BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions
Diplome.. is the assertion that Cabin Crew were offered 100 STG to fly? Given the numbers turning up for work I think that would be highly unlikely but it's quite possibly an assertion that has it's origins at BASSA.
baggers
I'd agree with your sentiment regarding the cult aspect of this, if not some of the language and phraseology! BASSA certainly has made a massive attempt made to demonise the CEO, especially once it became apparent there was no sustainable logic to the dispute, and sadly that seems to have worked to a degree on many of the Cabin Crew. Even the many very intelligent ones can't resist a snipe at "that horrible man" in the absence of anything more concrete to back up their arguments
Sadly it has now been shown that it is possible to turn folks from a variety of backgrounds into basic, rank and file cabin crew, in three weeks and that act in itself has destroyed any remaining mystic about the specialness of the cabin crew jobs and the qualities needed to do it. I'm not saying it's easy job to do, it's not, but their training does not put them on a par with the likes of a GP (an opinion held by least one Cabin Crew member member). I suspect they, and many of their colleagues in other companies, will be suffering the consequences of this "revelation" for many years.
baggers
I'd agree with your sentiment regarding the cult aspect of this, if not some of the language and phraseology! BASSA certainly has made a massive attempt made to demonise the CEO, especially once it became apparent there was no sustainable logic to the dispute, and sadly that seems to have worked to a degree on many of the Cabin Crew. Even the many very intelligent ones can't resist a snipe at "that horrible man" in the absence of anything more concrete to back up their arguments
and consistently tell them how powerful and special and talented they are
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Wiggy:
Yes, it is...and yes, the origin of the comment is from an individual I believe to be a CR.
I believe what they are trying to do is take the one down payment and twist it into something special for non-striking crew.
No surprises there
Yes, it is...and yes, the origin of the comment is from an individual I believe to be a CR.
I believe what they are trying to do is take the one down payment and twist it into something special for non-striking crew.
No surprises there
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(it has now been shown that it is possible to turn folks from a variety of backgrounds into basic, rank and file cabin crew, in three weeks)
You could get the most serious kicking on this website if you posted a make believe advertisement which set out a job description as a recruitment poster.
Is a driving licence without stars a pre-requisite? Wouldn't it be all right just to live on an after hours bus route?
As for WW....it look as though he maybe saved the empire-well, at least kept BA flying so that the PMs cannot justify a private GV. So look to a knighthood for him next time around. When he steps down from BA he will probably be made Transport Minister without portfolio.
(edit: Sorry...did not mean a kinghood for WW just a knighthood.)
Post 4525 on the staff channel is pretty good precis of situations
You could get the most serious kicking on this website if you posted a make believe advertisement which set out a job description as a recruitment poster.
Is a driving licence without stars a pre-requisite? Wouldn't it be all right just to live on an after hours bus route?
As for WW....it look as though he maybe saved the empire-well, at least kept BA flying so that the PMs cannot justify a private GV. So look to a knighthood for him next time around. When he steps down from BA he will probably be made Transport Minister without portfolio.
(edit: Sorry...did not mean a kinghood for WW just a knighthood.)
Post 4525 on the staff channel is pretty good precis of situations
Last edited by Der absolute Hammer; 4th Jun 2010 at 16:45.
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The end is nigh.....
As I posted the other day, this dispute is grinding to it's inevitable conclusion.
Bassa was stupidly hoping that media support would keep them in the headlines. The media have lost interest as have the public & without the support of both groups Bassa is finished. They never stood a chance anyway against Mr Walsh who was specifically employed to take away their long standing restrictive practices & make BA profitable.
It will be very interesting to see the reasons for any future ballot on extending IA. I'm sure the BA legal team are champing at the bit.
Bassa was stupidly hoping that media support would keep them in the headlines. The media have lost interest as have the public & without the support of both groups Bassa is finished. They never stood a chance anyway against Mr Walsh who was specifically employed to take away their long standing restrictive practices & make BA profitable.
It will be very interesting to see the reasons for any future ballot on extending IA. I'm sure the BA legal team are champing at the bit.
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it has now been shown that it is possible to turn folks from a variety of backgrounds into basic, rank and file cabin crew, in three weeks
You could get the most serious kicking on this website...
I'm not going to waste your (and my) time going into the value placed by certain people here on the CC role in general. You're so incredibly well-informed and perceptive that there would be nothing that I, or indeed anybody, could possibly do to change your views in even the smallest way.
Instead, I 'll just have to rely on the old claw-hammer to the head technique, and remind you all to be respectful of the role while on PPRuNe, even though by now, we all know that you don't really mean it and are doing so through gritted teeth.
