100 pilot's sick in EK A/C on ground.. LACK OF CREW!!!
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Hey guys and gals,
Its been awhile (5 months) since i have been to these forums. I was in the pool last year and took my name out of the hat after realizing how bad things were at EK after reading these forums. I know couple of the guys that got hired from the pool and they are trying to leave at first opportunity. I guess they did not head the warnings or they considered pprune as usual banter.
But i want to thank everyone (too many to name) that were honest and kept me away from the dune. My wife and I both appreciate it.
Best regards,
fb
etc...i still get emails from ek telling me to update my file even though i asked to remove my name from the pile. Will not fly ek and will tell my friends not to fly it either for safety related issues.
Its been awhile (5 months) since i have been to these forums. I was in the pool last year and took my name out of the hat after realizing how bad things were at EK after reading these forums. I know couple of the guys that got hired from the pool and they are trying to leave at first opportunity. I guess they did not head the warnings or they considered pprune as usual banter.
But i want to thank everyone (too many to name) that were honest and kept me away from the dune. My wife and I both appreciate it.
Best regards,
fb
etc...i still get emails from ek telling me to update my file even though i asked to remove my name from the pile. Will not fly ek and will tell my friends not to fly it either for safety related issues.
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Mana?
Ixnat,
Me either, but as you said it sounds pretty good. I believe this is a great place to let them know what we think, but if they don't change anything my fingers could get tired. Have a good weekend and we will be ready for Sunday...
Me either, but as you said it sounds pretty good. I believe this is a great place to let them know what we think, but if they don't change anything my fingers could get tired. Have a good weekend and we will be ready for Sunday...
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Liars and Cheats.
This is a brand new handle. I have another which I’m not using for this. VPN is a wonderful thing.
I have no idea whether Mana is a management stoogie, one of us or an outsider just stirring the pot, but it doesn't matter. Whether he intended to elicit the responses he has or not also doesn't matter. What does matter is that he has. For the first time there is post after post of reasonably argued points, no crap or fanciful add on's, people putting their honest points of view forward, and in a (for PPRuNe) coherent manner.
I am an EK pilot, on the B777. Everything negative that has been posted on this particular thread is true; at the very least, factually true with some individual slants attached.
We are entering, in fact have been for some three or four years, a period of Emirates history that has and will see the greatest erosion of our working conditions. There will be plenty more to come I'm sure.
I've just read EK Management's post. Could be a tosser, but the unfortunate thing is that if you ignore all the fancy (?) writing everything he says is correct. If you read his previous posts from a year or so ago, the worrying thing is that pretty well everything he wrote then was and/or has become fact.
The realities are we are working in the Middle East. That means that we are working for cheats, liars, deceitful and dishonest people. (Term used loosely). Due to the leader’s incompetence and ego, they have driven Dubai into the ground. (Like I could care). The same people who will lock you up for a 100DHS bounced cheque refuse to pay back monies borrowed, workers salaries, contractors agreed upon fees. I believe there was probably always an intention, financial storm or not, to never pay back the full amount of monies borrowed. In effect, they have built Dubai for free or half cost. And that is just what they are doing to us; lying, cheating, deceiving, stealing. We are on track to become the cheapest labour units in the airline industry. Just as EK manag. says.
This is much more than Talking Horse, TCAS, AAR, TCTC or Flaganon. It stems from the very top, this is their way of doing business.
I think now is probably the only chance there is of stopping the slide, perhaps even regaining some lost ground. There is no doubt that they've been a bit too clever, and have dug themselves a hole. Let's use that. I've seen it before elsewhere. Only problem is here there is no venue for dissension, discussion, complaints or negotiation.
Their behaviour the last few years has been and is appalling. Absolutely atrocious. And I believe, set to get worse given the mess that has been created Emirate wide.
This thread has obviously gone way off topic from what it started from; I think a new thread should be started and kept alive with the same manner of posts that have appeared since Mana. In their hundreds would be perfect. This is the ONLY forum that exists for us to express our displeasure in this backward society. I also believe that as much dirty washing as possible should be hung out for all to see. I’m not interested in cries of ‘professionalism’ or whatever. Fu** ‘em. It’s what they play on and use in any event. I think the thread should hammer home over and over again just how this company behaves. Any post that is bleeding heart or Mana like can of course remain, but I think should not be answered. This will be OUR thread, the multitude of disaffected Emirates Pilots thread, and all others, particularly the company, can get stuffed. It’s time to get the word out, and properly.
