Astreus - Any Good
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jamestkirk – w.r.t. ‘If you work for the company that we are enquiring about, thats hardly going to happen.’
Well think again sunshine !
I think you'll find that hamrah has contributed a significant amount here upon PPRuNe, much of it for the benefit of wannabes at all levels.
Indeed I know of few other senior airline managers, never mind Operations Directors, that have done as much as he w.r.t. being open & honest about how the training and recruitment system works, and / or that try to help wannabes, and / or that even post here upon PPRuNe fullstop – and, in his alter ego as hamrah, John is well known for this ( might I suggest you do a search of his posts ).
Aside - Did you know that hamrah was once a wannabe himself ( he started out sweeping the hangar floor and washing aeroplanes ), and so too was Danny, and likewise PPRuNe Towers, and me, et al… and regardless of which airline people might work for, I think you’ll find that many of those who post here in wannabes only have wannabes best interests at heart.
We all remember, often with bitter advantage, what it was be like to be looking in from the outside..... and for those of you who seem to think that a 'long time' is having to wait a couple of years maybe ( after obtaining ones CPL the fATPL ) until you get paid pilot employment..... well, for my own experience, I started on the rocky road that is aviation in the mid 1980’s and it took well over a decade until I got my break ( when, I hasten to add, I was well in to my 30’s ) and it wasn’t for lack of trying either !…. wherein the person who rescued me from my despair was hamrah.
Whilst some of us do indeed presently work for Astraeus - just as we have worked for the same and for differing airlines - no matter what or whom we work for, we all have a genuine interest in providing both honest and forthright advice on matters pertaining to getting paid employment as a pilot – would you have it any other way ?
Indeed, if you look through the posts made, across many years here upon PPRuNe, by all the aforementioned people, you’ll see their message as been both clear and consistent.
With regard to self-funded type-ratings, be under no illusion that none of us like to see wannabes hocking themselves and / or prostituting themselves to get a foot on the aviation ladder – but to a greater or lesser extent the cause of this is driven by the effect of supply and demand wherein one can rest assured that just as soon as the pool of pilots dries-up and flights look as if they’ll be cancelled due to lack of drivers, then ( and only then ) will the tide turn in the wannabes favour.
Until that time you can expect the T’s & C’s of pilots to continue to be eroded and wannabes will continue to have to shell out substantial sums of money and / or take huge risks therein to join the professionals.
Ultimately of course, from your first trial lesson, to passing and maintaining a Class 1 medical, to passing all your exams and flying tests, to electing to do a self-funded type-rating, right through to obtaining and keeping paid employment as a pilot, the harsh reality is that:
“THERE ARE NO GUARANTEES WITH ANY OF IT !"
Well think again sunshine !
I think you'll find that hamrah has contributed a significant amount here upon PPRuNe, much of it for the benefit of wannabes at all levels.
Indeed I know of few other senior airline managers, never mind Operations Directors, that have done as much as he w.r.t. being open & honest about how the training and recruitment system works, and / or that try to help wannabes, and / or that even post here upon PPRuNe fullstop – and, in his alter ego as hamrah, John is well known for this ( might I suggest you do a search of his posts ).
Aside - Did you know that hamrah was once a wannabe himself ( he started out sweeping the hangar floor and washing aeroplanes ), and so too was Danny, and likewise PPRuNe Towers, and me, et al… and regardless of which airline people might work for, I think you’ll find that many of those who post here in wannabes only have wannabes best interests at heart.
We all remember, often with bitter advantage, what it was be like to be looking in from the outside..... and for those of you who seem to think that a 'long time' is having to wait a couple of years maybe ( after obtaining ones CPL the fATPL ) until you get paid pilot employment..... well, for my own experience, I started on the rocky road that is aviation in the mid 1980’s and it took well over a decade until I got my break ( when, I hasten to add, I was well in to my 30’s ) and it wasn’t for lack of trying either !…. wherein the person who rescued me from my despair was hamrah.