I, and my friends and colleagues working as CC throughout the industry, do our jobs diligently and with some pride, and (yes I know) with some skill. We are not striking, or proposing to, and I simply will not tolerate vicious sniping any more.
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I should have saved my post from the other board (for which I'm expecting any moment now a swift kick to my gluteus maximus) because it did refer somewhat to TightSlot's observation.
In its condensed form, its important for all of us, Crew, BA employee and SLF, to remember that if the BASSA difficulty is solved and if BA is placed in a position to look forward to the future, allowed to improve service and atmosphere, it will be because of the experienced, motivated, positive Cabin Crew members who chose to support their co-workers in all departments and work and lead through these strikes.
It would not have been possible without them and a productive future for BA will not be achieved without their experience and belief in their company.
In its condensed form, its important for all of us, Crew, BA employee and SLF, to remember that if the BASSA difficulty is solved and if BA is placed in a position to look forward to the future, allowed to improve service and atmosphere, it will be because of the experienced, motivated, positive Cabin Crew members who chose to support their co-workers in all departments and work and lead through these strikes.
It would not have been possible without them and a productive future for BA will not be achieved without their experience and belief in their company.
Fair enough Tightslot (and Der A H), and I was in no way being or attempting to be disrespectful...but at the risk of the aformentioned kicking I'd still maintain that it's now a statement of fact, and that is certainly not good for the perception of the cabin crew role or status in the public eye. Those of us who work with cabin crew know it's somewhat different......
I will now bend over, having inserted a copy of The Beano down the back of my shorts.......
I will now bend over, having inserted a copy of The Beano down the back of my shorts.......
Last edited by wiggy; 4th Jun 2010 at 22:19. Reason: spolling
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Tightslot
Instead, I 'll just have to rely on the old claw-hammer to the head technique, and remind you all to be respectful of the role while on PPRuNe, even though by now, we all know that you don't really mean it and are doing so through gritted teeth.
In my previous life before my little airline went bust, apart from my planning duties I also taught Dangerous Goods ( well someone has to do it), so I am only too well aware that it's a very intensive 3-4 weeks course which CC don't successfully complete without a lot of hard work.
However, I don't have the same feelings towards the hard hearted militants who are trying to wreck BA for their own selfish means. Maybe some posters are allowing similar frustrations to colour their remarks to include all CC, a situation which I also do not support.
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I'm not going to waste your (and my) time going into the value placed by certain people here on the CC role in general
The fact of the matter is that cabin crew is not a role that requires several years of training (for example, like a doctor), nor does it require professional certification (for example, like a chartered accountant.)
It does require training to meet the standards set by the regulator and a type rating.
Cabin crew not only deal with the safety of the passengers, but also perform an ambassadorial role as they are the visible face of the airline to its customers.
In short, good cabin crew are a valuable asset to an airline.
However, in the wider scheme of things, let's not over egg it?
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F3G - There is no pretence that CC is a profession, or requires years of training, and never has been: Neither I, nor others have written otherwise. I'm extremely well aware of the requirements, both regulatory and ambassadorial, and do not require reminding of them, least of all by you. Do not make the mistake of assuming that I wish to enter some kind of debate with you about this subject and do not, as is your custom, persist in this vein in your usual and tedious desire to have the final word - just wind your neck in and move on.
Once again, and for the final time... A majority of CC are not on strike, and do not work for BA: Within BA, a majority of CC are turning up for work, and like their colleagues working in other airlines, are doing the best they can on a daily basis. As long as you wish to post on PPRuNe, you will respect this fact, and and treat cabin crew with basic human respect. If you are incapable of doing so, your posting rights will be withdrawn.
I cannot find a way to be clearer than this
Move on
Once again, and for the final time... A majority of CC are not on strike, and do not work for BA: Within BA, a majority of CC are turning up for work, and like their colleagues working in other airlines, are doing the best they can on a daily basis. As long as you wish to post on PPRuNe, you will respect this fact, and and treat cabin crew with basic human respect. If you are incapable of doing so, your posting rights will be withdrawn.
I cannot find a way to be clearer than this
Move on
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So, next steps.......
Will Mr Walsh just start new fleet and grow it gradually, or dismiss and re-engage all crew using SOSR? I do not believe that BA can be selective, unless it is a redundancy dismissal.
Will Mr Walsh just start new fleet and grow it gradually, or dismiss and re-engage all crew using SOSR? I do not believe that BA can be selective, unless it is a redundancy dismissal.