Cheers, I’ve had a GUTSFUL.
I have no idea whether Mana is a management stoogie, one of us or an outsider just stirring the pot, but it doesn't matter. Whether he intended to elicit the responses he has or not also doesn't matter. What does matter is that he has. For the first time there is post after post of reasonably argued points, no crap or fanciful add on's, people putting their honest points of view forward, and in a (for PPRuNe) coherent manner.
I am an EK pilot, on the B777. Everything negative that has been posted on this particular thread is true; at the very least, factually true with some individual slants attached.
We are entering, in fact have been for some three or four years, a period of Emirates history that has and will see the greatest erosion of our working conditions. There will be plenty more to come I'm sure.
I've just read EK Management's post. Could be a tosser, but the unfortunate thing is that if you ignore all the fancy (?) writing everything he says is correct. If you read his previous posts from a year or so ago, the worrying thing is that pretty well everything he wrote then was and/or has become fact.
The realities are we are working in the Middle East. That means that we are working for cheats, liars, deceitful and dishonest people. (Term used loosely). Due to the leader’s incompetence and ego, they have driven Dubai into the ground. (Like I could care). The same people who will lock you up for a 100DHS bounced cheque refuse to pay back monies borrowed, workers salaries, contractors agreed upon fees. I believe there was probably always an intention, financial storm or not, to never pay back the full amount of monies borrowed. In effect, they have built Dubai for free or half cost. And that is just what they are doing to us; lying, cheating, deceiving, stealing. We are on track to become the cheapest labour units in the airline industry. Just as EK manag. says.
This is much more than Talking Horse, TCAS, AAR, TCTC or Flaganon. It stems from the very top, this is their way of doing business.
I think now is probably the only chance there is of stopping the slide, perhaps even regaining some lost ground. There is no doubt that they've been a bit too clever, and have dug themselves a hole. Let's use that. I've seen it before elsewhere. Only problem is here there is no venue for dissension, discussion, complaints or negotiation.
Their behaviour the last few years has been and is appalling. Absolutely atrocious. And I believe, set to get worse given the mess that has been created Emirate wide.
This thread has obviously gone way off topic from what it started from; I think a new thread should be started and kept alive with the same manner of posts that have appeared since Mana. In their hundreds would be perfect. This is the ONLY forum that exists for us to express our displeasure in this backward society. I also believe that as much dirty washing as possible should be hung out for all to see. I’m not interested in cries of ‘professionalism’ or whatever. Fu** ‘em. It’s what they play on and use in any event. I think the thread should hammer home over and over again just how this company behaves. Any post that is bleeding heart or Mana like can of course remain, but I think should not be answered. This will be OUR thread, the multitude of disaffected Emirates Pilots thread, and all others, particularly the company, can get stuffed. It’s time to get the word out, and properly.
Cheers, I’ve had a GUTSFUL.
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Someone's already mentioned the absence of posts critical to EK here on Pprune a few short years ago.
Then, there was one man, [an ex-EK pilot who'd been terminated under what then (pre Sept 11th 2001) seemed extraordinary circumstances], critical of all things EK, and virtually every person replying to his posts (me included) defended EK.
Something's changed in the meantime, and it has changed radically. Anyone looking in from afar would have to ask himself: is it likely that 2500+ pilots within EK could have damn near ALL changed their atitudes to the company in that time simply because they ALL had a radical change of heart with no good reason?
Or, following the tenets of Occam's Razor, is there a more simple explanation? Has something changed - and changed radically - within the company to make virtually all those pilots who defended the company almost to a man back in 2003 now fill these pages with almost universally negative comments about the people who are at the helm?
I leave it to the reader to decide.
Karl, I still think you were wrong in much of what you said about EK management back then, but I have to admit that I think you'd have to wait a long time now to find someone who'd disagree with anything you said along the same lines you posted here back then.
