Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Worldwide > Middle East
Reload this Page >

Gulf Air New Package

Middle East Many expats still flying in Knoteetingham. Regional issues can be discussed here.

Gulf Air New Package

Old 2nd Sep 2007, 08:56
  #181 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fantasy Island
Posts: 91
If you chaps are just about done measuring your privates can we get on with it.

Mr Butthead57 has a way of provoking these sentiments, I recall his "eurobrats" comments. Wonder how he shares the same A320 flight deck space now with the very same "eurobrats" he was insulting
Capt Hair Y Balls is offline  
Old 2nd Sep 2007, 12:29
  #182 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Bahrain
Posts: 624
Thanks, funny it had to come from a "single" poster. Ooops. But that's exactly what I meant tbaylx. Didn't mean to offend.
So now that we've gotten our desired pay increases, does this mean we move on to other things to whinge about? Because that's already starting in other threads.
I will therefore refuse to negatively engage in further bagging of the company of my employ and will be making the best of whatever time frame I have with them.
Sal-e is offline  
Old 2nd Sep 2007, 13:56
  #183 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 46
When will we be paid

Once again this, as with so many threads, degenerates into infintile back biting. Those of us who are interested in our company and colleges ARE BORED TO DEATH READING THIS RUBBISH. Would any fellow posters have any news on when the 'New Deal' is to be payed and if it is to be back dated when to?
MaffiFaloos is offline  
Old 2nd Sep 2007, 14:03
  #184 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Surrounded by aluminum, and the great outdoors
Posts: 3,788
According to the roadshow it was effective that day, payable retroactive in November...anybody else got an update or a more clear understanding???
ironbutt57 is offline  
Old 2nd Sep 2007, 15:04
  #185 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: The Palm
Posts: 702
who are the best FO or CP?...
Think about teamwork and put aside egos that only lead to CFIT. First, try to make it work within the work station (?) and if unsuccessful, report the guy/girl conscienciously and constructively. Suggest further training or checks before sending him/her home.
fractional is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2007, 08:05
  #186 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Beneath a tree
Posts: 11
In the past most GF issues boiled down to one concern. Are they serious? Are the shareholders committed to capitalizing and funding an airline with a real future?
Relatively soon after JH took over,perhaps it was late 2003, I opened my PH one day and there was that handsome publication with the title A Journey of Change, featuring the one and only GF Balance Sheet we have ever been shown, and the answer was clear. They weren't. The four shareholders had never put up the required equity( indeed,one, Qatar had just done a bunk), with the total share capital only USD330m and the net equity a startling USD 149m, this financial horror clearly like a fire bell that the Report couldn't silence and which required an enigmatic KPMG footnote to explain. Obviously,the airline had only been surviving on ad hoc cash handouts for years.

I have always assumed that the reason JH went public with that one and only Balance Sheet, apart from trying to cultivate a branding image of transparency and accountability , was to embarass the BOD into action.
After all, it wasn't a pretty picture. Let me just remind you of the limited liability company's state of affairs at the end of 2002.
The net profit for the year was a loss of USD 104m.
The Owner's funds or capital employed was USD 149m, giving a return on investment of - 69.9 %!
The Company was technically insolvent, with current assets of USD 322m versus current liabilities of USD 458m.
The accumulated losses were USD 382m.
The Term Loans( with varying rates of interest, costing USD 40m per year) plus funds due to owner states plus employees' indemnities( a liability, by the way, which doesn't have to be funded) totalled USD 699m.
The company's assets? 2 A320, 6 A330, 5 A340, plus spares and engines, all with a net book value of USD 770m. The HQ was noted to be on land that belonged to ' a shareholder ' and was rent free.
Since then, we have been told, the situation has only got worse. AD announced that in 2006- 2007 the losses were USD 1m per day! The assets have depreciated. And two more shareholders have pulled out.
My point in rehashing this sad story is to ask the same question as we have been asking all these years. Is the sole surviving shareholder serious? Will they capitilize and fund the airline? Will they restructure and make public a balance sheet which reveals a totally transformed equity picture? So far, it seems, they haven't. They've followed the same old route of monthly handouts. They've flogged off any asset they can get their hands on, and, I believe, have plans to offload the whole Training Centre.We have even heard that another airline with an authorised capital of USD 1 billion has been estalished.
IMHO, no new salary package, no weekly newsletter from the CEO heralding a new dawn, no new route structure or customer initiative, can be a substitute for showing us another, transformed balance sheet. Until we see one, we should be very cautious and sceptical
Sandy Swan is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2007, 14:28
  #187 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Singapore
Posts: 553
don't care much about history actually, just that paycheck in the account at the end of the month is all that matters for me. no money, no honey...new airline, bond or no bond, notice or no notice...easy as 123.
brassplate is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2007, 16:53
  #188 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: South of North
Posts: 656
Brassplate, I think the point was that if the company cannot survive going forward - and it will not without significant investment......thwn there will be nomonthly paycheques!
Trader is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2007, 19:31
  #189 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: min rest
Posts: 424
It is understandable Brassplate feels the way he does about GF....he has seen what treatment Captain Rad Gammage got after 31 years loyal service.
Such airline managers generally get the pilot attitude they deserve and eventually the accident figures.
scanscanscan is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2007, 20:35
  #190 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Surrounded by aluminum, and the great outdoors
Posts: 3,788
One must also bear in mind the basic philosophy behind a national airline is not to be a profit center, but a bearer of the flag, and to contribute by bringing business passengers, expat labor, tourism, and other revenue generating sources...this being considered I'd hazard a guess GF at least breaks even by doing so...now to re-equip, and streamline, and re-open routes while not operationally profitible, give GF, thus the Kingdom of Bahrain a very important presence in these markets. In the end GF will cost Bahrain less to own, as it may eventually almost pay for itself...
ironbutt57 is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2007, 21:56
  #191 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Bahrain
Posts: 624
You are absolutely correct on that one IB. The problem with that though is the government will subsidise only as far as is necessary to keep us running if that is in fact their intention, using the airline for the sole purpose of bringing in business.
But if they realise that they could actually compete if they tried, and by doing so boost everyones morale and the overall product, provide jobs etc, they'd be pleasantly surprised that there might be good revenues to be made.
Sal-e is offline  
Old 4th Sep 2007, 00:29
  #192 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Juffair
Posts: 75
I've been saying this for months now. GF never will or can be profitable. But so what. IB talks about tourism and business as well as opening loss making routes. They should never have closed those routes. Are there not businessmen from Asia and tourists from Australia with Middle Eastern ancestry? As far as Indian labourers go, this time next year Jet and Kingfisher will both be flying to the Gulf so i predict a massive downturn in that market for GF, and the rest of the Gulf carriers as well.
Bombay HF is offline  
Old 4th Sep 2007, 05:17
  #193 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Earth
Age: 48
Posts: 30
Join KF

