BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions
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Call100:
The phrase 'related to the industrial action' can mean many things to many individuals.
I would expect that BASSA is trying to get ALL disciplinary actions against individuals who were participating in communications and/or conduct arising out of the threat or actual taking of IA dismissed.
This would include those individuals making comments on Facebook, attempts to discredit non-striking Cabin Crew and BA through the use of misleading websites, etc., etc.. All can be pitched by BASSA as arising out of and/or related to IA.
That is not a "Macho" opinion to have (heaven's I am tired of that word), its just the reality of the situation.
The phrase 'related to the industrial action' can mean many things to many individuals.
I would expect that BASSA is trying to get ALL disciplinary actions against individuals who were participating in communications and/or conduct arising out of the threat or actual taking of IA dismissed.
This would include those individuals making comments on Facebook, attempts to discredit non-striking Cabin Crew and BA through the use of misleading websites, etc., etc.. All can be pitched by BASSA as arising out of and/or related to IA.
That is not a "Macho" opinion to have (heaven's I am tired of that word), its just the reality of the situation.
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I honestly can't see how BASSA can fight this.
1. Staff Travel. Everyone was told what would happen. And it did. It's a concession, not a right.
2. Disciplinary. Normal procedures would be followed. And they are. Normal Admin processes.
It is childish to suggest that introducing these aspects into the IA debate will lead anywhere. But that's BASSA's mindset.
1. Staff Travel. Everyone was told what would happen. And it did. It's a concession, not a right.
2. Disciplinary. Normal procedures would be followed. And they are. Normal Admin processes.
It is childish to suggest that introducing these aspects into the IA debate will lead anywhere. But that's BASSA's mindset.
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MissM
All actions have consequences. Cabin crew took legal industrial action that cost BA millions. It was a known and intended consequence. BA warned striking crew that a consequence of taking industrial action was that staff travel - a concessionary perk - would be permanently withdrawn. Again, a known consequence.
Is BASSA planning to repay the millions they cost BA? No. Should BA return staff travel to strikers? No again.
TB
All actions have consequences. Cabin crew took legal industrial action that cost BA millions. It was a known and intended consequence. BA warned striking crew that a consequence of taking industrial action was that staff travel - a concessionary perk - would be permanently withdrawn. Again, a known consequence.
Is BASSA planning to repay the millions they cost BA? No. Should BA return staff travel to strikers? No again.
TB
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Everybody knew of the consequences but it's still discriminatory and nothing but punishment. I can't remember that they have ever threatened any other group within the company that they would lose staff travel should they go on a strike.
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I am sure you are correct that this has not happened before to any other work group at BA. But then again, BA has never faced the economic conditions that are prevelant in the world economy. And of course, they have not had a CEO like Walsh that laid out what would happen and then - shock / horror - kept his word.
To discriminate, actions have to be imposed unfairly. Since this whole IA is supposed to be about imposition, I put it to you that withdrawl of staff travel was not imposed, it was self inflicted.
TB
To discriminate, actions have to be imposed unfairly. Since this whole IA is supposed to be about imposition, I put it to you that withdrawl of staff travel was not imposed, it was self inflicted.
TB
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MissM .. of course it's a form of punishment. That's what happens in the real world.
Children and dogs [and cats] get smacked. People who misbehave get ASBOs, or speeding tickets, or parking fines, or worse. Some people even become unemployed.
It's what happens when people pi66 about. Simples.
If you don't want the consequences, think about what might happen before you do something. In my career, I knew the consequences of being stupid. I watched too many colleagues do it, and suffer the inevitable result.
It's not a bloody game. It's called Life. Learn to enjoy it
Children and dogs [and cats] get smacked. People who misbehave get ASBOs, or speeding tickets, or parking fines, or worse. Some people even become unemployed.
It's what happens when people pi66 about. Simples.
If you don't want the consequences, think about what might happen before you do something. In my career, I knew the consequences of being stupid. I watched too many colleagues do it, and suffer the inevitable result.
It's not a bloody game. It's called Life. Learn to enjoy it
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Surely if consequences of striking are known beforehand, how on earth can you complain when they are implemented.!!.Strikers ignored the constant warnings, and are now complaining?? Strange thinking.
MPN11. Sorry,Posts must have been about same time. I wouldn't have posted if I'd seen yours.
Miss M Sorry to sound vindictive, but your strike VERY NEARLY cost me thousands of pounds. No sympathy from me, I'm afraid.!!
MPN11. Sorry,Posts must have been about same time. I wouldn't have posted if I'd seen yours.
Miss M Sorry to sound vindictive, but your strike VERY NEARLY cost me thousands of pounds. No sympathy from me, I'm afraid.!!
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MPN11
That's not the issue. The issue is that people, myself included, are being punished for taking part of a legal strike regardless that we were informed of what would happen.
Well done to you for not being stupid.
It should be interesting to see what will happen. BASSA will accept a deal without these issues resolved.
Learn to enjoy life? No need. I'm already enjoying life.
JEM60
My apologies to you that you had your travel plans interrupted but I'm not after any sympathy whatsoever.
That's not the issue. The issue is that people, myself included, are being punished for taking part of a legal strike regardless that we were informed of what would happen.
Well done to you for not being stupid.
It should be interesting to see what will happen. BASSA will accept a deal without these issues resolved.
Learn to enjoy life? No need. I'm already enjoying life.