Whilst some of us do indeed presently work for Astraeus - just as we have worked for the same and for differing airlines - no matter what or whom we work for, we all have a genuine interest in providing both honest and forthright advice on matters pertaining to getting paid employment as a pilot – would you have it any other way ?
Indeed, if you look through the posts made, across many years here upon PPRuNe, by all the aforementioned people, you’ll see their message as been both clear and consistent.
With regard to self-funded type-ratings, be under no illusion that none of us like to see wannabes hocking themselves and / or prostituting themselves to get a foot on the aviation ladder – but to a greater or lesser extent the cause of this is driven by the effect of supply and demand wherein one can rest assured that just as soon as the pool of pilots dries-up and flights look as if they’ll be cancelled due to lack of drivers, then ( and only then ) will the tide turn in the wannabes favour.
Until that time you can expect the T’s & C’s of pilots to continue to be eroded and wannabes will continue to have to shell out substantial sums of money and / or take huge risks therein to join the professionals.
Ultimately of course, from your first trial lesson, to passing and maintaining a Class 1 medical, to passing all your exams and flying tests, to electing to do a self-funded type-rating, right through to obtaining and keeping paid employment as a pilot, the harsh reality is that:
“THERE ARE NO GUARANTEES WITH ANY OF IT !"
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Thanks Tony
...but it seems jamestkirk doesn't want the truth about Astraeus ( seeing as he hasn't taken the effort to learn to spell it properly).
In my position I have offered help and advice to lots of young people trying to get into aviation; Some on here, some by PM, and many through PPRuNe Seminars and other conferences.
I have never posted recommendations for Astraeus , if you care to look. I have pointed out what we have achieved, which I can back up
If you won't take responses from Astraeus Employees, what about people who have done courses with Astraeus? Are they " biased " as well?
Anyway, I offer the information freely. and if people don't want to believe it, they can always ignore it.
Riker, I am aware of ex AEU/Bond students with Easyjet, RYR, Jet2, BMIBaby, Skyblue, Air Asia and Ford Aviation. Some went shortly after completing their training, others went after some line training, and a few went after completing a summer contract.We are trying to get in touch with past students who wish to tell their story and put it on the Bond website. Watch this space
H
...but it seems jamestkirk doesn't want the truth about Astraeus ( seeing as he hasn't taken the effort to learn to spell it properly).
In my position I have offered help and advice to lots of young people trying to get into aviation; Some on here, some by PM, and many through PPRuNe Seminars and other conferences.
I have never posted recommendations for Astraeus , if you care to look. I have pointed out what we have achieved, which I can back up
If you won't take responses from Astraeus Employees, what about people who have done courses with Astraeus? Are they " biased " as well?
Anyway, I offer the information freely. and if people don't want to believe it, they can always ignore it.
Riker, I am aware of ex AEU/Bond students with Easyjet, RYR, Jet2, BMIBaby, Skyblue, Air Asia and Ford Aviation. Some went shortly after completing their training, others went after some line training, and a few went after completing a summer contract.We are trying to get in touch with past students who wish to tell their story and put it on the Bond website. Watch this space
H
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To recount my own experience wherein I, for one, would not now have several thousand hours of Boeing time had it not been for John exhibiting some amazing judgement in my respect.
I.e. during what I thought was probably my last realistic opportunity at obtaining airline pilot employment ( e.g. age versus experience issues, etc ) I was invited for a simulator assessment ( where John was the then Chief Pilot )
Needless to say, with what I perceived as the Sword of Damocles hanging over my head ( what with having substantially more than a decade of being a ‘wannabe’, to say nothing of having spent all the money, and having beggared myself in the process.... sound familiar ? ), on the day in question in the simulator I failed to deliver the required standard.
But John saw things differently, and ( to my continued amazement ) he invited me back for another go in a B737 simulator ( though this time, instead of it being described as an ‘assessment’, he put it to me that it was ‘training’ ).
