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Cathay Pacific imploding.

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Cathay Pacific imploding.

Old 11th Jul 2023, 12:03
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Cathay Pacific imploding.

Will the top brass of CX rather cancel flights than acknowledge the lack of workforce (both pilots and cabin crew)? They are working their pilots and cabin crew to the bone, putting bandages on all the aircraft because lack of engineers, and crew control seem to be over the job too. I guess it's difficult to get flights into the air when you have no crew....... In the meantime, both pilots and cabin crew are spineless to stand up to the big bosses.

Let's get some popcorn.
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Old 11th Jul 2023, 15:59
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Originally Posted by herewego75
Will the top brass of CX rather cancel flights than acknowledge the lack of workforce (both pilots and cabin crew)? They are working their pilots and cabin crew to the bone, putting bandages on all the aircraft because lack of engineers, and crew control seem to be over the job too. I guess it's difficult to get flights into the air when you have no crew....... In the meantime, both pilots and cabin crew are spineless to stand up to the big bosses.

Let's get some popcorn.
We have enough staff to fulfil our schedule. We have hired 800 cadets. We will be at 70% of pre covid levels by year out. 100% in 2024. Our employees are more engaged this year compared to last year. The package is competitive. We have plenty of trainers. We listen to our employees and offer schedule or better. We will be doing another employee survey soon.

What more do you want? Nothing to see here!
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Old 11th Jul 2023, 16:18
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Originally Posted by RAT Management
We have enough staff to fulfil our schedule. We have hired 800 cadets. We will be at 70% of pre covid levels by year out. 100% in 2024. Our employees are more engaged this year compared to last year. The package is competitive. We have plenty of trainers. We listen to our employees and offer schedule or better. We will be doing another employee survey soon.

What more do you want? Nothing to see here!
You had me in the first half.
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Old 11th Jul 2023, 18:01
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'If you don't like it, leave'

- spoken at a recent fleet forum

I believe this it the attitude of 3rd floor managers who managed to live without their family for over a years time over covid, totally devoid of compassion for anyone not as dead-set on career and actually believe life is worth living for reasons other than money and 'status'.
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Old 11th Jul 2023, 18:27
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It's not just CX that's imploding. Though it does have it's own unique issues, including horrendous management and planning over the past few years, CX is also caught in the political and social changes that are turning Hong Kong into a global backwater.
Will the last person (non-mainlander) to leave please turn out the lights...
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Old 12th Jul 2023, 00:49
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I disagree. Cathay will see strong growth and high profits over the next decades. The strategy of cutting costs permanently and recruiting at these new conditions will work, unfortunately.
The reality is that our industry is not at the level it once was, smart people select academic careers, the rest does not expect nor demand A scale. Cadets will be people who choose Cathay over some lower-middle management job with even more miserable pay and conditions. They will additionally increasingly come from low wage countries. China's youth unemployment rate is massive, this surplus will further fuel the supply side, wages will stay low.

Last edited by corporal klinger; 12th Jul 2023 at 01:25.
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Old 12th Jul 2023, 02:48
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Originally Posted by corporal klinger
I disagree. Cathay will see strong growth and high profits over the next decades.
I'll take that bet.
I believe you are failing to realize the number of international transiting passengers who are choosing other major Asian airports for their transit between North America and other points in Asia. This has historically been CX's prime market but many of us who travel regularly between Asia and North America no longer feel comfortable -- or secure -- transiting via HKG. The statistics and trends in the past year (as we've come out of Covid) show exactly that.
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Old 12th Jul 2023, 03:22
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Cathay Pacific is a training airline and nothing more. The majority of the pilot workforce are planning to leave as they cannot afford to live in HK with the package offered. The airline is so short of crew that they are rostering to the absolute limits, asking crew to work on days off and on leave. The only way to fix this mess is to go on strike, there is no better time than now but of course that would require a unified workforce.
You have nobody to blame but yourselves, this bully would fold like a cheap suit if you just had the balls.
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Old 12th Jul 2023, 04:04
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Originally Posted by grizzled
I'll take that bet.
The statistics and trends in the past year (as we've come out of Covid) show exactly that.

