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MERGED: Jetstar Pilot Cadet Program

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MERGED: Jetstar Pilot Cadet Program

Old 9th Apr 2014, 04:36
  #341 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: the moon (i was the 8th man there, first with a moustache)
Posts: 19
Flyboat, I am certain that you're sitting at home having a good old laugh at idiots like me who keep responding to you as you continue to take the piss. With that in mind however, for the benefit of the newbies who may actually believe you, we must press on beating our heads against this wall for the benefit of mankind.

You obviously know a little bit about the cadetships, and good on you for knowing what you've signed up for. I must admit, at the age of 38, a cadetship is a pretty intelligent way to go to fly a jet if that's what, between big your undoubtedly big watch and shiny (mint condition for a 1995 model) mx5, gets you off.

The rest of what you're saying however is exactly what you've convinced yourself to believe in order to continue on, blinkers on, through your cadetship - and that's what we all have a problem with. How can you possibly comment on GA having never been there? How can you tell others that financial gain is more important than life skill building and job satisfaction? Most importantly, how can you tell others your chosen path is better than theirs?

GA isn't a means to end. Had you spent any time there, you'll see there are careers in every part of GA. Do they suit you? Probably not. Can you tell others they don't suit them? Absolutely not.

Airlines are simply another part of the aviation industry, as is GA, as is freight, as is corporate aviation and on and on. Airlines attract certain types (not all!) usually due to extrinsic factors such as status, image and wealth. GA attracts others for more intrinsic reasons - the love of the grass roots aviation, the desire to teach, the desire to help and the desire to come home every night - exponentially different from what you believe which is simply a place for people who aren't intelligent or good enough to get into the airlines.

At the age of 38 I'd hope you'd be a bit wiser than what your posts are leading us to believe, I think deep down we all hope you're a 17 year old kid who logs onto PPRuNe between rubbing one out and sticking photos of A380s on your facebook page. In which case, very well played sir.

Please continue to comment with the facts of cadetships, however don't again comment on things you know absolutely nothing about. People actually come here for help, and you're not helping.

For the record, I spent 5 years in GA before joining the airlines. I now fly a 737 for a big Australian airline and have done so successfully for several years. I have two degrees, one is a Master's. I am soon going back to GA for lifestyle and job satisfaction. I am 5 years younger than you. Explain that!
Bing Gordon is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 04:52
  #342 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 954
The vast majority of GA careers have long periods in the "slave" system at flying schools , where you man the reception full time, only get paid for flying hours - how wonderful providing free labor to a business owner, or on the "casual list" at a charter company, or working for free tossing jumpers.
Not true. I've never worked in a company that hasn't paid the office rat. Most skydiving places pay something these days, the ones that don't have bigger issues than that and when I worked casual charter they were very good at sharing the hours relatively evenly and understanding you were juggling 2 jobs.

FBN, we get it you are really happy with your decision to "go direct to the jet". Good for you. Please do share your experience so the next generation can understand it.

BUT PLEASE, you clearly have no experience of the GA path so let those of us who have that experience share it as well without it being rubbished by a bloke who hasn't been there and done it!
mcgrath50 is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 04:59
  #343 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Melbourne
Age: 44
Posts: 180
Wow Bing you were one of the "special" people the single figure % who got to an jet job (FO) in five years from GA.

Sure you did , I believe you , we all believe you

And now you will leave a big 737 job , a big important job earning $150K to return to GA

Sure you would, that is so believable , people do that all the time because GA is so wonderful

Happy to be you $100 that you have never flown a Boeing 737 ,that you don't work for a "big major Australian airline", and that you do not hold two undergraduate degrees and a masters degrees.
Flyboat North is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 05:35
  #344 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Enzed
Posts: 2,208
Flyboast North, I hope you have an equally large chip on the other shoulder otherwise you would walk with a big limp.

