Oversize passengers - neighbours rights?
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@abusingthesky:
I'm with you on this one. All the way. Interesting how the airlines will charge you extra for check-in baggage which is "overweight" but not for a fattie who is obese.
I did get a kick out of your reference to a diet coke after scoffing down vast amounts
of fattie food!!!!
I'm with you on this one. All the way. Interesting how the airlines will charge you extra for check-in baggage which is "overweight" but not for a fattie who is obese.
I did get a kick out of your reference to a diet coke after scoffing down vast amounts
of fattie food!!!!
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Oversize passengers - neighbours' rights?
On the odd occasion that I have found myself checking in "overweight" luggage (or when my +/- 42 kg grandchild was doing same), if the check-in agent mentioned the fact that the luggage was overweight, I remarked that that may well be the case, but that I/she/we were N-O-T!!
Worked for us!!
Worked for us!!
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rgbrock1
Why don't you FedEx yourself?
That way you could be sure that no obese person is pulling one over on you
, yuo pay by weight for freight.
Strange how this topic brings out different thoughts, when i see a very obese person getting on to a plane, my immediate thought is 'thank goodness I'm not like that', not 'that person is ripping me off.'
Takes all sorts to make a world I suppose.
Why don't you FedEx yourself?
That way you could be sure that no obese person is pulling one over on you
, yuo pay by weight for freight.Strange how this topic brings out different thoughts, when i see a very obese person getting on to a plane, my immediate thought is 'thank goodness I'm not like that', not 'that person is ripping me off.'
Takes all sorts to make a world I suppose.
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@F3G:
When I see an obese person I do not think to myself "that person is ripping me off".
I think to myself "I hope s/he is not going to be sitting next to me." Which usually results in that same obese person sitting next to me. So, instead of FEDEX-ing myself
next time I fly perhaps I'll use some "reverse psychology" and think to myself "I really hope tubby over there is going to sit next to me." Hey, it might work!
When I see an obese person I do not think to myself "that person is ripping me off".
I think to myself "I hope s/he is not going to be sitting next to me." Which usually results in that same obese person sitting next to me. So, instead of FEDEX-ing myself
next time I fly perhaps I'll use some "reverse psychology" and think to myself "I really hope tubby over there is going to sit next to me." Hey, it might work!
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If an airline has the attitude that you have to pay for a seat regardless of who/what is spilling into it, an unofficial check-in policy might be helpful - perhaps all passengers who look like they may not be effectively bounded by the armrests (and any particularly rude ones) could be assigned to a particular row?
Row 13 maybe, or - more sensibly - somewhere near the CofG for that aircraft type.
Any "overspill" could therefore be counteracted from the adjacent seat.
Pity about the last person in the queue when the only seat left is 13E in a 10-wide layout...
Row 13 maybe, or - more sensibly - somewhere near the CofG for that aircraft type.
Any "overspill" could therefore be counteracted from the adjacent seat.
Pity about the last person in the queue when the only seat left is 13E in a 10-wide layout...
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rgbroack
I can certainly buy into that
Maybe there is a good business opportunity for a manufacturer of cosmetic lesions and boils, so that slim pax can cover their facewith these and put off anyone form sitting next to them?
LiSrt
Mmmmmm. Your cunning plan might encounter problems on Lufty SeatGuru Seat Map Lufthansa Airbus A321 (321)
I can certainly buy into that
Maybe there is a good business opportunity for a manufacturer of cosmetic lesions and boils, so that slim pax can cover their facewith these and put off anyone form sitting next to them?
LiSrt
Mmmmmm. Your cunning plan might encounter problems on Lufty SeatGuru Seat Map Lufthansa Airbus A321 (321)
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@F3G:
I like the business opportunity you've proposed. I might just look into this BUT it would require some capital expenditure which I do not at the moment have.
However, I have pondered an alternative.
The evening before a flight, from henceforth, I am going to eat copious amounts of beans, burritos and eggs and drink the nastiest American beer I can find (Miller beer comes foremost to mind). Then, when an obese citizen of this planet sits next to me well, let the fireworks begin!!!!
I bet they ask to be moved to another seat!
I like the business opportunity you've proposed. I might just look into this BUT it would require some capital expenditure which I do not at the moment have.
However, I have pondered an alternative.
The evening before a flight, from henceforth, I am going to eat copious amounts of beans, burritos and eggs and drink the nastiest American beer I can find (Miller beer comes foremost to mind). Then, when an obese citizen of this planet sits next to me well, let the fireworks begin!!!!
I bet they ask to be moved to another seat!
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rgbroack
That reminds of the story about a guy in a bar who is suffering from severe flatulence, so he times his outbursts to coincide with noisy part of the music.
