said NO pens. You could carry a laptop if it was essential for your job as a crew member. Of course those that elected to take their laptops, if questioned about them only had to say that they were required even if they weren't. It shows how absurd the rules are.
I have no doubt that some airlines have not distributed lists to their crews about what can and can't be carried and subsequently many have carried through pens, wittingly or unwittingly. As I operate to the USA, there are even more different interpretations on the rules. Perhaps only USA bound crews cannot carry pens? The point is that there are different directives in force, most likely individual interpretations of the recommendations from the DfT TranSec.
If there are different interpretations then it means that these people are throttling our industry and endangering our economy which in turn endangers our jobs. There is no way I am advocating any sort of industrial action. I am not so stupid as to realise that to damage my employers business when it is not their fault is not the way to go.
As pilots, we are doing our best to get our passengers away to their destinations. We are going that extra mile already by being as flexible as possible to try and minimise the disruption. Our schedules are shot to pieces and crew duty times are being stretched well into discretion. We are responsible adults with a duty of care but we are expected to be subjected to ill thought through security rules that do absolutely nothing whatsoever to protect ourselves and our pax.
The security screeners are just doing their jobs. They are instructed from on above by their managers who receive their instructions from further up the idiocy chain. Somewhere along the line common sense and logic have been thrown away and we have the farce that is such a hot topic for discussion. Even worse, we now have doubts about any successful prosecution should it ever get to court because of statements and soundbites made by ministers and police. The media released identities because the Chancellor authorised the Bank of England to list those whose assets have been released and other politicians leaked the info in some sick attempt to curry favour with their favourite journalists. By making statements such as "prevented mass murder on an unimaginable scale", they have possibly prejudiced the case according to the Attorney General.
So, now we have a throttling of our industry by mandarins reacting in typical knee-jerk mode with edicts and rules that are being interpreted differently at different airports which only serve to do the terrorists jobs for them. I wish there was an easy answer but unfortunately we will be told that we do not have the big picture and that excuse will be used to cover up the ineptitude and poor decision making behind this fiasco.
Of course, none of this is helped by the media hysteria that is kicked up. Already we see people on here posting 'facts' that are not verified or distorted. For example, one of the suspects arrested is quoted to have been employed at LHR as a "security guard". Immediately muppets will assume that a 'security guard' in some way controls the security we are discussing here. Well, if you are trying to associate a 'security guard' with a 'security screener' then you need your head examining. We all know that many 'security guards' are employed by private security companies on minimum wages and with only the most basic of training and their jobs are to keep an eye out and check passes. The screeners are definitely not 'security guards' and their job is only screening pax and crew.
So, let's not fall into the media hysteria trap. We have enough problems just trying to do our jobs at the moment. Yesterday I decided to put my crew bag into my suitcase and carried only my passport, licence and a spare pair of glasses. That was it. I must say that the strain on my back having to lug cases and bags was much relieved but I did feel a bit like a lemon waiting for the cabin crew to pilfer some pens from the pax amenity kits. We need to be putting pressure on our professional associations to use their lobbying powers to get the necessary changes and lifting of ill thought through, knee-jerk rules that have no consistency or logic. We need them to start getting back the trust that we deserve. We are professionals and work very hard to get where we are today and we don't need Muppets doing the terrorists jobs for them which puts our jobs on the line.
I have no doubt that some airlines have not distributed lists to their crews about what can and can't be carried and subsequently many have carried through pens, wittingly or unwittingly. As I operate to the USA, there are even more different interpretations on the rules. Perhaps only USA bound crews cannot carry pens? The point is that there are different directives in force, most likely individual interpretations of the recommendations from the DfT TranSec.
If there are different interpretations then it means that these people are throttling our industry and endangering our economy which in turn endangers our jobs. There is no way I am advocating any sort of industrial action. I am not so stupid as to realise that to damage my employers business when it is not their fault is not the way to go.
As pilots, we are doing our best to get our passengers away to their destinations. We are going that extra mile already by being as flexible as possible to try and minimise the disruption. Our schedules are shot to pieces and crew duty times are being stretched well into discretion. We are responsible adults with a duty of care but we are expected to be subjected to ill thought through security rules that do absolutely nothing whatsoever to protect ourselves and our pax.
