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Russia Warns Sweden and Finland Against NATO Membership

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Russia Warns Sweden and Finland Against NATO Membership

Old 20th Oct 2022, 14:54
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Originally Posted by Asturias56
yeah but the Russians won in the end remember
It was a very different Finland in those days.

Seemingly Russia hasn't changed their conscription policies much since then...
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Old 20th Oct 2022, 19:13
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Not necessarily a fence for direct military purpose. If you were looking forward, to a time pehaps when the RF was breaking up, or in other internal turmoil, a fence near the practical border crossing points would at least give you some measure of control over a flow of West-bound refugees.

N
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Old 20th Oct 2022, 19:26
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The Swedish armed forces have asked the police for help in a 'situation' on the West Coast. Reports of drone activity over a military facility - Sveriges Radio
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Old 20th Oct 2022, 20:56
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Originally Posted by Bengo
Not necessarily a fence for direct military purpose. If you were looking forward, to a time pehaps when the RF was breaking up, or in other internal turmoil, a fence near the practical border crossing points would at least give you some measure of control over a flow of West-bound refugees.

N
this very much. The border itself is very well looked after already, not a squirrel crosses it without the Finns knowing it. Finnish border guards regularly share videos of immigrants like wild bores, bears and elks crossing the border.
Occasionally human beings try that as well but all are detained neverminding the crossing point.
The planned fence will be to contain a similar situation seen on the Poland/Belarus border with hundreds or thousands of people pushed towards the border by Belarusian officials.

Theres no point in fencing the entire border or make anything more robust as no one in their right mind would walk through tens of kilometers of Karelian forests to the border just to find themselves in the middle of Karelian forests either freezing in three feet of snow in the winter or being eaten by billions of mosquitoes in the summer while standing on a swamp up your loins. And still you'd be caught.

And for the same reason the Russkies would be rather adventurous trying to enter with military force out there. It would be more probable for them to succeed via roads than through the vastness of dense woods, deep swamps and plenty of lakes. However the roads are few and narrow. And surrounded by dense woods with local defenders.

When the SU broke up and especially during the coup there were serious concerns what should be done if there would've been a mass exodus towards west. This has been a scenario in the planning ever since although the politicians did a piss poor job in the early 21st century bowing towards Russia by signing the Ottawa treaty, allowing the Nord Stream, allowing russians to buy real estate from places they shouldn't have etc.

One may think what they will of PM Sanna Marin but she's really been a whirlwind of fresh air venting the relationship with Russia.
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Old 21st Oct 2022, 07:55
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Hard to believe hundreds off thousands of refugees will make it to the NW of Russia to cross the border when they can do it further south in a lot easier. But it does make sense to harden the border crossings because, as we all now, going through the woods is apoor option
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Old 22nd Oct 2022, 07:59
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Originally Posted by The Helpful Stacker
It was a very different Finland in those days.

Seemingly Russia hasn't changed their conscription policies much since then...
But at least Russian of the Winter war 1940 will recognize the equipment used by Vlad's storm troopers. In fact, they may need to check their museums to see how many exhibits are missing from WW-1, the civil war, & WW-2
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Old 22nd Oct 2022, 10:51
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Originally Posted by Beamr
Finnish border guards regularly share videos of immigrants like wild bores
Though happily most immigrants have interesting stories to tell.
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Old 22nd Oct 2022, 14:03
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Dave, Touché!!
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Old 22nd Oct 2022, 17:12
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Hungary has moved with the ratification and should be done by mid December.
That leaves Turkey alone opposing the memberships.

"Chief of staff to PM Viktor Orbán, said the expansion of NATO to include the two Nordic countries would be ratified by mid-December at the latest"


https://twitter.com/Faytuks/status/1583836522737856514
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Old 30th Oct 2022, 19:20
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Consequences….

Finland's PM does not rule out nuclear weapons or permanent Nato bases in Finland - YLE
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Old 4th Nov 2022, 11:23
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https://www.politico.eu/article/finl...ays-in-turkey/

NATO chief to Turkey: It’s time to admit Finland, Sweden

During a visit, Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg says the NATO applicants had fulfilled their deal with Turkey.

NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg on Thursday increased pressure on Turkey to green-light Sweden and Finland’s accession to the alliance, declaring during a visit to Istanbul that Stockholm and Helsinki “have delivered” and should be allowed in.

Officials from Turkey, Finland and Sweden signed a memorandum in June to pave the way for the two countries to address Turkish concerns regarding terrorism and arms exports, but Turkey — along with Hungary — has yet to sign off on their accession.

The delay has raised questions about Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan’s political strategy and whether he is using the issue of NATO accession as a bargaining chip in Ankara’s complex relationship with the United States, as well as to boost his own popularity at home.

Turkish officials’ rhetoric on the need to crack down on “terrorism” has also fueled frustration among some Western officials who say Ankara could be using the term in an attempt to crack down on critics.

“I recognize your concerns,” Stoltenberg said in a press conference alongside Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu. “At the same time,” he said, “it is clear that Finland and Sweden have delivered on the memorandum and are committed to the long-term partnership with Türkiye.”

The NATO chief said both Sweden and Finland have taken “major concrete actions” to implement the deal with Turkey, including boosting cooperation on counterterrorism.

“Sweden is passing new legislation prohibiting participation in terrorist organizations, including the PKK, and strengthening the tools on terrorist financing — more extraditions and expulsions are taking place, and restrictions on arms sale to Türkiye have ended,” he said.

Helsinki and Stockholm, he said, have done their part, and “so it’s time to welcome Finland and Sweden as full members of NATO.”…….


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Old 12th Nov 2022, 10:56
  #152 (permalink)  
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For my English-speaking intel/security people, here's a summary thread re. the GRU espionage case in Sweden that is getting significant media coverage here today:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1...320258049.html
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Old 12th Nov 2022, 13:49
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Originally Posted by ORAC
For my English-speaking intel/security people, here's a summary thread re. the GRU espionage case in Sweden that is getting significant media coverage here today:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1...320258049.html
Those names suggest a Persian/Kurdish heritage.
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Old 9th Jan 2023, 09:37
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#Breaking Sweden's prime minister has said Sweden can't meet Turkey's demands for NATO bid, during a security conference.

"Turkey both confirms that we have done what we said we would do, but they also say that they want things that we cannot or do not want to give them," - Sweden PM
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Old 9th Jan 2023, 15:12
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Wht can’t a subset of NATO countries could form a separate “North European Treaty Organization” and invite Finland, Sweden and other like-minded nations to join?
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Old 9th Jan 2023, 17:07
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Scale, and the lack of the throw weight of the US of A and the Alliance as a whole.
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Old 10th Jan 2023, 14:25
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The more Russia “warns them” not to join, the more persuasive the argument to join.
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Old 10th Jan 2023, 18:05
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Originally Posted by Courtney Mil
The more Russia “warns them” not to join, the more persuasive the argument to join.
Great to see you posting here again. Have missed your input.
That little squeeze job Mr Erdogan is putting on the Finns and Swedes should surprise nobody.
Interesting to see the Swedes push back a bit.
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Old 3rd Feb 2023, 17:51
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Congress to block Turkish F-16 and other purchases until they approve Finnish and Swedish NATO accession.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress...sion-succeeds/
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Old 3rd Feb 2023, 17:53
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Originally Posted by ORAC
Congress to block Turkish F-16 and other purchases until they approve Finnish and Swedish NATO accession.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress...sion-succeeds/
I will offer a guess that the only person who is enjoying this bun fight is named Vladimir.
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