TelBoy

If the CAA are now allowing IFR flight for CVD pilots they are following the FAA route. If you fail the colour vision tests in the US you have the limitation "no night flight and no color signal" They do allow IFR. As for the dual night the FAA PPL includes night training and when you get your PPL you can fly at night. When I did my PPL I had the limitation and did all my night dual which counted (yes I know it's FAA not CAA). I then passed the tower light signal test and have had all restrictions removed (from my FAA medical) If only the CAA would accept it

gijoe

Team,

I've been in bat against the CAA a long time on this on - count me in and I'll bring what I can to the party.

For my part I am a CVD with an unrestricted PPL(A), Night Qualification and about 500 safely completed hours.

G

TelBoy

Figure that now makes it

1) 2Close
2) TelBoy
3) Neo_RS14
4) Windforce
5) Shunter
6) east_sider
7) Ads212
8) gijoe
9)
10)

Keep on comming

Shunter

Wow, I have to say I think Blinkz is right! My initial student medical did indeed say "day vfr only", but the one in my license book simply says "see license for restrictions", and the license simply says "day only". No mentioned of VFR-only at all!

2close

Whilst I am awaiting the actual document I have been advised by the CAA that:

NPT = No Public Transport

VCL = Daytime only

These are the medical certificate abbreviations used, which should appear on your medical certificate.

These are UK ONLY deviations and only apply to UK Registered aircraft AND only whilst in UK airspace.

There is no restriction on flights under IFR (which can be flown in VMC and IMC) but also there is no restriction on flights under IFR in IMC, provided you are suitably qualified.

However, if you are a basic PPL holder with no IMCR you MUST remain in sight of the surface at all times so no flights VFR in VMC on top of OVC cloud layers (unless of course you can see the surface 40nm away...)

However, as a PPL IMCR you can fly VFR in VMC on top provided you are (a) > 3000' and (b) 1000' vertically separated from cloud but technically you would need to change to IFR in order to descend through cloud. Whilst some climb and descend through cloud in Class G airspace without radar frequently I try not to do this unless I am working at the very least a RIS (and preferably a RAS) - you never know if someone else is doing exactly the same thing in the same patch of airspace as yourself and the only saving grace would be that you'd be highly unlikely to know anything about it!!!

TTFN

2close

2close

Just to bring you all up to speed on the deviations applicable to CVD –

JAR-FCL3 Section 2 IEM FCL3.100 ([c]) states that:

VCL – Valid by day only

This deviation can only be imposed by an AMS and only removed by an AMS.

The definition then reads:

“Explanation - This limitation applies only to private pilots and can therefore only be applied to a Class 2 medical certificate. This allows private pilots with varying degrees of colour deficiency to operate within specified circumstances.”

It is quite clear that, under JARs a Class 1 medical can not be issued to any person who does not meet JAA colour vision criteria. However, the UK CAA has chosen not to apply this particular JAR. It has filed a deviation with the JAA and issues Class 1 medicals to CVD pilots in order that they may carry out some forms of aerial work. The UK CAA is the only JAA national authority which issues such deviations.

The deviation NPT is not a JAR definition and has been applied within the UK only by the UK CAA but it means No Public Transport and refers to any Commercial Air Transport operation carrying fare paying passengers or freight.

So there endeth(-ish) the argument regarding VFR / IFR and VMC / IMC. As we can all now see, the limitation applies to daytime flying only and does not preclude anyone from flying IFR or in IMC.

Cheers,

2close

abzyyy

hi, alot of internet sites are saying that commercial airlines wont accept people with colour deficiencies... is this true? this is my only set-back... If I am able to get a CAA Class one, shouldnt that be enough? I havnt been able to get authentic sources with regards to commercial aviation. Wondering if you could help?

abzyyy

I know its possible for CVD people to get a CAA class one... but what about commercial airlines and their employment standards? Will they take on people with colour deficiencies?

TelBoy

You will NOT be able to work for an Airline with CP4 on your ticket. It prohibits Public Transport - so no paying pax or freight. On the brighter side you can instruct (by day) and tow banners and gligers and take paras. Might not be the best paying, but you can persue an aviation carear

abzyyy

btw guys. I just had a eye exam today at my local vision place, namely 'vision express' in hounslow. Anywho, they said i didnt need glasses and my sight was good: right and left both 6/6 unaided. But i do have a partial colour blindness.