The security screeners are just doing their jobs. They are instructed from on above by their managers who receive their instructions from further up the idiocy chain. Somewhere along the line common sense and logic have been thrown away and we have the farce that is such a hot topic for discussion. Even worse, we now have doubts about any successful prosecution should it ever get to court because of statements and soundbites made by ministers and police. The media released identities because the Chancellor authorised the Bank of England to list those whose assets have been released and other politicians leaked the info in some sick attempt to curry favour with their favourite journalists. By making statements such as "prevented mass murder on an unimaginable scale", they have possibly prejudiced the case according to the Attorney General.
So, now we have a throttling of our industry by mandarins reacting in typical knee-jerk mode with edicts and rules that are being interpreted differently at different airports which only serve to do the terrorists jobs for them. I wish there was an easy answer but unfortunately we will be told that we do not have the big picture and that excuse will be used to cover up the ineptitude and poor decision making behind this fiasco.
Of course, none of this is helped by the media hysteria that is kicked up. Already we see people on here posting 'facts' that are not verified or distorted. For example, one of the suspects arrested is quoted to have been employed at LHR as a "security guard". Immediately muppets will assume that a 'security guard' in some way controls the security we are discussing here. Well, if you are trying to associate a 'security guard' with a 'security screener' then you need your head examining. We all know that many 'security guards' are employed by private security companies on minimum wages and with only the most basic of training and their jobs are to keep an eye out and check passes. The screeners are definitely not 'security guards' and their job is only screening pax and crew.
So, let's not fall into the media hysteria trap. We have enough problems just trying to do our jobs at the moment. Yesterday I decided to put my crew bag into my suitcase and carried only my passport, licence and a spare pair of glasses. That was it. I must say that the strain on my back having to lug cases and bags was much relieved but I did feel a bit like a lemon waiting for the cabin crew to pilfer some pens from the pax amenity kits. We need to be putting pressure on our professional associations to use their lobbying powers to get the necessary changes and lifting of ill thought through, knee-jerk rules that have no consistency or logic. We need them to start getting back the trust that we deserve. We are professionals and work very hard to get where we are today and we don't need Muppets doing the terrorists jobs for them which puts our jobs on the line.
For LGW the list said NO pens.
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Here is a question:
If after a security check we are being let airside to do the job, then how come we are being allowed to carry only certain items???
In other words; if we are deemed to be safe enough to be let through then surely we are safe enough to be let through with anything we deem necessary to take through with us. These things being pens, food, computers.... you name it!
I don't understand the logic - help!
If after a security check we are being let airside to do the job, then how come we are being allowed to carry only certain items???
In other words; if we are deemed to be safe enough to be let through then surely we are safe enough to be let through with anything we deem necessary to take through with us. These things being pens, food, computers.... you name it!
I don't understand the logic - help!
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Danny,
Our crew room at LGW also has a big list in clear view for everyone to read. The list does NOT include pens. My flight case probably had about 6 in it, and one in my shirt pocket as I went through security. All colleagues similar story, as well as the laptop, which was not required for work use. No problems with mobile phones for crew members either - I carried my own plus company phone, all crew carried their own through.......
Perhaps standards differ between terminals even? We were using the security facilities supplied by BA at Jubilee House. It is not manned by BAA security, but by a contractor to BA. I really can't fault either their practicality, or their attitude. Yes we were all properly hand searched, shoes x-rayed etc, so dft standards are being maintained, but in a practical way to those working airside.
Haven't used any other UK airport yet so can't comment. One thought though, perhaps I could take through stacks of pens at LGW North, then flog em to you all coming through the south 'penless'......
30W
Our crew room at LGW also has a big list in clear view for everyone to read. The list does NOT include pens. My flight case probably had about 6 in it, and one in my shirt pocket as I went through security. All colleagues similar story, as well as the laptop, which was not required for work use. No problems with mobile phones for crew members either - I carried my own plus company phone, all crew carried their own through.......
Perhaps standards differ between terminals even? We were using the security facilities supplied by BA at Jubilee House. It is not manned by BAA security, but by a contractor to BA. I really can't fault either their practicality, or their attitude. Yes we were all properly hand searched, shoes x-rayed etc, so dft standards are being maintained, but in a practical way to those working airside.
Haven't used any other UK airport yet so can't comment. One thought though, perhaps I could take through stacks of pens at LGW North, then flog em to you all coming through the south 'penless'......
30W
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Originally Posted by Dualbleed
You can bring all you want on to the aircraft. What I did today at LGW was to check my overnight bag with a crewtag on it, then just wait for it to arrive at the aircraft and then bring it to the cabin. As a captain you decide where tha cargo goes. !!
Why all the handwringing when it's very simple to bypass this temporary measure?