JEM60
My apologies to you that you had your travel plans interrupted but I'm not after any sympathy whatsoever.
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Other staff have been threatened with loss of staff travel in the past, but getting it back was part of the back to work agreement.
WW made it clear, on several occasions ... loss of ST WILL be the result of strike action.
Are you a manager at any level? How do you retain any credibility as a manager if you reverse your policy statements?
WW had made it perfectly [and legally] clear what would happen. Endex.
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Dear MissM, and I say that because you are a very valuable contributor to these forums ....
OK - you are being 'punished'. Or, more realistically, you have caused the Company considerable inconvenience and expense by your actions.
Do you honestly expect them to allow you to retain extra-regulationary privileges in consequence?
Obviously you do. I don't.
That's not the issue. The issue is that people, myself included, are being punished for taking part of a legal strike regardless that we were informed of what would happen.
Do you honestly expect them to allow you to retain extra-regulationary privileges in consequence?
Obviously you do. I don't.
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MPN11
Removing staff travel because you are going on a strike is punishment.
WW is aiming for cabin crew specifically. Did management threaten to remove ST for pilots when they were threatening to go on a strike some years ago? No, of course not and this is probably why they got away with their sweetheart deal. When ground staff said they were going on a strike, what did management do? They said they would get further staff travel benefits if they came into work.
I, and many others, expect staff travel to be reinstated because this is discrimination and punishment. I will at least read through the proposal, if put forward by our union, but there are many many who won't even look at it if reinstatement of staff travel is included.
Removing staff travel because you are going on a strike is punishment.
WW is aiming for cabin crew specifically. Did management threaten to remove ST for pilots when they were threatening to go on a strike some years ago? No, of course not and this is probably why they got away with their sweetheart deal. When ground staff said they were going on a strike, what did management do? They said they would get further staff travel benefits if they came into work.
I, and many others, expect staff travel to be reinstated because this is discrimination and punishment. I will at least read through the proposal, if put forward by our union, but there are many many who won't even look at it if reinstatement of staff travel is included.
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Willie Walsh told me I would be able to fly during the strike - I did. my flight left BOM without a hitch.
Willie Walsh told my family he would look after them when they were stranded in BOM due to the volcano - they have spent the last week in a five star hotel with most expenses covered.
Willie Walsh tarvelled in his aircraft that flew to test the effects of ash.
Willie Walsh brought the flight ban to an end with his brave decision to launch flights towards the UK.
Doing a Willie Walsh is becoming a metaphor for honest, positive and brave management.
I dont fancy BASSA's chances.
Willie Walsh told my family he would look after them when they were stranded in BOM due to the volcano - they have spent the last week in a five star hotel with most expenses covered.
Willie Walsh tarvelled in his aircraft that flew to test the effects of ash.
Willie Walsh brought the flight ban to an end with his brave decision to launch flights towards the UK.
Doing a Willie Walsh is becoming a metaphor for honest, positive and brave management.
I dont fancy BASSA's chances.
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Miss M
I didn't say he was a hero. I'm simply pointing out he appears to be honest.
In terms of being a hero. Well I heard many people saying lots of positive things about him in the last 24hrs. I have to agree with them. Top bloke.
In terms of being a hero. Well I heard many people saying lots of positive things about him in the last 24hrs. I have to agree with them. Top bloke.
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Is that why over 50 crew have been suspended for raising their opinion?
Removal of ST is punishment, if you never thought it would happen or indeed believed that you would get it back.
I also think it was reasonable to remove it, as warned. I could not imagine a striking Tesco employee walking into the store and using the staff discount card after going on strike, perhaps....
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On ST I’ll add, as a trade unionist, that I don't particularly like the idea of “consequences” being levied at potential strikers, it does just feel wrong on a fair few levels.
However, trying to see it from the companies view point, I do fully understand that it feels equally wrong to continue to provide such a perk (which it is) to staff that attempted to damage the company.
Had it have been me I think I would have stopped short of using the “permanent” word, to at least give me some wriggle room post IA. I would have then at least had options, no ST for 12-24 months, restrict to one route, no family, whatever....
As it is now I really don't see it coming back, not via any legal challenge and not via union pressure – I would suggest it’s gone for at least as Mr Walsh is in the top seat, thereafter, who knows?
However, trying to see it from the companies view point, I do fully understand that it feels equally wrong to continue to provide such a perk (which it is) to staff that attempted to damage the company.
Had it have been me I think I would have stopped short of using the “permanent” word, to at least give me some wriggle room post IA. I would have then at least had options, no ST for 12-24 months, restrict to one route, no family, whatever....
As it is now I really don't see it coming back, not via any legal challenge and not via union pressure – I would suggest it’s gone for at least as Mr Walsh is in the top seat, thereafter, who knows?
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Removing staff travel because you are going on a strike is punishment.
The CEO of your company made it clear that the staff travel concession would be withdrawn from people who withdrew their labour.
It is called a positive subtraction (something good is removed) and it would no doubt persuade a number of people to change their intended behaviour and go to work, thus protecting the business, which is one of your company CEO's accountabilities.
A punishment is called a negative addition. This means that something unpleasant is introduced as a consequence of going on strike.
Nothing bad has been added, but something good has been lost to people who chose to strike.
You have a lawful right to strike, your company has a lawful right to withdraw concessions.
It isn't punishment, move on......