Bombay HF an idea for you, if you are so impress by KF why donít you join them and have a nice day.
LOC STAR is offline  
Old 4th Sep 2007, 05:26
  #194 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Over the Rainbow
Age: 50
Posts: 66
Tourism -- give me a break

Tourism? Hello ? Get real!

Tourism for the authorities here means a lead of people coming from a close country to **** and drink. And drink and drive.

Last edited by Ibn Kalb; 5th Sep 2007 at 15:05.
Ibn Kalb is offline  
Old 4th Sep 2007, 10:29
  #195 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Kuwait
Age: 72
Posts: 26
Gentlemen,

You have done exactly what your Management wanted you to do: by seemingly 'talking out of turn', and mentioning expat redundancies, your Management rid themselves of the ambitious, and those who were lukewarm in their support for the company. What they are left with are the locals, the unambitious, the optimists (who think things will get better) and those who could be financially challenged by leaving. In other words, they now have a more compliant workforce, who will be prepared to put up with whatever s**t they may care to throw at them.

There is a saying in the Middle East that promises are made to be broken, and this is what will happen with GF: your new package will be cocooned in such woolly terms as to be open to several interpretations. You will become the butt of mushroom management.

You will join the ranks of SV and KU ferrying expat labour to and fro: standards will be allowed to drop even further and hiring will be restricted to low-wage countries. You are now all part of a Government Organisation, with the attendant disregard for excellence, customer service and punctuality that this brings.
notrocketscience is offline  
Old 4th Sep 2007, 12:04
  #196 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Bahrain
Posts: 624
Hey sprocketscientist,
You the latest doomsday prophet are you? Just spectating from a safe distance? Wimp!! Why don't you get amongst it and enjoy while it lasts? Did GF hurt you?

Last edited by Sal-e; 13th Jan 2008 at 13:13.
Sal-e is offline  
Old 5th Sep 2007, 12:45
  #197 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Bahrain
Posts: 624
Just as I thought. Wimp.
Sal-e is offline  
Old 5th Sep 2007, 14:46
  #198 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Surrounded by aluminum, and the great outdoors
Posts: 3,788
Sal-e you appear to have departed the solar system..re-cleared direct to "GF new package"
ironbutt57 is offline  
Old 5th Sep 2007, 14:51
  #199 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Hilton, Sheraton or Intercon
Posts: 39
Talk about "new package", funny how nothing has been put in writting as to when this illusive "new package" will be "delivered"

He verbally said Nov 1st after looking around his bunch of cronies for an answere but he failed to mention which Nov, 2007, 2008, 2009..........2020
Capt Al Fakhem is offline  
Old 5th Sep 2007, 14:57
  #200 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Surrounded by aluminum, and the great outdoors
Posts: 3,788
I suspect everybody is counting on Nov 2007....
ironbutt57 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.