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‘Stop choosing useless white male pilots’, RAF told

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‘Stop choosing useless white male pilots’, RAF told

Old 30th Jun 2023, 09:44
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Originally Posted by Exrigger
Thank you exrigger. I hope the lawyers don't take too big a slice of that.
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Old 30th Jun 2023, 09:47
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The MOD works on the basis that it is a law to itself. Precedents include its SCS confirming that issuing an order to suborn UK Military Airworthiness Regulations was lawful. A CS disobeying such an order was committing an offence. It even managed to pressure the HSE to continue with the prosecution of MBL in the face of unequivocal evidence that it was innocent of the charge. The rules are for little people.
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Old 30th Jun 2023, 10:55
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A back-peddle is better than nothing at all. Move on and just do the job you've been given to do. Leave the wokery to the idiot Marxists.
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Old 30th Jun 2023, 11:47
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Originally Posted by Auxtank
A back-peddle is better than nothing at all. Move on and just do the job you've been given to do. Leave the wokery to the idiot Marxists.
it’s exactly that attitude that allows these w**kers to get away with breaking the law time and time again. If this isn’t a case of bringing the RAF into disrepute I don’t know what is. Wigston and Byford need to be held to account for their racism! Because that is what it was.
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Old 30th Jun 2023, 12:40
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Originally Posted by Clunk60
it’s exactly that attitude that allows these w**kers to get away with breaking the law time and time again. If this isn’t a case of bringing the RAF into disrepute I don’t know what is. Wigston and Byford need to be held to account for their racism! Because that is what it was.
I fully agree with you. But how and who will do the holding to account?

One for the Defence Select Committee maybe?

Here you are;
  • Email: [email protected]
  • Phone: 020 7219 3113/6168 (General enquiries)
  • Address: Defence Committee, House of Commons, London SW1A 0AA
Now do something about it.

Last edited by Auxtank; 30th Jun 2023 at 12:55.
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Old 30th Jun 2023, 13:13
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Auxtank

I’m glad we agree. Thank you for the information, I already have Tobias Elwood’s details and will be contacting him to express in no uncertain terms how much harm has been done to the RAFs reputation, morale and operational effectiveness. As someone has already pointed out Wigston’s directed number one priority was sorting out the flying training debacle.
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Old 30th Jun 2023, 13:37
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Weasel words from Ben Wallace too. “ All those selected met the minimum standards” Undoubtedly true but what he does not say is that some of those not selected exceeded the minimum standards and despite this were not selected.

So mediocre candidates prioritised over good ones. The effect of this will ripple on though because every time you meet a female or BAME recruit from this era you’ll always wonder………..!

This will have a negative effect in so many ways on anyone from the above groups who genuinely made the cut.


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Old 1st Jul 2023, 09:42
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When I was in the "FF" there seemed to be 2 camps in R&S....those who wanted to push BAME at all costs and realists. This wasn't a new issue, my time period was 14-17 so it was bubbling then....we were repeatedly briefed anything we were asked to do was PA not PD, and nothing as blatant as this.

2*s loading courses, that was a job done by a team of Cpls normally!
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Old 1st Jul 2023, 11:54
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I wonder if this discrimination was restricted to the initial recruitment and training environment, or whether it extended to ongoing career opportunities or even promotions? I haven't seen anything reported to indicate this, but one wonders if the rabbit hole goes any deeper.
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Old 1st Jul 2023, 12:02
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Low, I would imagine the principle applies not only to pilots but all potential recruits and would extend to their entire careers. Limited by skin colour. I think Wigston did a lot of damage. I would never encourage my children to join up. Why join an organisation when you have the inherent disadvantage of being straight white and male?
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Old 1st Jul 2023, 15:09
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Smile

BOTR


Can’t you see?

This is all part of the master(can I say that?) plan. Clearly, the more WASPs who become disillusioned and give up, the sooner the ‘woke’ agendabendas succeed.

Allegedly.

😉

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Old 1st Jul 2023, 18:30
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Originally Posted by Low average
I wonder if this discrimination was restricted to the initial recruitment and training environment, or whether it extended to ongoing career opportunities or even promotions? I haven't seen anything reported to indicate this, but one wonders if the rabbit hole goes any deeper.
This stuff has been going on for years. Promotion boards with the bar set so only one gets through on merit, then others from a fair way down are 'pulled' as particularly suitable for role, thus leap frogging the guys who were well above them on the merit list. One of the key players in this debacle may or may not have benefitted from such shenanigans....
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Old 1st Jul 2023, 18:44
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Originally Posted by ASRAAMTOO
Weasel words from Ben Wallace too. “ All those selected met the minimum standards” Undoubtedly true but what he does not say is that some of those not selected exceeded the minimum standards and despite this were not selected.

