T8 full pay or no pay
The ex KA guys I sit with are quite happy warming the 350's right chair on long haul, with zero interest in belting around the region in the left seat of a 320. Been there, done that. Why bother. The lifestyle is incomparable. Grab the popcorn, sit back and watch capacity stall at 60%, and wait for the Anal Warts next move. Suspect he might have to reach for the cheque book.
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Asia
Posts: 115
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
https://jobs.flightglobal.com
Click on your fleet. click on jobs, click on your email. Bingo.
In general, widebody CN ia around $19-23k a month USD tax paid. Positioned back to your home port. If you can understand you're there to do the job their way you'll get along just fine.
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: LA
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Get off that kool aid kid :-)
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: havetocallthereception
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Jesus, the undying belief in CX being the greatest employer ever never ceases to amaze me. Stockholm syndrome much.
https://jobs.flightglobal.com
Click on your fleet. click on jobs, click on your email. Bingo.
In general, widebody CN ia around $19-23k a month USD tax paid. Positioned back to your home port. If you can understand you're there to do the job their way you'll get along just fine.
https://jobs.flightglobal.com
Click on your fleet. click on jobs, click on your email. Bingo.
In general, widebody CN ia around $19-23k a month USD tax paid. Positioned back to your home port. If you can understand you're there to do the job their way you'll get along just fine.
What I did was checking those numbers myself by the way, and your statement is incorrect. We are of course not the "lowest paid wide body operator in Asia", far from it. Taiwan, Singapore, India, just to name a few out of many pay less. Actually, just look at the local competition in HK.
Now, to your claim there are contracts out there paying 19-23 after tax.
Let's for a moment forget the obvious, like no job security, less annual leave, cultural issues with local crew, maybe 5 or 10 sick days a year, long commute, jet lag in off days, Xiamen or Guangzhou for 20-30 days, many month of training on reduced pay, medical license issues, schooling ,pension or additional tax issues at your home. For the sake of your argument, let's put all that aside. What contract are you talking about?
Last edited by corporal klinger; 7th Sep 2023 at 11:20.
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Cathay tries to expand and they don't seem to find enough candidates.
And the equivalent of 70 hrs as basic pay would only be a pay increase on first sight compared to the old contracts.
There is still no HDP, 84 hour overtime, 1.5/2.5/3.5 factoring anymore.
As long as people fly at least 70 hours (and with the expansion people people might do that for quite some time) it would be the same COS18 contract and pay at the end, which means it wouldn't cost Cathay a single cent more - even with maximum hours pilots would lose 25% of pay compared to the old contract.
Once Cathay reaches saturation with regard to pilot numbers, they can change the threshold number again, at their sole discretion, according to COS18.
Paying Basic Pay at the equivalent of 70 hours might just be a short term fix to attract more pilots.
As I wrote in the other post:
Mid/Long term I believe that Cathay will get rid of all expats anyways and that they will lower the salaries to something like China local pay once they reached the saturation point of pilots.
So much for the kool aid.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: HKG
Posts: 387
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Same 5 people having their weekly little cry about CX.
PLEASE for the love of god next time you think about posting to PPRUNE just think: "Maybe I don't like my situation/CX/COS 18 or whatever it is, but ITS OK if other people do like it/are happy".
PLEASE just remember that next time you feel compelled to type another one of these crybaby posts.
carry on...
PLEASE for the love of god next time you think about posting to PPRUNE just think: "Maybe I don't like my situation/CX/COS 18 or whatever it is, but ITS OK if other people do like it/are happy".
PLEASE just remember that next time you feel compelled to type another one of these crybaby posts.
carry on...
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: LA
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's not logical to increase the threshold to 70 hours and still pay the present basic pay in the current environment.
Cathay tries to expand and they don't seem to find enough candidates.
And the equivalent of 70 hrs as basic pay would only be a pay increase on first sight compared to the old contracts.
There is still no HDP, 84 hour overtime, 1.5/2.5/3.5 factoring anymore.
As long as people fly at least 70 hours (and with the expansion people people might do that for quite some time) it would be the same COS18 contract and pay at the end, which means it wouldn't cost Cathay a single cent more - even with maximum hours pilots would lose 25% of pay compared to the old contract.
Once Cathay reaches saturation with regard to pilot numbers, they can change the threshold number again, at their sole discretion, according to COS18.
Paying Basic Pay at the equivalent of 70 hours might just be a short term fix to attract more pilots.
As I wrote in the other post:
Mid/Long term I believe that Cathay will get rid of all expats anyways and that they will lower the salaries to something like China local pay once they reached the saturation point of pilots.
So much for the kool aid.
Cathay tries to expand and they don't seem to find enough candidates.