Less than an hour later I’d landed a jet job ( and of which, to this day, I’m still pinching myself in somewhat disbelief
) wherein he surmised that the pressure / culmination of the years of toil was just too much to expect anybody to deliver their best and that I just needed a break from beating myself up and trying too hard; John was the one that gave me that chance; that is the measure of the man.
Veritably we all need that special somebody who is prepared to go the whole way ( and often beyond ), to give a bloke a chance; which in my experience of aviation is something that’s few and far between !
In closure, some of these people work at Astraeus and they certainly remember what it was like to be looking in from the outside – and we’ll certainly do our best to help as much as we can, but wherein much of what happens is similarly up to you and the injection of a fair measure of luck.
I.e. during what I thought was probably my last realistic opportunity at obtaining airline pilot employment ( e.g. age versus experience issues, etc ) I was invited for a simulator assessment ( where John was the then Chief Pilot )
Needless to say, with what I perceived as the Sword of Damocles hanging over my head ( what with having substantially more than a decade of being a ‘wannabe’, to say nothing of having spent all the money, and having beggared myself in the process.... sound familiar ? ), on the day in question in the simulator I failed to deliver the required standard.
But John saw things differently, and ( to my continued amazement ) he invited me back for another go in a B737 simulator ( though this time, instead of it being described as an ‘assessment’, he put it to me that it was ‘training’ ).
Less than an hour later I’d landed a jet job ( and of which, to this day, I’m still pinching myself in somewhat disbelief
) wherein he surmised that the pressure / culmination of the years of toil was just too much to expect anybody to deliver their best and that I just needed a break from beating myself up and trying too hard; John was the one that gave me that chance; that is the measure of the man.Veritably we all need that special somebody who is prepared to go the whole way ( and often beyond ), to give a bloke a chance; which in my experience of aviation is something that’s few and far between !
In closure, some of these people work at Astraeus and they certainly remember what it was like to be looking in from the outside – and we’ll certainly do our best to help as much as we can, but wherein much of what happens is similarly up to you and the injection of a fair measure of luck.
PPRuNe Knight in Shining Armour
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Tony, I don't disagreee with your sentiments, but the sad thing is that how benevolent John has been in the past has no bearing in today's market.
John, correct me if I'm wrong, but with a queue of wannabes ready to pay for a type rating, with the best will in the world you won't be inviting anyone along for a session as described by Tony above .
I remember the first PPRuNe seminar, when John stood at the front and said quite categorically never to pay for a type rating. I respected his opinion and I haven't nor will I. But sadly for me (and others) there are people who will.
The avaition world is all the more sad for it, imho.
John, correct me if I'm wrong, but with a queue of wannabes ready to pay for a type rating, with the best will in the world you won't be inviting anyone along for a session as described by Tony above .
I remember the first PPRuNe seminar, when John stood at the front and said quite categorically never to pay for a type rating. I respected his opinion and I haven't nor will I. But sadly for me (and others) there are people who will.
The avaition world is all the more sad for it, imho.
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Where can I get hold of Bond Aviation's website or info alike?
I went to the Astraeus website and went to Bond Aviation link but it only says it did Sales Force Development courses.
Where's the MCC/JOC Type Rating info?
Cheers
I went to the Astraeus website and went to Bond Aviation link but it only says it did Sales Force Development courses.
Where's the MCC/JOC Type Rating info?
Cheers
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Snigs,
You are quite right.
September 11th changed the world and our industry, but I don't think permanently. You must remember, before Sept. 11th there was huge growth in the market with GO, easyJet and Ryanair, all fairly young airlines in terms of their growth, and all recruiting and training people onto 737's. After Sep 11, there was a glut of qualified pilots in the marketplace. With the fast growing sectors now only taking type-rated pilots, there was huge pressure to gain a type rating as a means to gain employment. This continues even and now will do for quite some time
The costs and risks to airlines of recruiting non-type rated pilots are very high these days. It's a fact of life. Individuals are left with the choice of biding their time, or taking the plunge. The industry doesn't owe anyone a living, but they owe the banks a lot.
