Merged: QANTAS/ALAEA EBA
QF Management takes PIA on customers!
Latest notice issued by ALAEA: Qantas Management has opted for LAMEs to take 4 hour stop work meetings rather than allowing a 1 hour paid meeting for ALAEA Executives to feedback information to members about the EBA negotiations(on 29 and 30 May, next week). I just don’t understand it. The ALAEA offers to minimise disruption to Qantas customers by requesting a short, paid feedback meeting supported with skeleton crews to continue urgent work. Qantas Management refuses to approve this 1 hour paid feedback meeting in preference to a 4 hour unpaid stop work meeting. Its like Qantas Management are taking out their frustrations on their own customers. How does that work?!?! Is that some obscure piece of the Workchoices legislation????
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There's no point, judging by the tone of their last few stories and their lack of interest in a balanced view I'm guessing QF have used the ad budget threat to rein them in.
So far ABC ( no ads - what a coincidence) are the only ones giving it any coverage and a pretty balanced view.
So far ABC ( no ads - what a coincidence) are the only ones giving it any coverage and a pretty balanced view.
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If you try to think the way QF management might think, they might insist on the four hour stop works so as to allow them to get their scabs in the door.
See they're still advertising for them in the Australian today.
See they're still advertising for them in the Australian today.
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A Fair Go
Qantas shares $2.10 per share less than May 2007 , that’s -32.2%.
Qantas fares up 7% Domestic and up 6.5% International.
The ordinary travelling public and shareholders are losing faith in the service and reliability of our company, of which we all used to be proud and gave that extra little bit to, when it was needed.
Mr Dixon,
Do you think that you can keep making the public pay higher fares and still keep travelling with an airline, where staff at all levels are so demoralised with their, lack of job satisfaction, esteem and prospects for the future that they now just don’t care and will not give that bit extra.
All brought about solely by a management team that just cannot see reality.
Mr Howard and the Liberal Party still won’t admit.
The ONE and ONLY reason that they are not still in power, is because of the ordinary working people’s revulsion at the AWA”s and workchoices debacle.
A FAIR GO.
IS ALL THAT PEOPLE ARE ASKING FOR
It is an Australian Imperitive and if we don’t get it we will rebel.
I wonder if anyone is learning anything by their mistakes.
Mr DIXON
GET REAL AND GET FAIR,
OR GO THE SAME WAY AS JOHN HOWARD
Qantas fares up 7% Domestic and up 6.5% International.
The ordinary travelling public and shareholders are losing faith in the service and reliability of our company, of which we all used to be proud and gave that extra little bit to, when it was needed.
Mr Dixon,
Do you think that you can keep making the public pay higher fares and still keep travelling with an airline, where staff at all levels are so demoralised with their, lack of job satisfaction, esteem and prospects for the future that they now just don’t care and will not give that bit extra.
All brought about solely by a management team that just cannot see reality.
Mr Howard and the Liberal Party still won’t admit.
The ONE and ONLY reason that they are not still in power, is because of the ordinary working people’s revulsion at the AWA”s and workchoices debacle.
A FAIR GO.
IS ALL THAT PEOPLE ARE ASKING FOR
It is an Australian Imperitive and if we don’t get it we will rebel.
I wonder if anyone is learning anything by their mistakes.
Mr DIXON
GET REAL AND GET FAIR,
OR GO THE SAME WAY AS JOHN HOWARD
Last edited by Take five; 28th Jun 2008 at 10:30. Reason: Typo
"Howard and the Liberal Party still won’t admit that the ONE and ONLY reason they are not still in power, is because of the ordinary working people’s revulsion at the AWA”s and workchoices debacle. A fair go is all that the people want and when they don’t get it they rebel."
You're dreaming if you think the industrial relations scene is going to change!
Welcome to the new World of same, same industrial law. Only interest rates, fuel prices and home interest rates will change!
Upwards!
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Mr Dixon's mob have backed them selves into a corner now.
Aircraft being parked with no departure dates because of the lack of staff.
Pax staring at empty departure gates wondering where their aircraft is.
Not a single engineer on strike but still nothing to fly on.
Pity help them if the engineers do take 4 hours off to discuss their
future.... 4 hours!
Hope those old pommy scabs are ready to scramble.
They have been grouped up in cold storage for 6 months earning $100,000.00 to watch cable TV ,
contracts coming to an end, no work yet.
God, that is a great way to waste $150 MILLION Dollars.
Aircraft being parked with no departure dates because of the lack of staff.
Pax staring at empty departure gates wondering where their aircraft is.
Not a single engineer on strike but still nothing to fly on.
Pity help them if the engineers do take 4 hours off to discuss their
future.... 4 hours!
Hope those old pommy scabs are ready to scramble.