And the equivalent of 70 hrs as basic pay would only be a pay increase on first sight compared to the old contracts.
There is still no HDP, 84 hour overtime, 1.5/2.5/3.5 factoring anymore.
As long as people fly at least 70 hours (and with the expansion people people might do that for quite some time) it would be the same COS18 contract and pay at the end, which means it wouldn't cost Cathay a single cent more - even with maximum hours pilots would lose 25% of pay compared to the old contract.
Once Cathay reaches saturation with regard to pilot numbers, they can change the threshold number again, at their sole discretion, according to COS18.
Paying Basic Pay at the equivalent of 70 hours might just be a short term fix to attract more pilots.
As I wrote in the other post:
Mid/Long term I believe that Cathay will get rid of all expats anyways and that they will lower the salaries to something like China local pay once they reached the saturation point of pilots.
So much for the kool aid.
70 hours = an extra $100K (approximate) inclusive of the extra PFund. Way more than CoS 08 pay for a Senior Capt at the same level. If he/she/them/they did 84 hours then thats an extra $140K approx
You just dont get it, still you hold on hoping for improved conditions. How many years has the pilot body been saying that better things are coming? I personally think CX are quite happy to be running the airline at reduced capacity at 100% load factors making a ton of cash. it makes business sense to grow it slowly and naturally as pilot numbers increase.
I am not trying to argue with you but if till now you still haven't woken up and smelt those roses then its pointless debating with you. Having said that, there is nothing I wish for more than for you all to get an increase in conditions. You all deserve that for sure.
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The one who doesn't get it is you.
As long as people fly more than 70 hrs It's exactly the same pay package for the company.
This 70 hour BS is just pure marketing spin (to advertise with higher guaranteed pay) to attract more pilots in my opinion as they are short of people and pilots fly at least 70 hrs per months anyways on the passenger fleets.
With regards to the 747 - I doubt that they will use 70 hrs as a basis for a new threshold as they are 'overstaffed' and it wouldn't make sense anyways.
The target hours on the 747 are like 650 hours per year, wich is way less than the 70 hours per month.
My assumption is that CK was talking about that passengers fleets WRT the 70 hours.
I guess they will increase the threshold for the freighter to let's say around 55 hours.
On another note:
There is absolutely no way with COS18 to get even close to COS08.
Flying the maximum of 900 hrs per year is still 40% short of my old pay on COS08 (including housing).
And I am not hoping for improved conditions.
First of all I wrote it a few times already that I believe in the mid to long term Cathay will reduce the package to local Mainland China level.
And second of all I resigned quite some time ago.
Capice ?
As long as people fly more than 70 hrs It's exactly the same pay package for the company.
This 70 hour BS is just pure marketing spin (to advertise with higher guaranteed pay) to attract more pilots in my opinion as they are short of people and pilots fly at least 70 hrs per months anyways on the passenger fleets.
With regards to the 747 - I doubt that they will use 70 hrs as a basis for a new threshold as they are 'overstaffed' and it wouldn't make sense anyways.
The target hours on the 747 are like 650 hours per year, wich is way less than the 70 hours per month.
My assumption is that CK was talking about that passengers fleets WRT the 70 hours.
I guess they will increase the threshold for the freighter to let's say around 55 hours.
On another note:
There is absolutely no way with COS18 to get even close to COS08.
Flying the maximum of 900 hrs per year is still 40% short of my old pay on COS08 (including housing).
And I am not hoping for improved conditions.
First of all I wrote it a few times already that I believe in the mid to long term Cathay will reduce the package to local Mainland China level.
And second of all I resigned quite some time ago.
Capice ?
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: LA
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I resigned 2 years ago and very happy here back home in the US. Quite a few are leaving to go back to CX as we have been messed around a bit with commands.
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: one country, one system
Age: 55
Posts: 484
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oh no, I hope PW doesn't read this. So first only "the strong" leave and then they come back to join "the weak" again, or how does that work now?
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Lonely planet
Posts: 74
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With people like Fac6 coming back to CX, is demonstrating to CX management that COS18 is suffice! Forget about ever getting better T&Cs.
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: LA
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Australia
Posts: 330
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Who exactly is coming back? Surely they are either unemployed or coming back as CN4 because over the SHORT term they can make more coin.
Younger crew or ex FOs shouldn’t be coming back because they can have a career and lifestyle. Anyone got the demographics?
Younger crew or ex FOs shouldn’t be coming back because they can have a career and lifestyle. Anyone got the demographics?
Join Date: Jun 2022
Location: Cern
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: HKG
Posts: 387
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The based crew with PR also lost their sick leave (except for the Canadians).
If you think the last GMA was bad, be warned, there is worse to come.
Join Date: Jun 2022
Location: Cern
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
