2close

As a condition of the reciprocal exchange the CAA probably tried to impose their OTT medical standards on the FAA who told them where to go, as they will with the new CVD testing.

Dried ears

If what
ATPMBA says is true:

Then you are on a winner because:

JAR Class 1

The initial refractive error (correction) limit is +5/-6 dioptres. There is no myopic limit for revalidation/renewal. The astigmatism (distortion) and anisometropia (difference between the eyes) initial limits are 2 dioptres, but there are no limits for revalidation/renewal.
NOTE: contact lenses must be worn if the anisometropia exceeds 3 dioptres. (Extract from: http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?ca...=90&pageid=531)

kinnie

Original Post

called Gatwick and faxed through the completed form. The Opthamologist there looked at the form and called me back within ten minutes, which i thought was impressive!!!! They said that i should definitely come for the medical as the 2 diopters doesn't really matter, they want to test and see that i can cope with it. Any ideas what this means or what they will be looking for????? (they could ask me, I'll tell them i cope fine ). Will i just have to wait in limbo now until i go over to the UK in July? Very frustrating!

Is anyone able to help me out and throw any light on this for me?

Danielremon

Does anyone know if you can go to Gatwick and take just the eye examination on it's own. I would like to just get this in the bag before I go further?
Can anyone tell me what will happen, it's the most daunting test I've ever taken. I would like to know what they will do.

gijoe

Daniel,
You can definitely take the eye tests on their own as their is no point in blindly carrying on with a Class 1 if you don't pass these.
State that you want the opthalmo tests first when you book an appointment.
G

NoTimeToWaste

Does "myopic limit" as mentioned on the revalidation/renewal page on the CAA website (link below) refer to shortsightedness or longsightedness or eyesight in general? My prescription is currently +3.25 in both eyes so im just into the "extended eyesight exam every 5 years" bracket. If there is no upper limit for revalidation, what does the extended eyesight test show? Im slightly confused and would appreciate any guidance
http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?ca...=90&pageid=531

davidd

Is it possible to skip the colour/eye test if you already have a Class 2

planecrazy.eu

A little advise required please...

I have used the same optician for half a decade, each year i go, each year my vision never ever changes at all.

I decided to use D&A a few months back, with shocking results as my eyes, according to them was half a diopter or more better than my long term optician. So with this, i returned back, they retested me at my long opticians and they said they did it wrong, so i went away disapointed as i was .25 over the limit with my one eye...

A few days ago i decided i needed to know once and for all, so i booked an appointments with 3 opticians, my regular one got back my usual results but the other two got back the same results which was within the CAA limits in my weakest eye by .25 diopter...

One of them said to me that my vision is corrected to 6/9, the other said its corrected to 6/6.

I know you need 20/20 or 6/6, so in the event i have 6/9 corrected vision, is there anything i can do?

I went to Ultralase a week ago to, which also got the same visual standards as the other two, so its sound to say my long standing opticians has lost me as a customer as three other opticians all getting the same cant be wrong (or can they)...

Anyway, Ultralase told me that i could have Lasik treatment, which they said initially i couldnt as the standards for Lasik at ultralase are within the CAA limits of what they require for a C1 medical, they said to me i could have Lasik but first i could have insisions that are designed to remove astigmatism? is this an approved CAA procidure? and they said i could have lens implants (IOL?)

I am now confused, i know my correction would be approved by the CAA, they have confirmed this, but they said i need 6/6 and in my lazy eye 6/9.

I am just wondering what i could class as a next step, or is the next step to finnaly admit defeat and look for a career else where?

Thanks for any help on this matter...

Oh, one last thing, dont laff to hard, but i have been reading about natrual vision correction, i am pretty much guessing that this is more in the mind and that all the testomonials are fixed or similar, but i was wondering if anyone has done this, heard of it working, or the likes?

ADDED----

I have just looked at my report, from Ultralase, they found me to have

6 / 5-1 RIGHT EYE CORRECTION
6 / 75+2 (MIGHT BE 7.5+2) LEFT CORRECTION

and my total correction to 6/5-1, so is that better or worse than 6/6?

TelBoy

Neo - welcome to "our" forum.

It is great to see that you are so inspired about flying and are willing to join the fight with us, good on you.

The City Uni is a great place to start as it will give you an idea about being tested for colour vision. Just be aware that they are doing their own tests for their own purposes and they are NOT the same as the tests at the CAA.

The CAA will ONLY accept their own tests and will NOT take into consideration anyone elses examinations. (maybe other JAA aviation authorities as you will have read in this thead).

A word of caution about medicals. The first medical you do with the CAA is considered your "initial" and is more strict than others - it also includes colour vision which others do not. If you fail an initial medical, as far as I am aware (correct me if I'm wrong please) you cannot take another initial anyware in JAA land and will therefore exclude you from an unrestricted JAA medical if you pass the CV tests in another country. Please note this is the way I UNDERSTAND it - I hope others will give their informative comments on this. However the CAA will do only the colour vision tests for £28 - a good chance to do the lanterns, and if you fail at Gatwick and then pass in another country all is not lost.