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Originally Posted by Danny
If there are different interpretations then it means that these people are throttling our industry and endangering our economy which in turn endangers our jobs. There is no way I am advocating any sort of industrial action. I am not so stupid as to realise that to damage my employers business when it is not their fault is not the way to go.
I'd support a majority who wanted to do so and would back any union action to the hilt.
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Just goes to show the differences in interpretation of the rules at different security checkpoints at the same airport. We go through the BAA crew security Southside at Concorde House. Pens allowed Northside but we are not to be trusted with them Southside. Absolute farce and proof, if ever it was needed, that those that apply the interpretation to the rules are doing their best to aid the terrorists by screwing up our jobs and the travel plans of our pax.
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I think perhaps there needs to be more pressure bought to bear on Big Balpa, with the corresponding threat of disruption.
Most of the concorde security staff are muppets..in my experience...
The present situation is serious, no one is disputing that, however, the measures that have been put in place have been applied with little thought other than being reactionary. For crews, these kind of measures make our jobs very very difficult to do.
I wonder when the press will pickup on this??
We go through the BAA crew security Southside at Concorde House.
The present situation is serious, no one is disputing that, however, the measures that have been put in place have been applied with little thought other than being reactionary. For crews, these kind of measures make our jobs very very difficult to do.
I wonder when the press will pickup on this??
then just wait for it to arrive at the aircraft and then bring it to the cabin. As a captain you decide where the cargo goes. !!
Companies, and mine is one, that do not have systems in place to check in crew baggage need to get one sorted quickly so that this farce of having to go away without de-odorant, toothpaste etc. is ended ASAP. Quite what I will do when I next need to stay away I have not decided yet but I don't think it's going to involve leaving home base without the means to perform such basic tasks as brushing my teeth and washing my hair.
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You are a passenger on a 767, seated at the overwing exit. The last 30 minutes have seemed like eternity as you witnessed brutal treatment of cabin crew and other passengers. The aircraft is flying low over New York, the sun shines brightly on the cloudless day but you see no beauty. It’s very noisy with some people crying and others shouting the engines too are making more noise than usual.
Suddenly you hear a sickening noise; your mind slows down the action to help you see clearly the enormity of the situation you now find yourself in. You can see the cabin in front of you collapsing towards you. You hear another noise, it is the sound of your bones breaking as your legs crash hard against the seat in front, you feel no pain. You are powerless to stop your head hitting the mass before you, as your brain sloshes and pulps inside your skull your life ends, it would have anyway as the man who sat behind you now is forced against the back of your seat, the pressure breaking your ribs and your sides split open and soon there remains nothing identifiable.
Your journey is over, three rows behind a woman and her child hear the noise of their own bones breaking yet they feel no pain….
If that has no effect then lets refresh our short memories;
In 1991 I sat up late one night as I watched cruise missiles land in Iraq, 1 month later the parent company of the profitable airline I worked for predicted losses and at the end of that charter season the airline was closed. Many others closed too. There was a recovery of the industry until things were quite good really then came the day we call 9/11. Respectfully disregarding the obvious suffering of those involved, the decline in the industry was devastating, all the major airlines suffered losses, maybe myth but I read that the losses combined were greater than the profits made since flying began nearly one hundred years before. Aircraft orders were cancelled, crews and support staff in airlines and ancillary sectors were laid off, salaries and pensions all suffered.
For reasons which are many and varied this industry finds itself a target for a group or groups of people who will stop at nothing to create a spectacular demonstration of their power to disrupt our lives. They also have no problem, wrongly or rightly, of justifying that act on Western behaviour towards them.
When Isay stop at nothing, that is exactly what I mean. How any professional pilot can assume that every other pilot thinks like them and has no sympathy with these criminal aims is beyond reason. No pilot has as yet been linked to radical extremism but that is just historical. The fact is that these groups are well funded and their members are intelligent, dedicated (beyond Western definitions of the word) individuals who would likely find no problem completing an approved course in flying training. Had these people begun training following 9/11, they could well be approaching commands of regional jets or joined the large numbers leaving the regionals for flag carriers and other majors. Pilots and aircrew should expect no special treatment other than the ability to fast track a queue.