He can't undertstand why everyone is looking at him in a strange way, until he realises he is listening to his iPod.
That reminds of the story about a guy in a bar who is suffering from severe flatulence, so he times his outbursts to coincide with noisy part of the music.
He can't undertstand why everyone is looking at him in a strange way, until he realises he is listening to his iPod.
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F3G:
Good one that!!!!!!!!! I do the same when my "colleagues" here at work become so verbose that their lips start beating their faces to death. I time accordingly. Funny thing is, both sounds are very similar.
Good one that!!!!!!!!! I do the same when my "colleagues" here at work become so verbose that their lips start beating their faces to death. I time accordingly. Funny thing is, both sounds are very similar.
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This is what needs to be addressed
Fat people will now get two seats for the price of one on flights within Canada | Mail Online
How many would like the same SLF next to you
How many would like the same SLF next to you
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James 1077 well I have learnt something today and F3G you are so right. I would have needed a crystal ball to be aware of this "policy" 
Unfortunately so would most pax unless they thought to ask the question which this one obviously did as it was on the FAQ link. Unless I have missed this when looking it is not on the terms and conditions of carriage either but hardly anybody reads these anyway. All I have ever been told in training is that obese pax have the "option" to purchase an extra seat if they feel they cannot fit into the one provided.
easyjet are very clear on these pax sitting at the emergency exit rows but that is all. Not all airlines are so emphatic re this as I witnessed for myself the other day despite what is quoted in this link.
EZY are obviously putting the onus on the pax to flag up if they are obese so EZY don't have to tell them they are. As most pax don't the first EZY will probably know about at is at the gate especially if pax has checked in on line. The gate agent I can assure you will happlily leave this one to the CC to handle.
Can I just give those of average preportions a hint on here? Read easyjet's T&C's on denied boarding and what you can expect from them if you are denied your allocated "space" which I would assume is your designated seat width.....just a thourght because I bet most airlines have the same buried deep in the small print nobody ever reads
I wonder if anyone has ever put this to the test? All I would say is don't get offloaded because of your conduct in this situation however frustrated you may feel.
Boardingpass..... SCCM looks at Captain who looks back and both draw a blank!! Thank heavens I have never had this situation.....ever. I do try my best to deal with situations in the cabin within the limited resources we have as CC but sometimes you need to pass upwards to the Commander of that flight who will make a decision. As an SCCM I am not too proud to admit I have run out of options or even at times I don't know what to do next....none of us are so senior we cannot learn on a daily basis.
Captains who are in command make decisions......it's what they are trained and experienced to do. I have yet to meet one who can't thankfully. Can you imagine at 37,000 feet with a fire on board and blank stares between the Captain and FO on what to do.....Oh I know I'll ask ATC. I can't get a signal on the cell phone to operation's
Unfortunately so would most pax unless they thought to ask the question which this one obviously did as it was on the FAQ link. Unless I have missed this when looking it is not on the terms and conditions of carriage either but hardly anybody reads these anyway. All I have ever been told in training is that obese pax have the "option" to purchase an extra seat if they feel they cannot fit into the one provided.
easyjet are very clear on these pax sitting at the emergency exit rows but that is all. Not all airlines are so emphatic re this as I witnessed for myself the other day despite what is quoted in this link.
EZY are obviously putting the onus on the pax to flag up if they are obese so EZY don't have to tell them they are. As most pax don't the first EZY will probably know about at is at the gate especially if pax has checked in on line. The gate agent I can assure you will happlily leave this one to the CC to handle.
Can I just give those of average preportions a hint on here? Read easyjet's T&C's on denied boarding and what you can expect from them if you are denied your allocated "space" which I would assume is your designated seat width.....just a thourght because I bet most airlines have the same buried deep in the small print nobody ever reads
I wonder if anyone has ever put this to the test? All I would say is don't get offloaded because of your conduct in this situation however frustrated you may feel.Boardingpass..... SCCM looks at Captain who looks back and both draw a blank
!! Thank heavens I have never had this situation.....ever. I do try my best to deal with situations in the cabin within the limited resources we have as CC but sometimes you need to pass upwards to the Commander of that flight who will make a decision. As an SCCM I am not too proud to admit I have run out of options or even at times I don't know what to do next....none of us are so senior we cannot learn on a daily basis.Captains who are in command make decisions......it's what they are trained and experienced to do. I have yet to meet one who can't thankfully. Can you imagine at 37,000 feet with a fire on board and blank stares between the Captain and FO on what to do.....Oh I know I'll ask ATC. I can't get a signal on the cell phone to operation's
Last edited by lowcostdolly; 25th Sep 2009 at 10:44.