But remember, and Tony has repeated it often enough, there are no guarantees with any of it.
H
You are quite right.
September 11th changed the world and our industry, but I don't think permanently. You must remember, before Sept. 11th there was huge growth in the market with GO, easyJet and Ryanair, all fairly young airlines in terms of their growth, and all recruiting and training people onto 737's. After Sep 11, there was a glut of qualified pilots in the marketplace. With the fast growing sectors now only taking type-rated pilots, there was huge pressure to gain a type rating as a means to gain employment. This continues even and now will do for quite some time
The costs and risks to airlines of recruiting non-type rated pilots are very high these days. It's a fact of life. Individuals are left with the choice of biding their time, or taking the plunge. The industry doesn't owe anyone a living, but they owe the banks a lot.
But remember, and Tony has repeated it often enough, there are no guarantees with any of it.
H
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Geez, I wish Hamrah was the QF Chief Pilot. The industry could use a few more Hamrahs round the place.
If Puritan had applied to Qantas he would be back in GA quick smart. Worlds best practice and all that you know
If Puritan had applied to Qantas he would be back in GA quick smart. Worlds best practice and all that you know
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PLEASE READ...
This is a genuine post, I am in no way related to Astraeus other than I completed a Type rating in March with them on the B737.
Less than 8 months on, at this precise moment im sat in SkyEuropes briefing room with an hour to go before I report for my line check on the B737 to Barcalona.
Myself and my course alone are proof that the SSTR scheme works especially with the standard of training acheived at Astraeus. I can comment having seen over the last 2 months the standard from some other TRTO's around europe.
What else can I say apart from there was 16 of us on our course, of which 15 are now flying presently with such airlines as
SkyEurope ( myself and 2 other guys from Ast )
Excel,
Jet2,
Astraeus,
Air Asia,
BmiBaby,
Ryanair - they'd have you think this isnt true, but at this time I know of 5 mates currently online with Ryanair....
Cheers to all the TRI's, TRE's and groundschool staff at AEU and Bond.
Everyone have a excellent Xmas and good luck with the new year... especially if your looking for work.
b
Less than 8 months on, at this precise moment im sat in SkyEuropes briefing room with an hour to go before I report for my line check on the B737 to Barcalona.
Myself and my course alone are proof that the SSTR scheme works especially with the standard of training acheived at Astraeus. I can comment having seen over the last 2 months the standard from some other TRTO's around europe.
What else can I say apart from there was 16 of us on our course, of which 15 are now flying presently with such airlines as
SkyEurope ( myself and 2 other guys from Ast )
Excel,
Jet2,
Astraeus,
Air Asia,
BmiBaby,
Ryanair - they'd have you think this isnt true, but at this time I know of 5 mates currently online with Ryanair....
Cheers to all the TRI's, TRE's and groundschool staff at AEU and Bond.
Everyone have a excellent Xmas and good luck with the new year... especially if your looking for work.
b
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Ditto the above. Finished in March - completed 12 sectors of the line training and got lucky. You pays yer money and you takes your chances. All of the ex-AEU/Bond kids have received favourable reports at my firm due to the high standard of the training on the initial TR. On my course I believe all are sitting in the RHS (of a 737 
)
sB
)sB
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"PLEASE READ...
This is a genuine post"
Euch!...bail out - you're not the author of those junk emails from Nigeria that I keep getting, asking for a few grand in cash in exchange for fantastic returns; are you? Your writing style bears a striking similarity.
And theme for that matter
This is a genuine post"
Euch!...bail out - you're not the author of those junk emails from Nigeria that I keep getting, asking for a few grand in cash in exchange for fantastic returns; are you? Your writing style bears a striking similarity.