https://www.hongkongairport.com/en/m...e/2023/pr_1648


Originally Posted by Dilbert68
Cathay Pacific is a training airline and nothing more. The majority of the pilot workforce are planning to leave as they cannot afford to live in HK with the package offered. .
Some Western expats will leave, the rest will stay.
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Old 12th Jul 2023, 05:49
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Dont worry, a lot of pilots waiting to come. Leave if you like. hahahahaha......
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Old 12th Jul 2023, 07:26
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Originally Posted by herewego75
Will the top brass of CX rather cancel flights than acknowledge the lack of workforce (both pilots and cabin crew)? They are working their pilots and cabin crew to the bone, putting bandages on all the aircraft because lack of engineers, and crew control seem to be over the job too. I guess it's difficult to get flights into the air when you have no crew....... In the meantime, both pilots and cabin crew are spineless to stand up to the big bosses.

Let's get some popcorn.

Why don't we do this, just write down how many hours you did last month or even the last 6 months, we're pilots we know to the exact decimal... And this is the hours you write in your logbook. Will be very interesting to know these figures.
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Old 12th Jul 2023, 10:49
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Originally Posted by cygnet78
Dont worry, a lot of pilots waiting to come. Leave if you like. hahahahaha......

spoken like a true expat hating local climbing the slippery pole. Keep going up youíll be DFO soon.
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Old 12th Jul 2023, 23:10
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Originally Posted by cygnet78
Dont worry, a lot of pilots waiting to come. Leave if you like. hahahahaha......
No, not pilots, schools kids. Plenty of school kids wanting to join. Big difference. A pilot would be ready for command in a couple of years. A kid fresh out of school will take 10 years to train, then get the required 4000 hour minimum required for a CX command, whilst logging seat time only, as required when sitting in a Cathay jet. And the historic 37% upgrading to captain turns your 800 into 296. High 5's all round in the board room may have been a touch premature. I care not. Sorry, just don't.
Don't even get me started on using the pus box narrow body as it should be as a first step for FO or Command upgrade, then moving onto a wide body. No we'll have a prison fleet, where you get sent with no option or choice or exit. Hang on, there is always an exit. Don't let the door hit you on the arse on the way out.
Not quite the workers paradise.
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Old 13th Jul 2023, 00:20
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RAT!!!!

Never a more true word said. Nailed it.

b.
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Old 13th Jul 2023, 00:28
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Whatever happened to "The Management" ? Thoroughly enjoyed his posts. Hope retirement is treating you well.

b.
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Old 13th Jul 2023, 02:06
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Originally Posted by boocs
Whatever happened to "The Management" ? Thoroughly enjoyed his posts. Hope retirement is treating you well.

b.
I think heís much happier now heís not reading these forums thatís for sure.
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Old 13th Jul 2023, 05:06
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I believe you are failing to realize the number of international transiting passengers who are choosing other major Asian airports for their transit between North America and other points in Asia.
I'm one of those passengers. CX used to be my favourite airline, when flying trans-Pacific from Vancouver. Now I choose any other Asian transit point, excepting Beijing.
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Old 13th Jul 2023, 07:13
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Leave, you whinging imbeciles.
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Old 13th Jul 2023, 11:54
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Except there is no implosion.

https://www.reuters.com/business/aer...23-2023-06-23/



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Old 13th Jul 2023, 15:26
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So sad to see what has happened at CX.

Some numbskull decided that Covid was a great way to show those pesky pilots who’s the boss (and the economic experts) by savaging positions, bases, salaries and conditions.

Just like the expert fuel hedging they did some years ago.

Now the whole shebang is collapsing (in spite of sycophant’s takes like Will IB Fayed) and they only have themselves to blame. Trying to recruit the same pilots they dismissed back and trying to salvage the mess they made with their appalling treatment of pilots in the midst of a global pilot shortage was yet another example of stupid, vindictive decision-making. Cramming flying training of inexperienced newbies into ridiculously low hour schedules seems a Swiss-cheese problem staring everyone right in the face.

Certainly a slightly more challenging task for management, given the changed political situation but CX needs capable leaders like Sutch and Eddington of old, rather than the evidently inept folks atop CX City now.

Sadly, suspect CX will be the Saudia or Alitalia of HK. A relic destroyed by incompetence.
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