They have been grouped up in cold storage for 6 months earning $100,000.00 to watch cable TV ,
contracts coming to an end, no work yet.
God, that is a great way to waste $150 MILLION Dollars.
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PAF
Whatever.
Let's be honest like Geoff. Oh wait, the catalogue of lies is too long to list.
So let's be nice to the shareholders like Geoff. Oh wait, he nearly sold the company for a way under-valued $5.45 per share.
Ok, so let's be nice to the passengers and organise a 1 hour stop work meeting with skeleton crews to keep the place running while the union keeps us informed of progress. Oh wait, the company has denied us permission and wants us to take a 4 hour stop work meeting.
Let's be honest like Geoff. Oh wait, the catalogue of lies is too long to list.
So let's be nice to the shareholders like Geoff. Oh wait, he nearly sold the company for a way under-valued $5.45 per share.
Ok, so let's be nice to the passengers and organise a 1 hour stop work meeting with skeleton crews to keep the place running while the union keeps us informed of progress. Oh wait, the company has denied us permission and wants us to take a 4 hour stop work meeting.
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paf
No. I want to spend all my spare time with my family. E-mail doesn't cut it. I want face to face at work because it concerns work. I don't mix this ****e with family time.
If Dixon stopped talking diahorrea, i'm sure everyone will be well. This is pretty contageous.
How about you discuss it after work eh? Heard of e-mail?
That is not work to rule. That is wrong. If you think it's right, then e-mail the union and ask them to release a press release stating that 26 of 29 were ill that day. They won't and you all know why. "Blue Flu"
If Dixon stopped talking diahorrea, i'm sure everyone will be well. This is pretty contageous.
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Did someone fart? No, it's PAF again.
Now you're just being silly. How can 6 executive members have a DISCUSSION with, not BROADCAST to 1500 members? Act your age not your shoe size.
This dispute really has nothing to do with you. I feel terribly sorry for you that you have so little in your life that you have to barge into an engineers' forum to spout your vitriolic, irrelevant, illogical, rabidly ideological, dogmatic, ill-informed opinion that no-one here really cares about anyway. I mean what DO you hope to achieve?
When you have something RELEVANT to add to the forum, a fully informed, balanced, logical viewpoint please feel free to post here. Till then, go back to the boarding lounge and wait for your delayed aircraft. Go whinge to your ideological bosom buddies in the Captains Club. That's if they'll have you. That would be because you're beneath their attention. They're not going to thank you for your posts here.
I used to laugh at you. Now I just pity you. Get a life.
This dispute really has nothing to do with you. I feel terribly sorry for you that you have so little in your life that you have to barge into an engineers' forum to spout your vitriolic, irrelevant, illogical, rabidly ideological, dogmatic, ill-informed opinion that no-one here really cares about anyway. I mean what DO you hope to achieve?
When you have something RELEVANT to add to the forum, a fully informed, balanced, logical viewpoint please feel free to post here. Till then, go back to the boarding lounge and wait for your delayed aircraft. Go whinge to your ideological bosom buddies in the Captains Club. That's if they'll have you. That would be because you're beneath their attention. They're not going to thank you for your posts here.
I used to laugh at you. Now I just pity you. Get a life.
Why is QF choosing a four hour shutdown instead of a one hour paid meeting?
This is significant.
First of all what are passengers numbers like these days? Is volume down???
Way back in my former life before being at Ansett, I worked for an Oil company.
Occasionally, when there were refining problems, we literally "ran out" of petrol to deliver. So no work for about 40 tankers and about 120 drivers.
When this happened, the operations manager sometimes provoked the TWU into going on strike for a few days (this was the early 1970's, and they were very militant)......so we saved a few days wages.
I just wonder if QF has done exactly the same thing?
Or are they trying to weave a "story" about striking engineers for the media?
This is significant.
First of all what are passengers numbers like these days? Is volume down???
Way back in my former life before being at Ansett, I worked for an Oil company.
Occasionally, when there were refining problems, we literally "ran out" of petrol to deliver. So no work for about 40 tankers and about 120 drivers.
When this happened, the operations manager sometimes provoked the TWU into going on strike for a few days (this was the early 1970's, and they were very militant)......so we saved a few days wages.
I just wonder if QF has done exactly the same thing?
Or are they trying to weave a "story" about striking engineers for the media?
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QF bag chucker's at SIT asked for a 30 min stop work meeting a couple of months ago to discuss rostering changes.They wanted to meet in the afternoon when the workload was at it's low point. QF management refused so the bag chucker's walked out for 4 hrs. There followed all sorts of threats from management, even threats of huge individual fines........Nothing came of the management threats. the bag chucker's had their 4 hr meeting and the evening flights turned to sh1t !!
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Paf To Ignore List!