And theme for that matter
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Puritan and hamrah ; I have sent you a private message.
My thread was maybe, somewhat, sharply worded.
Hindsight is a wonderful educator.
Although, the replies after that were really helpful and has cetainly made me think about the next step forward.
Thanks everyone.
JTK
My thread was maybe, somewhat, sharply worded.
Hindsight is a wonderful educator.
Although, the replies after that were really helpful and has cetainly made me think about the next step forward.
Thanks everyone.
JTK
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An old roommate of mine did one of the first courses with Astreaus, he was very lucky to get a summer contract thereafter getting the much needed hours on type .. worked wonders for him and pretty much boosted his career.. he is today a happy man flying silver jets with J2.. :-) (He had a couple of years of turboprop experience)
After job hunting since 2001, I am now considering joining a 737 TR course in the new year. Based on my experience of 650h TT of that 195h light twins and no airline experience. Is getting rated on the 737 a wise move or the worst thing I could do, considering I will have 1 hour (6 landings) on type after the course? Hamrah what do you think?
After job hunting since 2001, I am now considering joining a 737 TR course in the new year. Based on my experience of 650h TT of that 195h light twins and no airline experience. Is getting rated on the 737 a wise move or the worst thing I could do, considering I will have 1 hour (6 landings) on type after the course? Hamrah what do you think?
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considering I will have 1 hour (6 landings) on type after the course?
I did the Astraeus course and sectors. Very good and professional TRTO. Unfortunately no job yet. Hopefully next year.
Merry X-mas
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Puritan,
Perhaps back in the 80's if you had marketed your tag line...
“THERE ARE NO GUARANTEES WITH ANY OF IT !"
...stuck it on the front of tee-shirts, stood outside OAT and Cabair and sold them for £15.99 each, you yourself could have paid for a type rating and got to where you are today, far sooner than, 'well over a decade', that you talk of...
DrP
Perhaps back in the 80's if you had marketed your tag line...
“THERE ARE NO GUARANTEES WITH ANY OF IT !"
...stuck it on the front of tee-shirts, stood outside OAT and Cabair and sold them for £15.99 each, you yourself could have paid for a type rating and got to where you are today, far sooner than, 'well over a decade', that you talk of...
DrP
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Dr. P70 – As is often said, “Hindsight is indeed a wonderful thing !” wherein my particular circumstances were a combined result of a serious economic recession, the demise of several very large UK airlines, a change in the regulations, poor timing and bad luck.
Geesh, I can still recall those halcyon days ( 1988 ? ) when it was strongly rumoured that even a monkey with a CPL/IR would find immediate employment with Big Airways – but alas those days are seemingly long gone.
That said, what I would like to market is the sticker that presently lives along the bottom of my #1 flight bag, i.e. ‘Sh1t Happens’ ( I kid you not ) !
wherein my particular circumstances were a combined result of a serious economic recession, the demise of several very large UK airlines, a change in the regulations, poor timing and bad luck.Geesh, I can still recall those halcyon days ( 1988 ? ) when it was strongly rumoured that even a monkey with a CPL/IR would find immediate employment with Big Airways – but alas those days are seemingly long gone.
That said, what I would like to market is the sticker that presently lives along the bottom of my #1 flight bag, i.e. ‘Sh1t Happens’ ( I kid you not ) !
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John and Tony (Hamrah and Puritan) how do you think you can be unbiased when you work for the company ? In very good positions ! New pilots want genuine opinions from this site . Are you still moderators as well ? Open and Honest . Happy Christmas ! I am sure you can still find out who this old colleague is .
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Hum.....Astraeus????Tell you a story....
I`ve done an A-320 type rating and I can tell you that the course was good because it`s all done at British Airways headquarters(Grond school) and simulators(with instructors from Iasco)(you can contact them directly and get better prices).
But......everything which depends from Astraeus is a ****.
