ATPL/CPL Training: Ground School topics
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Guys,
I'm very grateful for your replies and pms. It has been interesting to note your opinions. Armed with these, I'll speak to the schools at the Flyer show at Heathrow in November and come to a final choice.
Thanks again,
DBChopper
I'm very grateful for your replies and pms. It has been interesting to note your opinions. Armed with these, I'll speak to the schools at the Flyer show at Heathrow in November and come to a final choice.
Thanks again,
DBChopper
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Converting with Bristol GS
Hi,
Just been looking in the Bristol ground school forum .....
AHHHH........
i need to convert my heli license but it looks like you need to understand flaps and other fixed wing stuff ( fingers crossed, garlic round my neck ) any one gone through the process recently care to share thier experience of it???
Cheers Lee...
Just been looking in the Bristol ground school forum .....
AHHHH........
i need to convert my heli license but it looks like you need to understand flaps and other fixed wing stuff ( fingers crossed, garlic round my neck
) any one gone through the process recently care to share thier experience of it???Cheers Lee...
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Licence Converting!!!
Welcome to the world of confusion!!
I am also in the position of trying to convert my heli licence! The first question has to be from what to what? I am converting ATPL to ATPL and for that I require the fixed wing training hours i.e. CPL hours plus multi IR and, according to the CAA, a 'Bridgin Course' which covers the non rotary bits of the ATPL theory and then Performace and P of F Fixed wing.
Performance and P of F are relatively simple in comparision to the flying bumble bee!!! If you have any form of aerodynamics experience on big helos (S76, S61 etc) non of this should come as a problem. If not PM me and I can send you a PP presentation with some helo P of F (reads across almost). Contact the 'on-line' JALS database (30Euros for three months) they have the question bank in there and, although I thought 30 E's a bit steep at first, it is excellent.
The biggest problem lies with the bridging course. NON OF THE B*&%$Y GROUNDSCHOOLS OUT THERE WILL PROVIDE IT!!!!
The CAA say that they have written it and therefore it must be sat however without the CGI's signature you can't apply for it. Without the course you won't get the CGI's signature and the schools won't write the course's 'cause it costs too much for too few people
So, if anybody out there also would like/need/wants this facility to be available, and it makes sense to have both IMO, then call Bristol or CABAIR continuously until they cough up and set the course!!!
Rant over, relax, count to one hundred, go flying!!!
I am also in the position of trying to convert my heli licence! The first question has to be from what to what? I am converting ATPL to ATPL and for that I require the fixed wing training hours i.e. CPL hours plus multi IR and, according to the CAA, a 'Bridgin Course' which covers the non rotary bits of the ATPL theory and then Performace and P of F Fixed wing.
Performance and P of F are relatively simple in comparision to the flying bumble bee!!! If you have any form of aerodynamics experience on big helos (S76, S61 etc) non of this should come as a problem. If not PM me and I can send you a PP presentation with some helo P of F (reads across almost). Contact the 'on-line' JALS database (30Euros for three months) they have the question bank in there and, although I thought 30 E's a bit steep at first, it is excellent.
The biggest problem lies with the bridging course. NON OF THE B*&%$Y GROUNDSCHOOLS OUT THERE WILL PROVIDE IT!!!!
The CAA say that they have written it and therefore it must be sat however without the CGI's signature you can't apply for it. Without the course you won't get the CGI's signature and the schools won't write the course's 'cause it costs too much for too few people
So, if anybody out there also would like/need/wants this facility to be available, and it makes sense to have both IMO, then call Bristol or CABAIR continuously until they cough up and set the course!!!
Rant over, relax, count to one hundred, go flying!!!
Remeber, the light at the end of the tunnel could be an oncoming train
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New JAA CPL(H) course!
As to bridging courses, I hear that Bristol Ground School can do them for helo pilots - are you certain?
On another note: interestingly, the first JAA CPL(H) theory course has just been started by Dragon Helicopters in Sheffield. They could convert the license for anyone wanting to come to this country I think. The details in front of me state that there will be nine exams clearing you for VFR ops only. this means that you could still be an instructor and line pilot to begin your career and if you wanted to go to the rigs or do twin IFR charter later on, you could bolt on the further 7 exams (IFR related) to get the frozen ATPL (H).
All sounds exciting since it brings the cost of becoming a professional right down. Hope this helps some of you who are scratching your heads due to the astronomical costs of licenses these days!
On another note: interestingly, the first JAA CPL(H) theory course has just been started by Dragon Helicopters in Sheffield. They could convert the license for anyone wanting to come to this country I think. The details in front of me state that there will be nine exams clearing you for VFR ops only. this means that you could still be an instructor and line pilot to begin your career and if you wanted to go to the rigs or do twin IFR charter later on, you could bolt on the further 7 exams (IFR related) to get the frozen ATPL (H).
All sounds exciting since it brings the cost of becoming a professional right down. Hope this helps some of you who are scratching your heads due to the astronomical costs of licenses these days!
Better red than ...