PAF,
Just before you are banished, I wish to make a parting appraisal. The lowest form of intellect used to stimulate argument is objective positioning. Individuals who utilise this method, such as yourself, interpret the short sharp responses recieved as validating their intelligence. This interpretation is akin to marvelling at the mind power of a mosquito and the stupidity of humans who swipe in a futile attempt to cease the irritation.
Now, in a nut shell you insect, 2000+ posts of non constructive sh*t stirring. You do not speak a differing view in the hope of contributing to a better outcome, you do so for reaction. Reaction that makes you feel important. Takes a special kind of individual to rack that up in there own time.
I am reasonably new to this and fully respect its addictive appeal. As such, I look forward to this PIA resolving itself so I may sign off from this site, hopefully never to return. You on the other hand, remain dedicated to the only cause that matters to you. Trying vainly to compensate for the lack of achievement in your life.
You could have tried being man enough in your hayday. I feel you may be the product of cockpit pecking order syndrome. You know it all too well, 'three birds in a cage', the two strongest take control, the third may as well just be along for the ride. How did procedure not protect you from feeling like you were inferior and insignificant?
Time has passed, as has life and opportunity, go get yourself a hobby, one that doesn't involve a computer.
Just before you are banished, I wish to make a parting appraisal. The lowest form of intellect used to stimulate argument is objective positioning. Individuals who utilise this method, such as yourself, interpret the short sharp responses recieved as validating their intelligence. This interpretation is akin to marvelling at the mind power of a mosquito and the stupidity of humans who swipe in a futile attempt to cease the irritation.
Now, in a nut shell you insect, 2000+ posts of non constructive sh*t stirring. You do not speak a differing view in the hope of contributing to a better outcome, you do so for reaction. Reaction that makes you feel important. Takes a special kind of individual to rack that up in there own time.
I am reasonably new to this and fully respect its addictive appeal. As such, I look forward to this PIA resolving itself so I may sign off from this site, hopefully never to return. You on the other hand, remain dedicated to the only cause that matters to you. Trying vainly to compensate for the lack of achievement in your life.
You could have tried being man enough in your hayday. I feel you may be the product of cockpit pecking order syndrome. You know it all too well, 'three birds in a cage', the two strongest take control, the third may as well just be along for the ride. How did procedure not protect you from feeling like you were inferior and insignificant?
Time has passed, as has life and opportunity, go get yourself a hobby, one that doesn't involve a computer.
Last edited by Acute Instinct; 24th May 2008 at 00:14.
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PAF
If you mean thread
Yes I did. I stand corrected. Thank you for pointing that out. When will you admit YOU’RE wrong?
I assert that what you do (Industrial Action) effects others. If that wasn't the case you would not be doing it. In fact the only reason engineer's are conducting such action is because it effects others. Yet you appear surprised that those "others" that are effected would wish to express a view. Quite illogical given that the entire Industrial Action thing is based upon placing an effect on others.
I appear surprised? Based on what? That only one genuine member of the travelling public (not including company trolls) has expressed a contrary view? And it happens to be you? That is hardly surprising, considering the content of many of your 2000 posts. Compare your posts to all the supportive posts we have received on this THREAD from flight attendants and pilots and people outside of the industry. Why do you bother? What pleasure or satisfaction do you derive from tilting at windmills in some quixotic crusade to teach us bad old LAMEs the error of our ways?
It still doesn’t change my opinion that you are sad and pathetic. I still can’t understand what you hope to achieve, beyond some kind of ego trip. Do you honestly think that you’re going to change any Qantas LAME’s opinion here? You’re not living it. You’re not working in the situation. You’re not experiencing the soul-destroying dilemma of working for a company you love (in many cases for decades), doing a job you love for a (temporary) management regime that you have watched gut a once proud and internationally respected engineering institution, for a wage that is below market rates, and losing money in an attempt to win a fairer outcome – an outcome, mind you, that was PROMISED us by the company years ago. May I remind you we took a pay freeze and we were promised to be looked after when times were good. Well, first there was a $500 million profit, then there was a $1 billion profit, now we’re heading for a $1.4 billion profit. Precisely how much better does it need to get before we should ask the company to deliver on its promises and share some of that wealth that we have worked so hard to create?
Further, a happy worker is a hard worker. We're unhappy. We have withdrawn our labour in the form of overtime. Just as you assert your right to express an opinion here, so I assert our right to refuse to work on our rostered days off in an expression of our opinion on how we have been treated. That is, we have gone backwards in real terms, as well as having to work well beyond what is reasonable with less of everything (logistics, manpower, training) just to keep aircraft in the air and mostly on time, while the company has raked in cash hand over fist and management have paid themselves obscene bonuses of between 30% and 50%. Where is the justice and fairness in that? This is Australia, after all, not the US of A or some feudal society of princes and serfs.
Why are YOU surprised that we have had enough and we're not taking it anymore?