We did all the course without manuals(but hearing promises everyday) and we just receive them because we pressed hard and we had to get annoy to receive them on the last day(just part of the manuals.From a total of 4 manuals I received 2 .The other two I had to make copies from friends who did their T/R`s in other schools)
As a foreigner I had to spend a lot of money making intl calls to speak with people who didn`t want to answer the phone because they couldn`t solve the problem .
During the last day I went to the Astraeus Mass (which they call headquarters) and maybe because I pressed so hard they made me to wait longer putting at risk my flight back home.
One more trick.....for those who want to get the AIRBUS T/R , YOU DON`T NEED TO DO EVERYTHING ON THE SAME PLACE. The base flight can be done separetely.There`s a corporate 319 CJ based in Lutton which is used to make Local/base flights at much better prices.
What I can tell you is that sometimes is better to pay a litte bit more than doing your T/R with Astraeus...
Definetly Astraeus doesn`t contribute to England beeing the Country it is...
Cheers...
But......everything which depends from Astraeus is a ****.
We did all the course without manuals(but hearing promises everyday) and we just receive them because we pressed hard and we had to get annoy to receive them on the last day(just part of the manuals.From a total of 4 manuals I received 2 .The other two I had to make copies from friends who did their T/R`s in other schools)
As a foreigner I had to spend a lot of money making intl calls to speak with people who didn`t want to answer the phone because they couldn`t solve the problem .
During the last day I went to the Astraeus Mass (which they call headquarters) and maybe because I pressed so hard they made me to wait longer putting at risk my flight back home.
One more trick.....for those who want to get the AIRBUS T/R , YOU DON`T NEED TO DO EVERYTHING ON THE SAME PLACE. The base flight can be done separetely.There`s a corporate 319 CJ based in Lutton which is used to make Local/base flights at much better prices.
What I can tell you is that sometimes is better to pay a litte bit more than doing your T/R with Astraeus...
Definetly Astraeus doesn`t contribute to England beeing the Country it is...
Cheers...
Last edited by A-3TWENTY; 22nd Dec 2004 at 05:52.
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mrs glum – Ok, well show us the bias then ? Show us where we’ve distorted the truth ? Please tell us where it is that we’ve not told it as honestly as we could ?
Being open & honest, yes we're both admins upon PPRuNe and have been so for six years. It's privilege we earned, mostly by providing the kind of common sense / honest advice that many who're looking to break into professional aviation yearn for – and we similarly remember when there was no PPRuNe
and the whole industry was somewhat shrouded in mystery and was often the hiding ground of many a charlatan and / or shoddy training & employment practices ( and which is something which PPRuNe, what with the open & honest approach we encourage, has helped to expose – and for which this site and those who run / maintain it have often been threatened with legal retribution, and worse – I kid you not ! ).
A-3TWENTY – Uhm, I can’t respond to your specific case ( though I have forwarded your post to the people who run the TRTO / Bond Aviation Solutions, for them to consider ) however what I can say is that during November I myself completed a transition from the B737 over to the B757.
The type-rating course, which five of my Astraeus colleagues and I undertook, was done through Bond with the ground-school conducted in our classrooms within the Alteon building and the simulator split between those housed at GECAT/LGW and BA/LHR.
Some what contrary to your experience, the very first thing that was given to all of us was a full set of systems and flying procedures manuals – and ( dare I say it, without wanting to appear biased
) very nice they are too ! ( see pic below ) - as well as one of the best organised training manuals that I’ve ever seen ( the importance of which is that allows the instructors to clearly and accurately confirm that they have covered and completed the relevant subjects, annotating your training file accordingly, such that when you want your type-rating issued all the paperwork is fully in order ).
I should maybe also point out that Astraeus 'line-pilots' do not normally get given paper-based manuals, i.e. we typically only have access to electronic copies via CD and / or our Intranet - so having these manuals is something of a rare treat.