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Old JAA CPL(H) Course
I think you can do this with GTS as well. Details http://www.gtserv.co.uk/cpl(H)_course.htm
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Well thank you for your replies,
just looked at the dragon website and looks like they use bristol GS, didnt see any details for just doing the cpl(h) portion but that sounds good to me at the moment ( assuming that there are jobs for cpl only??)
What is the job scene like at the moment?? rigs busy and the easier way to get your foot in the door???much work for VFR only??
Cheers Lee...
just looked at the dragon website and looks like they use bristol GS, didnt see any details for just doing the cpl(h) portion but that sounds good to me at the moment ( assuming that there are jobs for cpl only??)
What is the job scene like at the moment?? rigs busy and the easier way to get your foot in the door???much work for VFR only??
Cheers Lee...
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Leee,
Which way round are you going?? From your origional post it would seem that you are going from rotary to fixed wing. Is this correct?
The reason I ask is because the various schools do offer the conversion from A to H, it is the other way round that is difficult.
At the end of the day contact the CAA who will assess your log book and advise you of whichever exams you need to sit. For example if you have a PPL(H) then you will need to sit the performance and P of F for fixed wing in order to gain a PPL(A). This reads across for the CPL as well but for ATPL you will be required to dig a bit deeper and cover the 'parts' of the fixed wing syllabus not covered by helo flying. I.e. Long range nav, NATS, air con, Perf A, oxygen systems etc....
Hope that helps
Which way round are you going?? From your origional post it would seem that you are going from rotary to fixed wing. Is this correct?
The reason I ask is because the various schools do offer the conversion from A to H, it is the other way round that is difficult.
At the end of the day contact the CAA who will assess your log book and advise you of whichever exams you need to sit. For example if you have a PPL(H) then you will need to sit the performance and P of F for fixed wing in order to gain a PPL(A). This reads across for the CPL as well but for ATPL you will be required to dig a bit deeper and cover the 'parts' of the fixed wing syllabus not covered by helo flying. I.e. Long range nav, NATS, air con, Perf A, oxygen systems etc....
Hope that helps
Remember! The light at the end of the tunnel could be an oncoming train!
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CPL(H) details
Leee the job scene is looking fairly bouyant at the mo since the horrendous price of licenses and hrs required have sadly left a lot of people unable to justify the costs of going professional. However, on the positive side, there seems to be a general deficit of instructors nationally (ie VFR flying only)! Also, you may be aware that the North Sea has some large impending contracts so worth digging there a bit. (you would have to do the ATPLs if you wanted to go up there)
As to Dragon Helicopters, they haven't put the CPL(H) details on their website yet, but info is available on +44 (0)870 8110203
Good luck!
As to Dragon Helicopters, they haven't put the CPL(H) details on their website yet, but info is available on +44 (0)870 8110203
Good luck!
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PAUL:I am going to Heli to Heli, sorry i didnt make that completely clear in the begining ( i just reread the post.) And now you understand my fear of flaps etc..
So to make it clear....
I have Faa CPL(H),CFI(H),IFR(H) and Canadian CPL(H),Night (sat ATPL exams)
1500+ hrs and now i am coming home, so i need to convert to a JAA, hence wondering about CPL(H) or ATPL(H) job scene etc..
CRANEFLY: Cheers for that, i emailed Dragon after reading your post and they sent me an attachment, I thought it would be cheaper to do the CPL but it was $1900 ( no pound sign) same as the distance ATPL with Bristol.
Cheers Lee...
So to make it clear....
I have Faa CPL(H),CFI(H),IFR(H) and Canadian CPL(H),Night (sat ATPL exams)
1500+ hrs and now i am coming home, so i need to convert to a JAA, hence wondering about CPL(H) or ATPL(H) job scene etc..
CRANEFLY: Cheers for that, i emailed Dragon after reading your post and they sent me an attachment, I thought it would be cheaper to do the CPL but it was $1900 ( no pound sign) same as the distance ATPL with Bristol.
Cheers Lee...
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Okay, that clears things up a bit 
What you are looking at then is a direct read across from FAA to JAA, something that didn't happen for decades in the CAA but I am now led to believe, from a spy in the Belgrano building, that a read across will soon be available early next year.
The details are still being worked but the general intention for experienced pilots will be a direct comparision issue.
However, that will get you CPL, if you have the theoretical credits for ATPL then I don't know if they will be carried across. Otherwise you will need to do the ATPL exams which are, currently, fixed wing orientated but the CAA are introducing the rotary exams as we type!
At the end of the day you need to speak to the licensing section at the CAA and ask them for the details.
Hope that helps.
What you are looking at then is a direct read across from FAA to JAA, something that didn't happen for decades in the CAA but I am now led to believe, from a spy in the Belgrano building, that a read across will soon be available early next year.
The details are still being worked but the general intention for experienced pilots will be a direct comparision issue.
However, that will get you CPL, if you have the theoretical credits for ATPL then I don't know if they will be carried across. Otherwise you will need to do the ATPL exams which are, currently, fixed wing orientated but the CAA are introducing the rotary exams as we type!
At the end of the day you need to speak to the licensing section at the CAA and ask them for the details.
Hope that helps.