Please appraise us poor plebs with your level of flying experience.
27/09 is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 05:35
  #345 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Melbourne
Age: 44
Posts: 180
Well Bing wanted to meet up, very quick to send a PM was Bing

I am happy to do that but I think Bing does good talk , quite a smart mouth really, but not so good on the delivery side of the equation

Just an all round mega success guy, such a mega success guy that he has to tell everyone about it on a BB, real secure there !

Wow seems everyone who posts here just had a dream success story in GA, full employment , full pay - long way from reality as we all know
Flyboat North is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 05:40
  #346 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Enzed
Posts: 2,208
Flyboast North: Wow seems everyone who posts here just had a dream success story in GA, full employment , full pay - long way from reality as we all know
No I don't know. Perhaps you could tell us your experience as you seem to know so much about the reality of GA. What have you done? What are you doing now?
27/09 is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 05:47
  #347 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 3rd rock from the sun
Posts: 1,582
I'm surprised mods haven't deleted this guy.

Why guys?
morno is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 06:48
  #348 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: YMMB
Age: 54
Posts: 697
I don't seem to recall any former cadets here bagging cadetships. This is telling.

FlyboatNorth's comments seem well-informed to me.
peterc005 is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 07:05
  #349 (permalink)  
tmpffisch
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FlyboatNorth's comments seem well-informed to me.
He/She/It has THE MOST uninformed view of GA I've ever heard!!!

Probably don't get any former cadets here because after not making it; they've left the industry.
 
Old 9th Apr 2014, 08:48
  #350 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 954
Cadets in GA tend not to advertise their background for fear they will be tarred with the same brush as the likes of FBN! Rightly or wrongly its much easier to get a job in GA when you delete "cadet" off your resume.
mcgrath50 is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 09:18
  #351 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 55
Cards on the Table FBN

I'd be interested in FBN's past experience and current situation as it might add some weight to his otherwise slanted views...

HR
Humbly Reserved is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 09:57
  #352 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: south pacific vagrant
Posts: 1,309
fbn

320 commands at 5 years is long gone.

10 years to a 330 command is self delusion.

when joyce and the money is gone and the qf boys come over for the mou spots it will be 15 years or more. just like its always ever been.

jq has stopped expanding. give it some thought
waren9 is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 10:08
  #353 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: YMMB
Age: 54
Posts: 697
I've met more than twenty Jetstar cadets who passed thru OAA/CAE. They all seemed to say pretty much the same thing, that OAA was a bit disorganised, but that it worked out for them and they are happy with the end result.

These twenty Jetstar cadets were over at least four intakes and it seems like the course has a completion rate of more than 90%, which is much higher than alternatives.

I've also known Sharp and Rex cadets and their experience and outlook seems similar.

The impression is that because the cadetships are selective entry, 2% to 3% of applicants for Jetstar, they get the cream of the crop.

A few times I've spoken with cadets whose attitude and dedication stands out. Things like massive amounts of pre-preparation, motivation and work ethic.
peterc005 is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 11:27
  #354 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 139
The impression is that because the cadetships are selective entry, 2% to 3% of applicants for Jetstar, they get the cream of the crop.

A few times I've spoken with cadets whose attitude and dedication stands out. Things like massive amounts of pre-preparation, motivation and work ethic.
Some of the ones I've seen were like this others couldn't give a rats ass.
Lindstrim is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 13:15
  #355 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 954
A few times I've spoken with cadets whose attitude and dedication stands out. Things like massive amounts of pre-preparation, motivation and work ethic.
You've just described all professional pilots mate!
mcgrath50 is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 13:49
  #356 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 102
A few times I've spoken with cadets whose attitude and dedication stands out. Things like massive amounts of pre-preparation, motivation and work ethic.
Like the work ethic that has them calling in sick on early flights on a Sunday or the massive amounts of pre-preparation they do when going to Ballina. Like Paul Kelly said "special people..... special people"
Lookleft is offline  
Old 9th Apr 2014, 13:49
  #357 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 3rd rock from the sun
Posts: 1,582
Peterc is another one who I would place in the same category as FBN. Has about 463 posts, 463 of them are praising Jetstar cadets, that's it.