The person told me to go to the 'Institute of Optometry' in Elephant and castle to do a colour vision examination. Heres the site http://www.ioo.org.uk/ and she sed its really high tech etc. Part of being colour deficient i guess is just to accept it and hopefully pass other tests to be 'colour safe' and therefore have an unrestricted class one med. This institute of optometry has all of these tests and it costs £35 (just phoned them up)... plus u can get copies of your report for £20 i think (it says it all on the site) so if you pass the other tests you can take that report to Gatwick as backup.

balhambob

I am shortly starting training in Spain and currently wear contact lenses. I have been told that I will need to carry a spare pair of glasses incase the contact lenses fall out when I am flying.

So I am going to get prescription glasses and maybe prescription sunglasses too.

Does anyone know if you can fly with prescription sunglasses - I was told they can cause colour distortion so maybe not??

I guess the alternative is to wear contacts and normal sunglasses ontop but if the contacts fell out (it does happen) I would then have to put the normal glasses in and would have the sun in my eyes!

Has anyone come across this problem before?

yoda1

Hi m8,

I have the same problem but after reading the following thread it would appear that prescription sunglasses are fine.

Mohit_C

I wear contact lenses too and have glasses. I'm not sure about all, but at some ppticians you can have the sunglasses on top of the glasses, so that you can take them off or put them on. It's good in case you use glasses for the street but for flying you could put these sunglasses on. It's a bit like an "add-on".

yoda1

TBH the first thing Monday morning i am going to ring the CAA to ask them for their advice but as i understand prescription sunglasses are fine...

stevieb1

Guys

I've followed this thread with interest for a while now, being CVD myself.

Having been to Gatwick today, and failed the lanterns, I'm coming to terms with not being able to fly commercially. At least not for the forseeable.

Reading some previous posts, it seems pretty clear that an IMC is still possible. But can anyone say with any certainty that a day only IR is possible?

I will of course ask the CAA, although I suspect their answer will be no before they even know what I'm asking them.

By the way, I'm told that the alternative computer based CVD test should be online fairly soon - and we should all be given a further crack on that. If anyone's taken the prototype at city uni I'd be interested to know whether they were more or less succesful compared to the lanterns.

Thanks in advance.

2close

Yes Stevieb1,

You can hold an IR. The limitation imposed by the UK CAA is VCL which means 'daytime only'. It has absolutely nothing to do with VMC / IMC flight.

The situation is a little complex. VCL is a JAA deviation which under JAR-FCL 3 is only applicable to Class 2 medicals and therefore only applicable to PPLs. Under JAR-FCL 3 you cannot be issued with a Class 1 medical if you are CVD.

However, the UK CAA has also applied the deviation to Class 1 medicals to permit CVD pilots to undertake certain categories of aerial work by daytime only. This deviation is inextricably combined with a UK only deviation NPT which means No Public Transport, i.e. no fare paying passenger or freight commercial air transport work, by day or night. The UK CAA deviations are applied and valid in the UK only and only on UK registered aircraft.

So, with a CPL / IR / FI you could be a CPL / IR instructor, working in the UK and by day only.

Watch this space for some developments very soon and make sure you come on board.

stevieb1

Thanks for that 2close. You seem very well informed, I'll be happy to be involved in any way I can.

2close

Apologies for the 'teasing', Mark.

Some of us are putting a hell of a lot of personal time and effort into resolving this issue. Obviously, we want to ensure we get things right first time but being such a diverse group, geographically as much as anything else, and with our own very busy personal schedules, these things do take time.

Rest assured we are almost at the point of commencing our actions and I sincerely hope we do get the support we need from all CVDs.

Keep smiling

Neo_RS14

Good to see people are still monitoring/contributing to this thread. I can only echo 2close's comments, that these things take time in order to ensure the best possible output under the constraints of personal lives etc, so all we can do is ensure we provide our full support when the time is right, and that time is approaching fast....so keep checking in

Cheers,

Neo

2close

Gentlemen,

We have gone live with our campaign.

Please see the thread 'CEDAR - Campaign to End Discrimination in Aviation Regulation' and contact Neo_RS14 if you wish to be involved.

Please feel free to distribute the contents of the thread to anyone you feel can spread the message.

But please follow the instruction and keep general CVD stuff to this thread.

As soon as we have sufficient numbers we will contact all collectively with an update.

Cheers,

2close