Bell 206: JetRanger and LongRanger
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Norfolk
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We used flat steel plates, 10 pounds each with loops welded onto them to pass the harness through. Problem is much greater if the range extender is fitted when the minimum front seat weight goes up substantially. 200 lb rings a bell.
I believe the americans always had an issue with Agusta parts.
I remember about 15 years ago a Bell built 206 was refused a US c of a until the Agusta made main rotor blades were replaced.
EASA really haven't much of a clue, years of actual experience has been thrown out of the window by the Clowns of Cologne.
I remember about 15 years ago a Bell built 206 was refused a US c of a until the Agusta made main rotor blades were replaced.
EASA really haven't much of a clue, years of actual experience has been thrown out of the window by the Clowns of Cologne.
Beeping the 206
I've really only got 150 on the B111 and was wondering does everyone use the beep switch when flying? I ask because the instructor I had during my endorsement told me not to mess with it. I ignored this and use it to beep down on approach and beep up again before I pull power to finish the approach.What do you experienced Jet Ranger pilots do?
I just want to get this right!.
Cheers
I just want to get this right!.
Cheers
Heliringer,
Why would you want to adjust the rrpm in the manner that you've outlined? Surely in the event of an engine failure on approach, you would want more rrpm rather than less? (ie beep it up rather than down?) As you pull power at the end of the approach, beeping the rrpm up would tend towards a torque peak, no? (Something else that you might want to avoid!)
I'm guessing that most of your previous experience is with pistons. Treat the rrpm beep like the throttle. In a SEP, would you wind the throttle/rrpm down slightly on a approach then wind it open on approach? I certainly wouldn't. (And, no, I'm not referring to any throttle movement that might be needed to keep the rrpm in the green band whilst lowering or raising the lever).
The only time that I can see that you might want to beep the rrpm down to the lower end of the green band would be to save a little bit of fuel in the cruise. But, in the event of an engine failure, you are also robbing yourself of a few percent of rrpm which might turn out to be critical.
So, like your instructor said, set it to 100% rrpm and leave it well alone!
PS. I've only got a few hundred, rather than thousands, of hours in the Jetbanger but all of the above makes sense to me. I, of course, stand to be corrected.
PPS What's a 'B111'?
Why would you want to adjust the rrpm in the manner that you've outlined? Surely in the event of an engine failure on approach, you would want more rrpm rather than less? (ie beep it up rather than down?) As you pull power at the end of the approach, beeping the rrpm up would tend towards a torque peak, no? (Something else that you might want to avoid!)
I'm guessing that most of your previous experience is with pistons. Treat the rrpm beep like the throttle. In a SEP, would you wind the throttle/rrpm down slightly on a approach then wind it open on approach? I certainly wouldn't. (And, no, I'm not referring to any throttle movement that might be needed to keep the rrpm in the green band whilst lowering or raising the lever).
The only time that I can see that you might want to beep the rrpm down to the lower end of the green band would be to save a little bit of fuel in the cruise. But, in the event of an engine failure, you are also robbing yourself of a few percent of rrpm which might turn out to be critical.
So, like your instructor said, set it to 100% rrpm and leave it well alone!
PS. I've only got a few hundred, rather than thousands, of hours in the Jetbanger but all of the above makes sense to me. I, of course, stand to be corrected.
PPS What's a 'B111'?
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Set 100 % before lift and leave it alone. As above ,if you really need to stretch the range, beepdown in the cruise but the difference is marginal. If the rrpm has altered when you reach the cruise condition after setting 100% on the ground, tell the engineer as this can be adjusted.
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maybe heliringer is talking about beeping down on approach to control the transient overspeeds that are normal on the 206 when you lower the collective...if so heliringer, you have to remember that you have up to 15 seconds of overspeed (depending on your tq/n2) which is a pretty long time. it also doesn't take much of a collective pull to get it back in the green.
using the beeper excessively will risk burning out the linear actuator.
using the beeper excessively will risk burning out the linear actuator.
Yeah I only beep it down to avoid an overspeed. The other day I left it alone and it was getting a bit high so that is why I asked this question. mmm we've just installed a new Linear actuator to it, Hope is wasnt me that killed it
Bravo Are saying lower the lever to avoid an overspeed! The situation is as I lower the collective the rrpm increases so I beep it down to control it. If i was to lower the lever more as you sugest the overspeed would increase. You mean raise the collective slightly dont you?
I was flying today and just kept it 100% all the time, on decent the rrpm rose but not for long enough to worry about, I suppose I am just getting used to the machine.
OH yeah B111 was my way of saying B3
Thanks for the replies.
Bye for now.
I was flying today and just kept it 100% all the time, on decent the rrpm rose but not for long enough to worry about, I suppose I am just getting used to the machine.
OH yeah B111 was my way of saying B3
Thanks for the replies.
Bye for now.
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Heliringer
IMHO it really depends on the fuel system on the B206.
If it has a Bendix it will generally maintain Nr fairly well unless very large collective changes are made. Usually not much adjustment with the beep switch is required.
If a Ceco is fitted then they are generally not as responsive as the Bendix system.
In this case I usually beep down when lowering the collective for a descent and beep up again as I re-introduce power to terminate in the hover. This will also depend on Aircraft weight and the DA at the time.