Where's the real opinion from those in Jetstar who have to work with these cadets?

morno
morno is offline  
Old 10th Apr 2014, 09:06
  #358 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 47
News from CAE Oxford
The August 2014 course intake will not be required to be delivered according to Jetstar Australia’s recruitment forecast;
March 2015 is yet to be confirmed, but with the August 2014 applicants being transferred over to March 2015, if there is a March 15 course, competition will be far greater.
FLGOFF is offline  
Old 10th Apr 2014, 09:14
  #359 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Aus
Posts: 44
Peter,
can you tell me again how you've met several Jetstar cadets, they're all cream of the crop but complain about the training... Just in case I forget in three posts.

I've met more than twenty Jetstar cadets who passed thru OAA/CAE. They all seemed to say pretty much the same thing, that OAA was a bit disorganised, but that it worked out for them and they are happy with the end result.
I've met and spoken with more than a dozen Jetstar cadets and former cadets now flying the A320.

They all say pretty much the same thing.

1) OAA/CAE is disorganised and you need to be on the ball to push thru
2) The Jetstar cadetship is pretty much what is advertised
3) Probably 90% of cadets who start the course end up flying for Jetstar
4) They are happy with the deal and the way things turned out for them
I've met Jetstar cadets from four or five courses, and from what I can tell about 90% complete the training and I haven't heard of one to completed not getting a job.

The former cadets now flying for Jetstar regularly complain about OAA/Swinburne being a bit disorganised, but seem generally happy with the deal they got.

If you were a young guy keen on the airlines and got offered a similar cadetship you'd be mad not to jump at the opportunity.
I've known about a dozen people who've done the Jetstar Cadetship in the past few years.

They were all generally positive about it, although a couple said they thought the Virgin Cadetship was better.
Speaking to some of the Jetstar cadets it appears the biggest problem is that OAA has become too big and disorganised. I also guess all of the ownership changes going from GFS to OAA to CAE in a few years wouldn't help.
Over the past couple of years I've met about a dozen current or former Jetstar Cadets.

They all seems pretty enthusiastic and motivated.

The two complaints I heard were:

* OAA was a bit disorganised about the flying, and the cadets had to compensate for this by being a bit more motivated and pushing harder to get the training done.

* There was little or none contact between Jetstar and the cadets during the training.

I've met a dozen current and former Jetstar cadets.

None suggested that anything significant was misrepresented.

Any gripes they had are probably due to minor mismanagement, rather than misrepresentation.
I've known a few Jetstar cadets over the years, and recently met a small group who had just finished at OAA Moorabbin and were waiting to go to the UK for their A320 Type Ratings.

While they complained a bit about OAA being a bit disorganised, they seemed very positive about the outcome.

My understanding is that for the first year they go on some type of "flex-contract", where they are more casual than full-time permanent.
Regards
Damien1989 is offline  
Old 10th Apr 2014, 10:25
  #360 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: YMMB
Age: 54
Posts: 697
@Damien1989 - I fly out of YMMB and in the past did some training with General Flying Services, which is now part of OAA/CAE.

Over the years I've met quite a few from this place, including a couple of ex-Swinburne OAA/CAE instructors I've flown with. Also meet and see people around at places like the AeroBar.

My older son runs an A320 Sim business. I have met a couple of groups of Jetstar cadets who have spent time in the sim prior to leaving for England for their A320 Type Ratings.

When the former cadets start at Jetstar they are on "flex contracts", which may mean fewer hours. Some buy time in the sim for extra A320 experience and to polish their skills and procedures.

One of the A320 Sim instructors is a recent Jetstar cadet who is now a First Officer on the A320. He is very happy with how things turned out. His level of professionalism, knowledge and attitude are very impressive.

Back to my earlier post, I don't recall hearing any former Jetstar cadet here on PPRuNe complaining?
peterc005 is offline  

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