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I have not been able to find a Ryanair policy about this matter, but the company does offer two ways of securing extra space
Ryanair - FAQS : Can I purchase an extra seat for a large person?
Ryanair - FAQS : Can I check-in a musical instrument or purchase an extra seat to carry it in the cabin?
Ryanair - FAQS : Can I purchase an extra seat for a large person?
Ryanair - FAQS : Can I check-in a musical instrument or purchase an extra seat to carry it in the cabin?
Pity that the sample boarding card illustration for the second link was incorrect. It bothers me when airlines just can't get the details quite right.
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Dolly, I wasn't talking about SEPs. If you're on the ground and you're trying to work out if you can carry someone or in the example given you've got a fatso taking up two seats... there's no harm calling Operations. I've been in the flight deck a couple of times with the Capt on the phone seeking clarification on one issue or another.
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Hi BP I wasn't talking about SEP's originally either mate. I used them as a comparison because I actually could'nt quite believe what you had suggested in your post but maybe I misunderstood you?.
I was still working on the scenario posed by F3G.....the all things equal, no seats etc one and also the lack of comms from my company on our apparent "policy" which as yet is to be entered on the T&C's of carriage never mind communicated formally to the CC
Thankfully in the years I have been flying the times I have actually had to deal with this sensitive issue have been few and have usually been resolved by relocation of available seats, good will, compromise etc.
I have done one offload that I can recall due to this reason and yes it was my "recomendation" to the Captain who went with this. At the risk of being not PC here "Thinny" had been very offensive to "Fatty" on boarding. I couldn't relocate "Thinny" who then had a choice for her approx 50 minute flight to AMS from LGW which apparently was for an "important meeting". She could either sit down and fasten her seatbelt (captains instructions and covered by the ANO's) or carry on kicking off on doors closing. She chose the latter so off she went I'm afraid. that's why I said in my post "don't get offloaded because of your conduct......"
What customer services did to sweep up after this I don't know and niether do I really care! OTP was achieved to the satisfaction of most pax and I suspect all my managers!!
In the all things equal scenario (unlikely but possible) i.e all pax behaving reasonably/cordiallythen it's buck passed to the person with the most gold bars I'm afraid....he/she is paid the most to take any flack for decisions made!!
Sorry if I misunderstood your post boardingpass
. I used them as a comparison because I actually could'nt quite believe what you had suggested in your post but maybe I misunderstood you?.I was still working on the scenario posed by F3G.....the all things equal, no seats etc one and also the lack of comms from my company on our apparent "policy" which as yet is to be entered on the T&C's of carriage never mind communicated formally to the CC
Thankfully in the years I have been flying the times I have actually had to deal with this sensitive issue have been few and have usually been resolved by relocation of available seats, good will, compromise etc.
I have done one offload that I can recall due to this reason and yes it was my "recomendation" to the Captain who went with this. At the risk of being not PC here "Thinny" had been very offensive to "Fatty" on boarding. I couldn't relocate "Thinny" who then had a choice for her approx 50 minute flight to AMS from LGW which apparently was for an "important meeting". She could either sit down and fasten her seatbelt (captains instructions and covered by the ANO's) or carry on kicking off on doors closing. She chose the latter so off she went I'm afraid. that's why I said in my post "don't get offloaded because of your conduct......"
What customer services did to sweep up after this I don't know and niether do I really care! OTP was achieved to the satisfaction of most pax and I suspect all my managers!!
In the all things equal scenario (unlikely but possible) i.e all pax behaving reasonably/cordiallythen it's buck passed to the person with the most gold bars I'm afraid....he/she is paid the most to take any flack for decisions made!!
Sorry if I misunderstood your post boardingpass
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I´m currently on holiday with Mrs 37 and we´ve found a little bar/cafeteria where we enjoy a couple of wines before heading off for dinner in our hotel. This bar is next door to a small Chinese restaurant which does a buffet on the patio for €8. Last night a couple sat down there, no nationalities mentioned. He was at least 25 stones (125Kgs) and his good lady not a lot less. Could have been a medical condition they shared I thought, might as well give them the benefit of the doubt. As Mrs 37 and I were leaving after about 20 minutes the pair in question were on their fourth plateful, and not small ones at that. The thought of being sat next to this pair or,God forbid, between them, would make me suicidal. As it was, the restaurant owner was close to falling on his sword.
It was a great relief to know they were definitely not on the same return flight as us as they certainly did not live in the same country.
It was a great relief to know they were definitely not on the same return flight as us as they certainly did not live in the same country.
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I agree with F3G that it takes all sorts to make a world.