Being open & honest, yes we're both admins upon PPRuNe and have been so for six years. It's privilege we earned, mostly by providing the kind of common sense / honest advice that many who're looking to break into professional aviation yearn for – and we similarly remember when there was no PPRuNe
and the whole industry was somewhat shrouded in mystery and was often the hiding ground of many a charlatan and / or shoddy training & employment practices ( and which is something which PPRuNe, what with the open & honest approach we encourage, has helped to expose – and for which this site and those who run / maintain it have often been threatened with legal retribution, and worse – I kid you not ! ).A-3TWENTY – Uhm, I can’t respond to your specific case ( though I have forwarded your post to the people who run the TRTO / Bond Aviation Solutions, for them to consider ) however what I can say is that during November I myself completed a transition from the B737 over to the B757.
The type-rating course, which five of my Astraeus colleagues and I undertook, was done through Bond with the ground-school conducted in our classrooms within the Alteon building and the simulator split between those housed at GECAT/LGW and BA/LHR.
Some what contrary to your experience, the very first thing that was given to all of us was a full set of systems and flying procedures manuals – and ( dare I say it, without wanting to appear biased
) very nice they are too ! ( see pic below ) - as well as one of the best organised training manuals that I’ve ever seen ( the importance of which is that allows the instructors to clearly and accurately confirm that they have covered and completed the relevant subjects, annotating your training file accordingly, such that when you want your type-rating issued all the paperwork is fully in order ).I should maybe also point out that Astraeus 'line-pilots' do not normally get given paper-based manuals, i.e. we typically only have access to electronic copies via CD and / or our Intranet - so having these manuals is something of a rare treat.
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A-3Twenty,
It is not usual for me to comment on posts in PPRUNE, however, your comments are so completely off the mark that I will make an exception.
First I am pleased you feel that “the course was good”. So to deal your comments, some of which I find amazing and are completely at odds with the feedback of almost all our other students. First, I must agree you late receiving one of your manuals, FCOM 4, but the rest you had immediately. Nevertheless given the very short notice at which you demanded this course, which had to include an integrated MCC, a good job was done to accommodate your needs. That was the reason the BA’s facilities were used, as Astraeus’ were full.
You were given a training programme that was nearly completely stable with only two changes; one was a simulator time change because of an error by one of the instructors. The other was down to you, at the end of the course, I don’t want to go into the reasons why as I don't wish to embarrass you, but, of course, that was why your flights were a problem. Amazingly it was possible to organise your needed alteration at less than 24hrs notice (a Sunday). Most TRTOs wouldn’t even have someone to talk to over the weekends.
Last but no means least, your base training has been organized independently so I don’t see your point.
Given the facts, I struggle to see the reason for your comments. Perhaps your previous dealings with another TRTO could shed some light on the matter.
Regards
LOB
It is not usual for me to comment on posts in PPRUNE, however, your comments are so completely off the mark that I will make an exception.
First I am pleased you feel that “the course was good”. So to deal your comments, some of which I find amazing and are completely at odds with the feedback of almost all our other students. First, I must agree you late receiving one of your manuals, FCOM 4, but the rest you had immediately. Nevertheless given the very short notice at which you demanded this course, which had to include an integrated MCC, a good job was done to accommodate your needs. That was the reason the BA’s facilities were used, as Astraeus’ were full.
You were given a training programme that was nearly completely stable with only two changes; one was a simulator time change because of an error by one of the instructors. The other was down to you, at the end of the course, I don’t want to go into the reasons why as I don't wish to embarrass you, but, of course, that was why your flights were a problem. Amazingly it was possible to organise your needed alteration at less than 24hrs notice (a Sunday). Most TRTOs wouldn’t even have someone to talk to over the weekends.
Last but no means least, your base training has been organized independently so I don’t see your point.
Given the facts, I struggle to see the reason for your comments. Perhaps your previous dealings with another TRTO could shed some light on the matter.
Regards
LOB
Last edited by lookoutbelow; 22nd Dec 2004 at 09:18.