Then, there was one man, [an ex-EK pilot who'd been terminated under what then (pre Sept 11th 2001) seemed extraordinary circumstances], critical of all things EK, and virtually every person replying to his posts (me included) defended EK.
Something's changed in the meantime, and it has changed radically. Anyone looking in from afar would have to ask himself: is it likely that 2500+ pilots within EK could have damn near ALL changed their atitudes to the company in that time simply because they ALL had a radical change of heart with no good reason?
Or, following the tenets of Occam's Razor, is there a more simple explanation? Has something changed - and changed radically - within the company to make virtually all those pilots who defended the company almost to a man back in 2003 now fill these pages with almost universally negative comments about the people who are at the helm?
I leave it to the reader to decide.
Karl, I still think you were wrong in much of what you said about EK management back then, but I have to admit that I think you'd have to wait a long time now to find someone who'd disagree with anything you said along the same lines you posted here back then.
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Join Date: Mar 2010
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In Support
ManaDubai makes valid points regarding the success of Emirates.
The airline has shown the greatest sustained growth in the industry.
The product is of a high quality. A fact testified by many customer and independent surveys.
It has been profitable throughout.
Its training and crew standards are of a high quality as shown by independent audit.
It is a highly sought after employer as applications in the thousands will prove.
It has a strong social consciousness and support several major charities.
The package for flight deck crew remains one of the best in the industry.
It has high safety standards that are monitored continually and compared with other leaders in the industry.
In regard to fatigue a team of qualified medical professionals monitor this with the assistance of a expert software package. Interviews are also conducted to ensure any external factors are accounted for.
None of this would be possible without a professional, dedicated, competent and fiscally aware management. This is particularly true over the past two years.
It will continue to grow and deliver a high quality product despite the few voices that attempt to disuade others from finding employment. These voices measure as a fraction of 1 percent of their employees and have little effect.
The airline has shown the greatest sustained growth in the industry.
The product is of a high quality. A fact testified by many customer and independent surveys.
It has been profitable throughout.
Its training and crew standards are of a high quality as shown by independent audit.
It is a highly sought after employer as applications in the thousands will prove.
It has a strong social consciousness and support several major charities.
The package for flight deck crew remains one of the best in the industry.
It has high safety standards that are monitored continually and compared with other leaders in the industry.
In regard to fatigue a team of qualified medical professionals monitor this with the assistance of a expert software package. Interviews are also conducted to ensure any external factors are accounted for.
None of this would be possible without a professional, dedicated, competent and fiscally aware management. This is particularly true over the past two years.
It will continue to grow and deliver a high quality product despite the few voices that attempt to disuade others from finding employment. These voices measure as a fraction of 1 percent of their employees and have little effect.
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ManaDubai makes valid points regarding the success of Emirates
so you found the raisin in the huge pile of cow manure 
btw...the average cotton farmer in North America before the civil war also had a lot of success
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A question worth repeating on the new page:
Has something changed - and changed radically - within the company to make virtually all those pilots who defended the company almost to a man back in 2003 now fill these pages with almost universally negative comments about the people who are at the helm?
Join Date: Nov 2007
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You loser Mana.
Changing user name from ManaDubai to ManagementMotion.
What an awesome tactic which hardly anyone will realise is just to give the image of someone else being as deluded as you.
Different handle - same ****.
Bit like our current change of management. Rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
Changing user name from ManaDubai to ManagementMotion.
What an awesome tactic which hardly anyone will realise is just to give the image of someone else being as deluded as you.
Different handle - same ****.
Bit like our current change of management. Rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
It will continue to grow and deliver a high quality product despite the few voices that attempt to disuade others from finding employment. These voices measure as a fraction of 1 percent of their employees and have little effect.
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ManagementMotion - check the definition of "motion" and you will find "gastrointestinal motility". That is - "****".
Looking forward to your next well thought out user name!
Looking forward to your next well thought out user name!
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Guys, guys, guys...
You don't really, seriously believe that any of these Mana guys are genuine posters do you?
No wonder the pilot group is having it's intelligence questioned.
This is just one of 'our' guys having a little fun provoking some vitriol. He's probably just having a bit of fun to cheer himself up during dark times, therefore I won't be unfair and label him as a 'troll'.