As for the FAA route - you stand a GOOD chance of getting an unrestricted medical there. They have a lot of methods pf CV testing and the Light Signal test has a very good pass rate (me included). You need a restricted FAA medical to apply for the signal test, which can be taken anytime in your (FAA) training. As for working in the USA after, well as you are aware it is VERY difficult. My daughter is a US citizen (an lives there) and I cannot live or work in the USA. However there IS work on an FAA licence. See below.

1) There is a new registration M for Manx in the Isle of Man which comes under the CAA, but will allow FAA licences. It is NOT for public transport though - mainly business jets etc, but I think we will see a LOT more of this one.

2) The FAA licence is well thought of in Africa and the Middle East - if you want to work abroad.

3) Maybe you could get work on an N reg aircraft in the UK (don't hold your breath though)

4) Look at the USA as your training ground - not for work. I did my PPL in the USA and loved it - will be going back ASAP to do my CPL, IR, Multi etc.

In short - if you are willing and deternined enough, there IS work and you WILL make it on an FAA licence. Lets face it even with an unrestricted CAA medical and brand new CPL IR, you will have to be committed to getting a job in the UK - it will not fall into your lap!!

Good luck to you mate. Why not get flying. Go to a school you feel happy with and take a few lessons (you do NOT need a medical at this point) and just get "into it"

TelBoy

2Close, I did the City Uni tests and they did NOT do the Holmes Wright. I have only seen that at Gatwick.

I think the City Uni have changed their testing as they told me they did have the Baynes, but not when I did their tests.

Neo_RS14

Hi 2close,

Happy to be aboard

Yes I certainly think it would be strange if they do not accept my City documentation should I succeed, maybe they 'have to' test me themselves due to some sort of protocol for the Class 1?? Not very accomodating eh, but, such is life.

With regard to the lanterns at City...She said the Beyne is gone, but they have the HW....so at least I'll get to try one of them (touchwood).

The more I think about it, the more it occurs to me that whatever new tests city have, they won't be introduced into the CAA testing for a long time yet. But, as gracious as they have been to some on here, maybe they'd let people who failed the current tests, try the new ones when they come in.

TelBoy

Hi Neo,

Let us all know how you get on at the City Uni and if the CAA accept results.

When I did their tests they did not have the Holmes Wright, but did have a simulator. It is a plasma TV that they use for the PAPI simulator and they also do something like the HW and similar to Baynes. I found the "real" one at the CAA a lot harder.

I'm interested that the City Uni are still doing these tests, as they told me that they were submitting their data to the CAA at the end of April, so seems a bit odd that they are continuing. It might be worth asking them how things are going with the CAA???

Any how all the best and hope the results are good for you.

east_sider

Does anyone know if it is possible to do the FAA signal light test in the UK? Presumably I could contact a UK based FAA medical examiner and see if that is an option, once I've taken a FAA Class 1 initial also in the UK - and failed the colour test of course?

There is a list of FAA AMEs on the website here:

http://ame.cami.jccbi.gov/amelist.asp

ps Neo - welcome to the club.

TelBoy

east sider

You need a letter from the FAA to authorise the light signal test, it is not done through an AME.

In short I do not know if it can be done in the UK, my guess is probably not, (unless it can be done at a US military base?) but it is worth phoning the FAA to find out the exact process. You do need a restricted medical though before they will authorise it.

My sugestion is phone the FAA and get it direct from them. Phoning is probably better than email, you will find them very helpful.

Oh and also you only need a class 2 medical for CPL in the FAA way - they have three classes. One for ATP, Two for CPL, Three for PPL. The light signal test gives you a letter of evidance to act as the colour vision part of the exam and is good for any class medical. I did a class 3 for my PPL and can now go for class 1 with the letter.

Please let us all know what they say.

All the best mate. The Signal Test is the best bet - 95% pass rate - even me then fingers up to the CAA!

Neo_RS14

Hi audimatt,

I'm sorry to hear you faild the lanterns...I'm getting a bit worried how I'll do, as so many people are saying the lights are so far away and tiny

But, at least you had a go, and I'm sure you'll be fine to instruct. I can't remember exactly which ratings you need to be an instructor, but you'll be able to find out online, there's bags of info out there.

Good luck.

2close

Welcome to the loony bin Audimatt,

Good news! You can still be a PAID instructor.

The CAA will issue you with a Class 1 medical with deviations limiting you to No Public Transport (no passengers or freight) and Daytime Flying Only.

You can do an instructor's course on this and you can also do a CPL, however, all the night flying will have to be dual.

Your CPL / FI will thus be restricted to Daytime instruction only and of course it will be limited to the UK as the UK is the only JAA member state that permits a deviation for colour vision on a Class 1 medical.

2close

AlexEvans

Currently doing my NPPL and hoping to go on to convert to the PPL and then on to a CPL, provided I can get past the medical...

3.5 dipotres of asigmatism is holding me back...