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Interesting to see all the Astraeus/Bond employee's crawling out of the woodwork when there is a scent of discord.
puritan/crashdive do you remember this post you made?
It is interesting that you used to think it was a huge gamble, and interesting to remember a few years ago that a group of people who are now selling type ratings and have used PPRuNe to show case it all used to tell PPRuNe Seminars that buying a type rating is a Bad Idea as you learn from incorrect SOp's and generally self funded rating guys usually have had short cuts in their training. How do you spell hypocrit?
yes, you may scream at regular intervals that there are no guarantees with it all, but when the interest rates go up and people can't afford to take out a second mortgage anymore to pay for the gamble of a SSTR it wont be long before Bond wont be able to subsidise Astreaus anymore.
puritan/crashdive do you remember this post you made?
My personal opinion - and I'm pretty sure that Hamrah (JM), PPT (Robin), Captain PPRuNe (Danny), and numerous others will support this - is that self-sponsoring oneself through a jet type rating is a very risky undertaking !
Indeed it would be true to say that there is many an organisation that would have you part company with lots of your very hard earned money in return for that (supposedly) lucrative 'jet-qualified' addition to your license - HOWEVER having the rating is, I'm afraid, not enough.
E.g. (imho) Any reputable operation would be able to offer some level of 'line training' over and above the 'basic type rating'.
As to why ? Well, doing an intense ground school course, followed by the minimum amount of simulator, and a few tight ‘base-training’ circuits in the real aircraft ( all over a period of about 10 weeks, minimum ) does not make you a jet airline pilot !
It is crucial that the intense ground school/sim/etc is consolidated by an equally intense period and standardised period of 'Line Training' - and it is often for this reason alone that many airline Ops Directors / Chief Pilots will strongly caution ab-initio pilots against spending money on a self-sponsored type-rating(s), i.e. the whole thing is an enormous gamble - and so folks trained as such are often viewed with a somewhat jaundiced eye.
So, and unpalatable is it may seem, it might pay to remember that just because you have a (F)ATPL plus a shiny new (self -sponsored) jet type rating in your CPL license it does NOT guarantee you a job at the front of said same jet – indeed, imho, the thing that really seems to make the difference is that extra bit of 'sparkle' that you're able to 'bring to the party' (so to speak), i.e the stuff outside of the aviation arena.
Rgds,
Tony.
Indeed it would be true to say that there is many an organisation that would have you part company with lots of your very hard earned money in return for that (supposedly) lucrative 'jet-qualified' addition to your license - HOWEVER having the rating is, I'm afraid, not enough.
E.g. (imho) Any reputable operation would be able to offer some level of 'line training' over and above the 'basic type rating'.
As to why ? Well, doing an intense ground school course, followed by the minimum amount of simulator, and a few tight ‘base-training’ circuits in the real aircraft ( all over a period of about 10 weeks, minimum ) does not make you a jet airline pilot !
It is crucial that the intense ground school/sim/etc is consolidated by an equally intense period and standardised period of 'Line Training' - and it is often for this reason alone that many airline Ops Directors / Chief Pilots will strongly caution ab-initio pilots against spending money on a self-sponsored type-rating(s), i.e. the whole thing is an enormous gamble - and so folks trained as such are often viewed with a somewhat jaundiced eye.
So, and unpalatable is it may seem, it might pay to remember that just because you have a (F)ATPL plus a shiny new (self -sponsored) jet type rating in your CPL license it does NOT guarantee you a job at the front of said same jet – indeed, imho, the thing that really seems to make the difference is that extra bit of 'sparkle' that you're able to 'bring to the party' (so to speak), i.e the stuff outside of the aviation arena.
Rgds,
Tony.
yes, you may scream at regular intervals that there are no guarantees with it all, but when the interest rates go up and people can't afford to take out a second mortgage anymore to pay for the gamble of a SSTR it wont be long before Bond wont be able to subsidise Astreaus anymore.