So mediocre candidates prioritised over good ones. The effect of this will ripple on though because every time you meet a female or BAME recruit from this era you’ll always wonder………..!

This will have a negative effect in so many ways on anyone from the above groups who genuinely made the cut.
Precisely so. The RAF made such a trumpet blowing exercise when it first allowed females to enter flying training that some female UAS cadets in our unit decided they were having none of it and looked for careers elsewhere.
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Old 1st Jul 2023, 19:58
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Originally Posted by bugged on the right
Low, I would imagine the principle applies not only to pilots but all potential recruits and would extend to their entire careers. Limited by skin colour. I think Wigston did a lot of damage. I would never encourage my children to join up. Why join an organisation when you have the inherent disadvantage of being straight white and male?
I hear rumours that Wiggy sent back honours and awards citations for 2023 with “not enough females and not enough ethnic minorities”. You only need to look at the names, to see that those 2 groups have been over-represented compared to the actual ethnic and sex make up of the RAF. Even the profiles that were publicised were completely non-representative:

https://www.raf.mod.uk/news/articles...ours-profiles/

Just a reminder, in 2022 the RAF was 15.4% female and 3.5% from ethnic minority backgrounds. Now look back at that link again. There are 6 personnel listed - 3 are male and 3 are female (going by their appearance and name), then 2 are ethnic minority (by name and appearance). Thus not representative of the 84.6% males and 96.5% non-ethnic minority individuals that serve.

Now here is the full 2023 King’s Honours list: https://www.raf.mod.uk/news/articles...list-2023-raf/ and https://www.gov.uk/government/news/t...ours-list-2023 - let’s look at the male/female spilt:

CBEs : 1 male and 2 females
  • Air Commodore Anthony John BEASANT
  • Air Commodore Emily Jane FLYNN, OBE
  • Group Captain Sara Bridget MACKMIN

OBEs : 4 males and 4 females
  • Wing Commander Tracey Louise AFFLECK
  • Group Captain Leonie BOYD
  • Group Captain James Matthew CALVERT
  • Wing Commander Victoria Ann FULTON
  • Wing Commander Craig Robert LEDIEU, MBE
  • Wing Commander Anthony John LETT
  • Wing Commander Victoria Tuesday WILLIAMS
  • Wing Commander Jonathan Robert Gibson YOUNG
MBEs : 11 males and 5 females
  • Sergeant Matthew James BREESE
  • Squadron Leader David Gary COOPER
  • Warrant Officer Andrea Jane CULLEY
  • Chief Technician Martin Richard DARBON
  • Squadron Leader Elizabeth Margaret DAWSON
  • Squadron Leader Brendan Christopher DUNNE
  • Squadron Leader Robyn Elizabeth HACKWELL
  • Wing Commander Lorna Jayne HOBAN
  • Air Specialist 1 (now Acting Corporal) Prem Dorje LAMA
  • Squadron Leader William Anthony LEATHER
  • Sergeant Paul David MITCHELL
  • Squadron Leader Gary MONTGOMERY
  • Sergeant (now Acting Flight Sergeant) Robyn Caroline MUSCROFT-BLOOMFIELD
  • Squadron Leader Andrew SPOUR
  • Flight Lieutenant David Alexander TAYLOR
  • Squadron Leader Princejit Singh UBHI
So, in total, that is 16 males and 11 females - which is 59% male and 41% female. Now seeing as there are 84.6% male and 15.4% female, then how does that happen? Going on previous form it is likely to be positive discrimination! Then they wonder why only 18% have any form of trust left in the Senior Leadership since Wiggy has been in charge - a snippet from the latest AFCAS 2023.


It’s obviously a coincidence that 15.4% and 3.5% adds up to 18.9%…
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Old 1st Jul 2023, 20:45
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One was a staish of BZN (so fairly usual) and one raised £10k+ for charity (so again not unusual).

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Old 2nd Jul 2023, 09:11
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Well, if the below is true, then the discrimination may go much deeper. The difficulty would be in proving it.
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Old 3rd Jul 2023, 12:35
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Its not just the RAF.....

Royal Navy captains talk of pride at commanding training establishments (mod.uk)

Just to save people looking, the RN OF5 cadre had a circa 91/9 male/female split.
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Old 3rd Jul 2023, 13:42
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Perhaps women just do a better job than men?
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Old 3rd Jul 2023, 14:31
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Originally Posted by Ninthace
Perhaps women just do a better job than men?
IME, better in “people” roles.
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Old 3rd Jul 2023, 14:41
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You will be lucky with the defcom address, I could not get my mail delivered. As for Ellwood, I sent a long message re Herc retirement and have never received the courtesy of a reply/acknowledgement - useless pillocks.
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