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If i could get a straight CPL for CPL that would be great, i read about it a few years ago but didnt think it would ever really happen!! then i would just need the extra ATPL exams, could live with that even if they are fixed wing biased!! hey i might even be able to earn some money whilst i study!!!
sounds to good to be true, which means it must be.
14 exams here i come....
Well i arive back next week, got my medical booked so i guess i will have a chat whilst i am there ( or is expecting the medical and licsensing depts to be near each other to much to ask??)
Cheers Lee...
sounds to good to be true, which means it must be.
14 exams here i come....
Well i arive back next week, got my medical booked so i guess i will have a chat whilst i am there ( or is expecting the medical and licsensing depts to be near each other to much to ask??)
Cheers Lee...
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Bristol GS has the best reputation. Those in the know both fixed-wing and heli have gone.
Risky attending a newish ground school, like being a guinea pig really. Not the wisest. Your choice though.
Find out the experience of the instructors at Dragon, if they have plenty of CPL experience go for it.
If not I'd be wary. Bristol guys, ie Alex Whittingham have years of experience, do it day in day out. They know it like the back of their hand. Makes sense, lots of 'bang for yer buck!'
You might as well get all the exams done, most of the hard ones have to be done for the CPL anyway.
Hope this puts you in the picture.
Risky attending a newish ground school, like being a guinea pig really. Not the wisest. Your choice though.
Find out the experience of the instructors at Dragon, if they have plenty of CPL experience go for it.
If not I'd be wary. Bristol guys, ie Alex Whittingham have years of experience, do it day in day out. They know it like the back of their hand. Makes sense, lots of 'bang for yer buck!'
You might as well get all the exams done, most of the hard ones have to be done for the CPL anyway.
Hope this puts you in the picture.
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ATPL(H) Ground School
Cheers for all your help so far guys it is really great in narrowing down which path to take!
But i have decided to do my ATPL(H) ground school here in the UK before i go out to the US.
IM looking at Bristol, Cabair, Oxford. Has anybody been on these courses and got any reccomendations or even reccomendations for other schools?
Once again, Thankyou in advance!
Popa
But i have decided to do my ATPL(H) ground school here in the UK before i go out to the US.
IM looking at Bristol, Cabair, Oxford. Has anybody been on these courses and got any reccomendations or even reccomendations for other schools?
Once again, Thankyou in advance!
Popa
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oxford
went to oxford last yr and am in states now. thought it was good. heli theory instruction was pants however and didnt prepare us for the exam. passed it through sheer hard work and and some extra tuition.
us heli people had to do one less exam than the fixed wing students (performance) and replaced fixed wing p of f with heli p of f.
overall thought it was a good/ proffesional set up. i got what i paid for, all first time passes and and an 86% average...
good luck
us heli people had to do one less exam than the fixed wing students (performance) and replaced fixed wing p of f with heli p of f.
overall thought it was a good/ proffesional set up. i got what i paid for, all first time passes and and an 86% average...
good luck
Hovering AND talking
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If you do a search on the Wannabee's Professional Training forum, you'll get all the gen you want.
Nobody has a bad word to say about Bristol there.
Although that would be mostly from a fixed wing point of view, the standard and professionalism of the school with apply to both A and H so you should garner a lot from there!
Cheers
Whirlygig
Nobody has a bad word to say about Bristol there.
Although that would be mostly from a fixed wing point of view, the standard and professionalism of the school with apply to both A and H so you should garner a lot from there!
Cheers
Whirlygig
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I did the ATPL(H) at Bristol last year and passed all first time.
I think they now do a dedicated H syllabus but at the time all H bods were in with the fixed wing crowd.
They split the exams into 2 modules and do PofF(H) in mod 2.
As you don't do performance there is plenty of time to revise PofF and on the middle Sunday you spend a day in the classroom with Mike Burton.
He's wrote a few books(!) and knows the subject inside out.
You'll find lots of info about Bristol on other forums but I certainly recommend them.
I think they now do a dedicated H syllabus but at the time all H bods were in with the fixed wing crowd.
They split the exams into 2 modules and do PofF(H) in mod 2.
As you don't do performance there is plenty of time to revise PofF and on the middle Sunday you spend a day in the classroom with Mike Burton.
He's wrote a few books(!) and knows the subject inside out.
You'll find lots of info about Bristol on other forums but I certainly recommend them.
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ATPL Ground School
Have you had a look at Dragon Helicopters. They run a full ATPL(H) ground school. The CGI is an old hand at ground school and a very good instructor.
Here's a link to their site. http://www.dragonhelicopters.co.uk/cplhleaf.pdf
Good luck
Lionco
PS. I have nothing what so ever to do with Dragon Helicopters.
Here's a link to their site. http://www.dragonhelicopters.co.uk/cplhleaf.pdf
Good luck
Lionco
PS. I have nothing what so ever to do with Dragon Helicopters.
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Can certainly reiterate the usual about BGS - you will not fail with their course. As previously stated about Mike Burton - being locked in a room with an old man wouldn't usually bring cause for excitement, but you'll have a great learning day with Mike, God bless him ! Ask him how he learned to fly in the RAF when he was PAX in a fast jet and the pilot passed out ! Got one of his books here by Poolys, I think.