In fact if there was a way to check the IP addresses of a ll the 'mana' type posts you would probably find they are the same.
If it's really frustrating you that much, just put these guys on the ignore list and concentrate on fighting the real issues instead of biting the bait from a practical joker.
It's a bit cringeworthy when you see our group responding to these guys like we really believe they are EK managament. Sheeesh...
You don't really, seriously believe that any of these Mana guys are genuine posters do you?
No wonder the pilot group is having it's intelligence questioned.
This is just one of 'our' guys having a little fun provoking some vitriol. He's probably just having a bit of fun to cheer himself up during dark times, therefore I won't be unfair and label him as a 'troll'.
In fact if there was a way to check the IP addresses of a ll the 'mana' type posts you would probably find they are the same.
If it's really frustrating you that much, just put these guys on the ignore list and concentrate on fighting the real issues instead of biting the bait from a practical joker.
It's a bit cringeworthy when you see our group responding to these guys like we really believe they are EK managament. Sheeesh...
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Agreed Good Cat. It's almost funny how these fellas are all putting so much heart and soul into this phony baloney dialogue. Mana must be laughing his pants wet at all you chaps.
Can you really see anyone from management posting on pprune to straighten the pilots out?
It's actually quite a boring thread; the same old points have been raised again in the hopes of "management" seeing things our way and making changes, Tragically naive and sad, really.
Still, it does serve to continue to highlight to prospective joiners a few facts of life about the way things are here.
Can you really see anyone from management posting on pprune to straighten the pilots out?
It's actually quite a boring thread; the same old points have been raised again in the hopes of "management" seeing things our way and making changes, Tragically naive and sad, really.
Still, it does serve to continue to highlight to prospective joiners a few facts of life about the way things are here.
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Resignees? Worked to death? Beaten into submission? Their absence paints an interesting sideline picture...
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I hate to say it chaps, but I think Good Cat is correct! There is no way any 'relevant' management would actually be so stupid as to post the nonsense that Mana has been spouting here.
I do believe that TCAS/TCED et al read Pprune, but they would never condone the direct engagement of the pilots through fear of what has just happened on the last 6 pages!
At best I reckon Mana is a completely insignificant management type (VP Paperclips or similar), or more likely a moustached office junior with a curiously wobbly head deluding him/herself that he/she is more important than they actually are.......... The place is full of them!
However my money is on the possibility that it is one of our own on a wind up! At which point I would like to congratulate him on his sheer brilliance at managing to convince 'most' of us that he is actually 'management'..... Well done sir!
I do believe that TCAS/TCED et al read Pprune, but they would never condone the direct engagement of the pilots through fear of what has just happened on the last 6 pages!
At best I reckon Mana is a completely insignificant management type (VP Paperclips or similar), or more likely a moustached office junior with a curiously wobbly head deluding him/herself that he/she is more important than they actually are.......... The place is full of them!
However my money is on the possibility that it is one of our own on a wind up! At which point I would like to congratulate him on his sheer brilliance at managing to convince 'most' of us that he is actually 'management'..... Well done sir!
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Best wind up ever? Could be. Hard to tell given closeness of the 'mana's to actual management attitudes.
Also, with technology as it is, posters can appear to be somewhere else.
Also, with technology as it is, posters can appear to be somewhere else.
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EGGW - you've probably looked-up the IP address that the PPRuNe server captured when Mana made his / her posts.... but can you confirm that Mana is not utilizing a Virtual Private Network (VPN) connection to disguise their true location?
E.g. If you look-up the IP address of this specific reply, it will probably suggest that I'm in the environs of Los Angles (as that's where I've pointed my VPN client, prior to submitting this reply).... though you shouldn't be too surprised to learn that that's not where I really am!
Aside, Mana could well indeed be posting from within an EK office overseas, and / or connected to that office via an EK VPN... unless you know differently?
E.g. If you look-up the IP address of this specific reply, it will probably suggest that I'm in the environs of Los Angles (as that's where I've pointed my VPN client, prior to submitting this reply).... though you shouldn't be too surprised to learn that that's not where I really am!
Aside, Mana could well indeed be posting from within an EK office overseas, and / or connected to that office via an EK VPN... unless you know differently?