Don't fly over my house...
Join Date: Sep 2012
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A2QFI I'm posting from an iPhone so my spelling is crap. The first refuge of the ignorant criticising spelling rather that the argument really isn't it? So there.
Mike isn't talking about training, he's talking about the Reds over a city centre.
Why is it that we (as a group) can't accept people from the outside questioning us? It's a dangerous position to be in. In my experience were not as good as everyone here makes out...
Mike isn't talking about training, he's talking about the Reds over a city centre.
Why is it that we (as a group) can't accept people from the outside questioning us? It's a dangerous position to be in. In my experience were not as good as everyone here makes out...
Mike,
A catastrophic bird strike doesn't tend to force the aircraft to drop directly out of the sky. If a 400kt Hawk took a goose to the engine directly over a built up area, it would have an enormous amount of time to trade speed for height and select somewhere to leave the aircraft.
The Hawk's never had a double hydraulics failure, and I can't recall a single instance of an RAF pilot suddenly passing out in mid flight for no reason. They've had their accidents in fields and over the sea because that's where the risk of bird strikes are, and that's where well-trained professional aircrew place their stricken aircraft after an emergency, rather than just abandoning it into a built up area.
What, specifically, do you think might happen to a RAFAT aircraft that makes this an unacceptable risk?
A catastrophic bird strike doesn't tend to force the aircraft to drop directly out of the sky. If a 400kt Hawk took a goose to the engine directly over a built up area, it would have an enormous amount of time to trade speed for height and select somewhere to leave the aircraft.
The Hawk's never had a double hydraulics failure, and I can't recall a single instance of an RAF pilot suddenly passing out in mid flight for no reason. They've had their accidents in fields and over the sea because that's where the risk of bird strikes are, and that's where well-trained professional aircrew place their stricken aircraft after an emergency, rather than just abandoning it into a built up area.
What, specifically, do you think might happen to a RAFAT aircraft that makes this an unacceptable risk?
Join Date: Jan 2001
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Mike.
I'm not normally (ever) one to defend the red arrows. Personally I find their displays an uninspiring waste of their exceptional skill due to lack of imagination in the choreography, but, and it is a big but, one thing they are is safe.
Do you have any idea what they would have had to go through to get a display clearance that allows them to cross the crowd line? The safety case must have been spectacular.
It is not just a case of "we're the reds we can do what we want"
You are much more likely to be hit by a meteorite/lightening than be landed on by the reds.
I'm not normally (ever) one to defend the red arrows. Personally I find their displays an uninspiring waste of their exceptional skill due to lack of imagination in the choreography, but, and it is a big but, one thing they are is safe.
Do you have any idea what they would have had to go through to get a display clearance that allows them to cross the crowd line? The safety case must have been spectacular.
It is not just a case of "we're the reds we can do what we want"
You are much more likely to be hit by a meteorite/lightening than be landed on by the reds.
Join Date: Feb 2005
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One (non troll) question. My understanding is that the RAF does not conduct low level ops and that we (they as I'm ex) haven't done so since GW1, so why do we practise it? If I'm wrong I stand to be corrected and, if not, stand to be educated. Please direct gratuitus abuse to file B1n. I will.
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I'm off to Wales in the not too distant future and I wondered if one of you ladies and gentlemen would be kind enough to point me in the right direction for the area of the Mach loop where I'm told the aircraft are often below the level of the observers?
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In a permissive air defense environment, ie one where the enemy has no capability to hit you at height like Afghan and Iraq etc then high is safe.
If the enemy has credible air defense then very very low may be safe.
We have to be ready and capable of going low if necessary.
If the enemy has credible air defense then very very low may be safe.
We have to be ready and capable of going low if necessary.
Join Date: Apr 2005
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One (non troll) question. My understanding is that the RAF does not conduct low level ops and that we (they as I'm ex) haven't done so since GW1, so why do we practise it? If I'm wrong I stand to be corrected and, if not, stand to be educated. Please direct gratuitus abuse to file B1n. I will.
But as an aside, even if current ops didn't require occasional low level flying does that mean the skill should be allowed to fade?
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Oh and to add,
Dozens of innocent civilians killed. Houses and entire shopping centre demolished. Years of official enquiry. RAF personnel questioned. Cultural values questioned. Psychiatric remedies recommended.