Not much different from a lot of 212s I have flown really.
'Lowering the lever should have a slightly more positive effect than the beep.'
B73
Can you clarify what you mean here?
Obviously when the collective is lowered RPM tends to increase and vice versa but that is why it sometimes needs beeped down or up??
Cheers
IMHO it really depends on the fuel system on the B206.
If it has a Bendix it will generally maintain Nr fairly well unless very large collective changes are made. Usually not much adjustment with the beep switch is required.
If a Ceco is fitted then they are generally not as responsive as the Bendix system.
In this case I usually beep down when lowering the collective for a descent and beep up again as I re-introduce power to terminate in the hover. This will also depend on Aircraft weight and the DA at the time.
Not much different from a lot of 212s I have flown really.
'Lowering the lever should have a slightly more positive effect than the beep.'
B73
Can you clarify what you mean here?
Obviously when the collective is lowered RPM tends to increase and vice versa but that is why it sometimes needs beeped down or up??
Cheers
Other than to adjust a slight Nr variation, I don't touch the beep trim from one month to the next! I have, however, used a low Nr IAW Bell criteria to reduce noise footprint when getting a helipad approved, during noise tests. From memory, a 97%Nr approach cuts the EpndB by about 2-3dB.
I'm sure that someone here knows that he meant BIII, not B111
I'm sure that someone here knows that he meant BIII, not B111
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Daleville, AL
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206B Hydraulic STC
I fly both the TH-67A/A+ (206B3) and the OH-58C on a regular basis. The hydraulic systems are a bit different. For instance, the OH-58 has a T-valve to help with pressure differentials and there is filtration on both the pressure and return sides. The TH-67 does not have SCAS. Only the instrument version has force trim. 
I have noticed several NTSB reports over the past decade where the cause was undetermined, yet part of the accident sequence included a sharp, uncommanded roll to either the left or right. Some of these have resulted in fatalities. They appear to have occurred in all modes of flight from flat pitch, hover, slow flight, to cruise. Has anyone experienced one of these episodes, or have detailed knowledge of one occurring? I am curious, even if it did not result in an accident. I have not heard of any incidents like this with the OH-58A/C models.
On that note, does anyone have knowledge of an STC that would slightly modify the 206B3 hydraulics to make them more like the OH-58. This is a serious inquiry that may help save one of us one day.
Saber 09
I have noticed several NTSB reports over the past decade where the cause was undetermined, yet part of the accident sequence included a sharp, uncommanded roll to either the left or right. Some of these have resulted in fatalities. They appear to have occurred in all modes of flight from flat pitch, hover, slow flight, to cruise. Has anyone experienced one of these episodes, or have detailed knowledge of one occurring? I am curious, even if it did not result in an accident. I have not heard of any incidents like this with the OH-58A/C models.
On that note, does anyone have knowledge of an STC that would slightly modify the 206B3 hydraulics to make them more like the OH-58. This is a serious inquiry that may help save one of us one day.
Saber 09
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Heliringer RPM Changes
Heliringer,
Set the N2 prior to takeoff, then leave it alone. You may sometimes find that it takes a little increase at a hover due to power demand as compared to at flat pitch. Sometimes they will hunt, so you have to sort of go with the mid-point. The last thing I would ever do is decrease my RPM. The linear actuators always seem to cooperate when you make a reduction, but sometimes they do not when you need an increase.
These remarks are based on over 2500 hours in Bell 206 variants. About 2000 of that has been as an instructor.
Saber 09
Set the N2 prior to takeoff, then leave it alone. You may sometimes find that it takes a little increase at a hover due to power demand as compared to at flat pitch. Sometimes they will hunt, so you have to sort of go with the mid-point. The last thing I would ever do is decrease my RPM. The linear actuators always seem to cooperate when you make a reduction, but sometimes they do not when you need an increase.
These remarks are based on over 2500 hours in Bell 206 variants. About 2000 of that has been as an instructor.
Saber 09
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B206 BIII Start/Shutdown limits
Is there a wind speed limit for the B206 for start up & shut down ?
I have been through the flight manual and "google" but cannot find a limit - there must be one
I have been through the flight manual and "google" but cannot find a limit - there must be one
120Torque:
Why would you assume so? And why would you want one? If Bell did specify such a thing, it would surely put a crimp in some operations somewhere. The RFMs simply cannot cover every situation in every part of the world.
Is there a wind speed limit for the B206 for start up & shut down ?
I have been through the flight manual and "google" but cannot find a limit - there must be one
I have been through the flight manual and "google" but cannot find a limit - there must be one
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In my world, we just have a limit to stop operations: 40 kts. Anything
much over 30, nobody shuts down offshore. Nobody wants to flirt
with a strike. Nothing written down by Bell. It's kind of like fuel burn:
they don't want to get pinned down by a number and leave themselves
exposed. Probably less risky in a B. A lot of those little fins chopped
off in a L model.
much over 30, nobody shuts down offshore. Nobody wants to flirt
with a strike. Nothing written down by Bell. It's kind of like fuel burn:
they don't want to get pinned down by a number and leave themselves
exposed. Probably less risky in a B. A lot of those little fins chopped
off in a L model.