Previously I (and the CAA) had come to the conclusion that LASIK was my only option but I have an interesting question.

Quote from the CAA:

JAR Class 1

The initial refractive error (correction) limit is +5/-6 dioptres. There is no myopic limit for revalidation/renewal. The astigmatism (distortion) and anisometropia (difference between the eyes) initial limits are 2 dioptres, but there are no limits for revalidation/renewal.
NOTE: contact lenses must be worn if the anisometropia exceeds 3 dioptres.


What is interesting to me is that someone mentioned above that if you already have an FAA class 1 medical then the CAA apply the renewal limits to your initial class 1 application. This would mean no limits apply!?

Surely this is too good to be true???

If someone knows for sure that the CAA apply renewal limits to your initial CAA class 1 medical examination if you already have an FAA class 1 then please let me/us know.

If this is the case then I'll be off to get my FAA class 1, presumably with no problems despite the fact that I do not intend to get any FAA licences, then get the previously unobtainable CAA class 1.

Surely this is too good to be true?

I will be a low hour NPPL holder, not an experienced FAA ATPL.

TelBoy

audimatt,

I'm sure 2close will back me up on this, but NO you cannot be a FO with CP4 colour vision deficiency. You can only do instructing and things like banner towing, glider towing etc. You CANNOT take passengers or freight for reward. Also you are restricted to daytime VFR - not a lot of good for an airline even if the regs would allow.

On the brighter side, your attitude is GREAT - keep flying and don't let the b get the better. Try looking at other JAA states for CV testing or the FAA way. There are many posts in this thread about these so I won't go into them.

Just a bit of inspiration. I had a PM from one of this forum members to say he failed all the CV tests everywhere. It took him 5 years but he did not give up and eventually got a pass and an unrestricted class 1. An inspiration to me at any rate.

Good luck to you mate, all the best.

2close

Very interesting question guys.

Strictly speaking the answer is No, you cannot fly Commercial Air Transport (CAT) aircraft, i.e. fare paying pax or freight, with the NPT restriction on your medical and you are thus restricted to aerial work, i.e. instructing, aerial photography, para pilot, glider tug pilot, banner towing, crop spraying.

However, there is a medical deviation that exists known as an Operational Multi-Crew Limitation (OML) which is provided to permit CPL holders to continue to fly CAT ops. The definition is thus:

‘Valid Only As Or With Qualified Co-Pilot’ Operational Multi-crew Limitation (OML). This prevents single pilot operations, but permits multi-pilot operations, for either a captain or co-pilot.’

It is normally issued to CAT pilots operating multi-crew aircraft who develop a minor medical problem which would prevent them flying solo but allows them to fly as a second member of a crew.

What is interesting is that there is nothing in JAR FCL 1.035 which states that the applicant for the OML MUST be undertaking CAT operations prior to having the OML applied to his licence / medical.

So, if you are issued with a CPL to allow you to undertake aerial work, what is wrong with later requesting that an OML be applied to your medical to permit you to fly CAT multi crew ops, provided that the other flight crew member holds an unrestricted medical? Nothing as far as I can see.

Therefore, technically, you could have your CPL issued for instructing, etc. then later apply for an OML to be issued to permit you to operate CAT.

However, the OML would only be valid in UK airspace as the UK is the only JAA member state that permits Class 1 medicals to hold deviations with regard to colour vision.

Furthermore, once that OML has been issued you cannot thereafter fly as an instructor as instructing requires you to be PIC.

Another problem may be that the UK, by virtue of FODCOM 2004/08, permits CAT operations in UK airspace to be operated by multi pilot crews where BOTH crew members hold OMLs. It was concluded after deliberation that it was highly unlikely that both pilots would suffer a debilitating condition simultaneously. Again, this only applies to UK airspace. However, this could not apply to both crew members being CVD (as this is a permanent condition) and therefore it may be decided that the problem would be unmanageable and that somewhere along the line a CAT operator is going to roster 2 x CVD crewmembers together - this may be deemed too much of a risk.

Lastly, whilst this may be technically feasible I have never heard of it being applied.

Sorry for the long winded response but thought I’d best explain the scenario as thoroughly as possible.

HTH

2close

TelBoy

Neo

Sorry about your results - it was much the same for me. I know what a hard hit is is, but don't give up. Remember there are outher JAA states and yes you should go to Gatwick to do the CV tests.

Just a point to think about before going to Gatwick. Go to an optician and get your eyes tested. I did this after failing at Gatwick and have found that although my eysight is "excellent" according to the optician 6/5 in both eyes, my left eye has a .25 difference and suggested glasses for reading. I might well get these glasses and ask the CAA if I can have a retest as it did "blurr" the lights a bit. (not sure if it will make any difference - but who knows). Also a good nights sleep, healthy food, excercise etc to make you feel 100% (again everyting I didn't do).

Remember also the FAA way with the tower light signals. I have passed this and have no colour vision restrictions for FAA medicals of ANY class. It sounds like our CVD is much the same, so you would be in with an excellent chance there.

All the best and keep flying mate