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Pprune facilitate this forum for us to be able to post/comment/ spout forth our thoughts. We, registered or not are guests of Pprune. Moderators (Tightslot and many more) give of their own time to be impartial and keep each thread on track. I believe they do a really good job. My opinion, I'm entitled to it. If Tightslot decides he has enough of the drivel being spouted and feels that the thread needs a break, then I am sure that is not a 'teddy in the corner moment', but a considered response to the way the thread is progressing (or not). As Cabin crew (Tightslot) I don't think you could hope for a better moderator to 'referee' this thread. And before you ask, no I am not in Tightslots back pocket, I have know idea who he/her is.
Back on thread...
It would appear bassa are going to re-ballot their members, anyone have any idea what the ballot question will be?
My understanding is they cannot re-ballot on the same topic. So what is the new ballot format going to consist of?
Back on thread...
It would appear bassa are going to re-ballot their members, anyone have any idea what the ballot question will be?
My understanding is they cannot re-ballot on the same topic. So what is the new ballot format going to consist of?
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Duncan Holley's arch-nemesis, the Daily Mail, have an editorial:
Real agenda of the BA strike leaders | Mail Online
It certainly does ring true with today's announcement of the expectation of massive public sector cuts; how many of these unnecessary council workers that Labour have created will be UNITE members I wonder?
It isn't just BA that's at risk from this bunch of 70's commie comrades.
Real agenda of the BA strike leaders | Mail Online
It certainly does ring true with today's announcement of the expectation of massive public sector cuts; how many of these unnecessary council workers that Labour have created will be UNITE members I wonder?
It isn't just BA that's at risk from this bunch of 70's commie comrades.
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What BASSA/Unite ballot on next will indeed be interesting. Travel Scheme i would imagine is high on their rant list, and one i have no sympathy at all over.
But i can't think what else they may be balloting over. I predict by the way that the ballot will be succesful, with a 82% majority of voters with only 50% of membership actually voting.
Just been looking at flight prices for next April to LAS..Thomson direct from MAN, Virgin starting direct from MAN..or BA MAN-LHR, LHR-LAS. dunno where my money's going to be going yet. Exchange rate and dispute uncertainty have curtailed any more trips this year.
But i can't think what else they may be balloting over. I predict by the way that the ballot will be succesful, with a 82% majority of voters with only 50% of membership actually voting.
Just been looking at flight prices for next April to LAS..Thomson direct from MAN, Virgin starting direct from MAN..or BA MAN-LHR, LHR-LAS. dunno where my money's going to be going yet. Exchange rate and dispute uncertainty have curtailed any more trips this year.
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ChicoG
Aplogies for off topic.I work in Local Government. do not confuse Local Governement and civil service.
You have to get to Higher management before you find people being payed over national average in Local Government. And higher management are very rare birds.
While there is a UNITE prescence in the workforce mainly at the contracting side, the client side tend to be UNISON.
back on topic. The mail has been fairly constant in its opposition to BASSA and UNITE..not helped when BASSA members gave their reporter a hard time and a Foxtrot Oscar
Aplogies for off topic.I work in Local Government. do not confuse Local Governement and civil service.
You have to get to Higher management before you find people being payed over national average in Local Government. And higher management are very rare birds.
While there is a UNITE prescence in the workforce mainly at the contracting side, the client side tend to be UNISON.
back on topic. The mail has been fairly constant in its opposition to BASSA and UNITE..not helped when BASSA members gave their reporter a hard time and a Foxtrot Oscar
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Re ballot
My understanding is they cannot re-ballot on the same topic. So what is the new ballot format going to consist of?
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Fincastle.
Whilst the samosas, burger van, pimms/beer and bouncy castle have featured largely in Duncan Hollys daily reports, it remains that there are a percentage of BA CC that are on strike.
In 4 days time they (the striker population) have to move forward or WW (with the backing of the BA board and the vast majority of other employees) will determine their future for them.
The 'daily mail' may well be pro BA, but I do not see any newspaper that is pro Bassa/unite, other than the 'socialist'. Could this be because Bassa/unite have no case to fight?
Maybe the ballot could demand that BA provides the samosas at BFC
In 4 days time they (the striker population) have to move forward or WW (with the backing of the BA board and the vast majority of other employees) will determine their future for them.
The 'daily mail' may well be pro BA, but I do not see any newspaper that is pro Bassa/unite, other than the 'socialist'. Could this be because Bassa/unite have no case to fight?
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Interesting that as this strike is on the verge of coming to end that the Cabin Crew thread is now experiencing multiple strikers posting how everyone just needs to get along, that the strikers feel threatened, discussion of the strike issues during duty would be a good thing, etc., etc..
Amazing manipulation while they plot how next to damage the airline.
Amazing manipulation while they plot how next to damage the airline.