The security services this week have done their job to the best of their ability and time will tell how successful they have been and continue to be. The threat level has been taken to its highest ever level and procedures put in place that some consider unreasonable, well unfortunately that is what happens when people, even professionals, are given an unfamiliar environment (you may know that if you have ever been asked to explain your reasoning during a loft ex). Very soon security professionals will create a workable and effective control, they quite simply have to. In the meantime we should be and are working with the shop floor security searchers as an example to passengers and a deterrent to would be criminals. Whilst we argue over pens the only truth is that the industry simply cannot afford another 9/11 or 7/7 and neither are we privy to all the facts or intelligence.
JP
Suddenly you hear a sickening noise; your mind slows down the action to help you see clearly the enormity of the situation you now find yourself in. You can see the cabin in front of you collapsing towards you. You hear another noise, it is the sound of your bones breaking as your legs crash hard against the seat in front, you feel no pain. You are powerless to stop your head hitting the mass before you, as your brain sloshes and pulps inside your skull your life ends, it would have anyway as the man who sat behind you now is forced against the back of your seat, the pressure breaking your ribs and your sides split open and soon there remains nothing identifiable.
Your journey is over, three rows behind a woman and her child hear the noise of their own bones breaking yet they feel no pain….
If that has no effect then lets refresh our short memories;
In 1991 I sat up late one night as I watched cruise missiles land in Iraq, 1 month later the parent company of the profitable airline I worked for predicted losses and at the end of that charter season the airline was closed. Many others closed too. There was a recovery of the industry until things were quite good really then came the day we call 9/11. Respectfully disregarding the obvious suffering of those involved, the decline in the industry was devastating, all the major airlines suffered losses, maybe myth but I read that the losses combined were greater than the profits made since flying began nearly one hundred years before. Aircraft orders were cancelled, crews and support staff in airlines and ancillary sectors were laid off, salaries and pensions all suffered.
For reasons which are many and varied this industry finds itself a target for a group or groups of people who will stop at nothing to create a spectacular demonstration of their power to disrupt our lives. They also have no problem, wrongly or rightly, of justifying that act on Western behaviour towards them.
When Isay stop at nothing, that is exactly what I mean. How any professional pilot can assume that every other pilot thinks like them and has no sympathy with these criminal aims is beyond reason. No pilot has as yet been linked to radical extremism but that is just historical. The fact is that these groups are well funded and their members are intelligent, dedicated (beyond Western definitions of the word) individuals who would likely find no problem completing an approved course in flying training. Had these people begun training following 9/11, they could well be approaching commands of regional jets or joined the large numbers leaving the regionals for flag carriers and other majors. Pilots and aircrew should expect no special treatment other than the ability to fast track a queue.
The security services this week have done their job to the best of their ability and time will tell how successful they have been and continue to be. The threat level has been taken to its highest ever level and procedures put in place that some consider unreasonable, well unfortunately that is what happens when people, even professionals, are given an unfamiliar environment (you may know that if you have ever been asked to explain your reasoning during a loft ex). Very soon security professionals will create a workable and effective control, they quite simply have to. In the meantime we should be and are working with the shop floor security searchers as an example to passengers and a deterrent to would be criminals. Whilst we argue over pens the only truth is that the industry simply cannot afford another 9/11 or 7/7 and neither are we privy to all the facts or intelligence.
JP
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just to add to the sense of bemusement can anyone explain the logic behind this;
I'm an ATCO ,tower is airside,i don't have physical access to aircraft, on turning up for work i have to proceed through security.Staff are now not allowed to take any liquid airside. I'll say that again, we can not take a drink to work.there is only water from a cooler in the tower.Great, an eight hour shift with only water.Hopefully sense can soon prevail or maybe security personnel might like to watch whilst we control just to ensure we aren't planning anything?
I'm an ATCO ,tower is airside,i don't have physical access to aircraft, on turning up for work i have to proceed through security.Staff are now not allowed to take any liquid airside. I'll say that again, we can not take a drink to work.there is only water from a cooler in the tower.Great, an eight hour shift with only water.Hopefully sense can soon prevail or maybe security personnel might like to watch whilst we control just to ensure we aren't planning anything?
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Originally Posted by juan post
Pilots and aircrew should expect no special treatment other than the ability to fast track a queue
All the pilot needs to commit an act is his finger on the A/P Disc switch - no amount of searching or restrictive security measures would stop that happening.
Meanwhile, the rest of us, be it aircrew, ATCO's or engineers are being prevented from doing our jobs effectively by a DfT remit more intent on being seen to be doing something rather than achieving anything sensible.
The lunacy needs to stop now, and the professional associations (BALPA, GATCO etc) need to address this before the industry suffers anymore damage - more than any terrorist could ever wish to achieve.