There are many excellent well thought through posts on this thread for such a sensitive subject and whilst I respect the rights of everyone to express their personal opinion, unfortunately the underlying tone of a minority of posts in my opinion, is discriminatory at worse or just downright ignorant at best.
My first flight as a passenger was over 50 years ago and from the mid 60's spent over 35 years of regular air travel mostly on business and for the past 10 years, leisure only.
In that time I can honestly say that I have never been inconvenienced by an obese passenger. Not even one one single occasion.
However, I can categorically state that when travelling economy, I am inconvenienced more often than not by the non-obese passenger sat in the centre of a block of three seats.
The width of an economy seat can be as small as 16". Some are 17" and if you are really lucky maybe 18". Add to this say 2" to the centre of each armrest (1" each side). Now take the dimension across the back from elbow to elbow of an average male when seated (whatever you may consider average) and you will be surprised. Even the most average of average male passenger seated in a centre seat will encroach on the space of adjacent passengers either at elbow or shoulder level.
I have no doubt that your personal space will be invaded if you are unfortunate enough to be seated next to an obese person irrespective of the seat location. However, it is my contention that the chances of your personal space being invaded by an average person seated in a centre seat are much greater.
If a system of refunds were to be introduced for passengers whose personal space was invaded then I feel sure that most passengers would qualify.
There are many excellent well thought through posts on this thread for such a sensitive subject and whilst I respect the rights of everyone to express their personal opinion, unfortunately the underlying tone of a minority of posts in my opinion, is discriminatory at worse or just downright ignorant at best.
My first flight as a passenger was over 50 years ago and from the mid 60's spent over 35 years of regular air travel mostly on business and for the past 10 years, leisure only.
In that time I can honestly say that I have never been inconvenienced by an obese passenger. Not even one one single occasion.
However, I can categorically state that when travelling economy, I am inconvenienced more often than not by the non-obese passenger sat in the centre of a block of three seats.
The width of an economy seat can be as small as 16". Some are 17" and if you are really lucky maybe 18". Add to this say 2" to the centre of each armrest (1" each side). Now take the dimension across the back from elbow to elbow of an average male when seated (whatever you may consider average) and you will be surprised. Even the most average of average male passenger seated in a centre seat will encroach on the space of adjacent passengers either at elbow or shoulder level.
I have no doubt that your personal space will be invaded if you are unfortunate enough to be seated next to an obese person irrespective of the seat location. However, it is my contention that the chances of your personal space being invaded by an average person seated in a centre seat are much greater.
If a system of refunds were to be introduced for passengers whose personal space was invaded then I feel sure that most passengers would qualify.
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Obese air passenger in economy seat has picture taken - Telegraph
I suppose the overwing exits could be a bit tight
I suppose the overwing exits could be a bit tight
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I was wondering what is thought of this idea:
What if people people purchased a ticket based on weight including baggage allowed? IE person and bag stand on a scale and if they are over "average" they pay more?
I'm a smaller person and am limited to bags with a certain weight. Given I'm at least 50 lbs less than the average - why am I charged extra when one bag is 5 lbs over?
The other point for this idea is that perhaps if people paid by weight, then it would be possible for airlines to make the seating more comfortable for all passengers.
Just an idea since I hate having to check two bags because one might be a few pounds over and now I'll get charged. I do understand that the weight restriction is also for the baggage handlers, but jeez.... when I see people who weigh twice what I do check two bags just under the limit and I have one bag 5 pounds over and get charged I have to wonder. It has to be cheaper to fly a light person with no bags to their destination as opposed to an obese person with checked baggage.
The other thing I want to say is that it's not always larger size pax that spill into neighbouring seats. I've had a few occasions where someone decides to read the paper spread out or will spread their feet into my space because they won't put their stuff in the overhead.
What if people people purchased a ticket based on weight including baggage allowed? IE person and bag stand on a scale and if they are over "average" they pay more?
I'm a smaller person and am limited to bags with a certain weight. Given I'm at least 50 lbs less than the average - why am I charged extra when one bag is 5 lbs over?
The other point for this idea is that perhaps if people paid by weight, then it would be possible for airlines to make the seating more comfortable for all passengers.
Just an idea since I hate having to check two bags because one might be a few pounds over and now I'll get charged. I do understand that the weight restriction is also for the baggage handlers, but jeez.... when I see people who weigh twice what I do check two bags just under the limit and I have one bag 5 pounds over and get charged I have to wonder. It has to be cheaper to fly a light person with no bags to their destination as opposed to an obese person with checked baggage.
The other thing I want to say is that it's not always larger size pax that spill into neighbouring seats. I've had a few occasions where someone decides to read the paper spread out or will spread their feet into my space because they won't put their stuff in the overhead.